Deer Movement Myth Dispelled

[growalot]

I'm posting off my own pics and I use paint to down size...never had a problem until now. OH well ....

[NFA-ADK]

I agree to a point.  I do not think it would have an effect of pushing all the deer out.  Each deer is different and can react to the situation in different ways.  Some doe might run for the hills, buck might stay close to cover hoping the dogs stay away and only move when pushed.  Can some bucks leave the area sure they can. 

 

Can deer become accustom to people yes!  We see it in urban settings.  The question of them reacting to dogs is up for debate.  I would think if the dogs are run often they would get use to them and not see them as a threat but it might take them a while to figure this out, they will evaluate each threat with how much energy they have to use to get away from that possible issue. 

 

Would I worry about this on my land, no.  As long as it was done often I do believe the deer would realize that those dogs present little danger.  You would be welcomed on my land as long as you did not start around opening day.  If you could take down a few yotes you would be welcomed back every year!  The benefit would help the deer more than harm IMO. 

[Tacti_Steve]

I thank you for the invitation! Unfortunately I am on the other end of the state from Long Island. I don't usually have a problem taking about a yote a month. Where I am I've had to stop skinning coons in the woods because the yotes figured out there would be meat left over and started attacking my hounds while they were tree'd. I had a pack one time try to take the coon while I was skinning it. I carry a 22 mag pistol now just for them. 

[skully]

now when the dogs were young before trained properly they use to run the deer and forget about it.  They would run for miles.

[Tacti_Steve]

Not mine. Anyone that does it for real uses Garmin GPS shock collars. I know real quick if they're running deer. My pups do it maybe twice and they're done.

www.HuntingTactical.com

Modern Gear for Modern Hunters

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[skully]

Yea this was 30 yrs ago........  No such thing. 

[Doc]

The question of them reacting to dogs is up for debate.  I would think if the dogs are run often they would get use to them and not see them as a threat but it might take them a while to figure this out, they will evaluate each threat with how much energy they have to use to get away from that possible issue. 

I would guess this would wind up depending on whether the deer has had a history with deer-chasing dogs (or possibly even coyotes). I'm sure they soon realize that a pack of dogs (or coyotes) can be a relentless pursuit that they have to take seriously. I have seen deer that have encountered dogs Sometimes they elude them, but not until they find out how difficult it can be. And sometimes have the chunks of meat missing from their rump to remind them. And occasionally the results are even more devastating.

 

It all comes down to the fact that the deer have no idea what motives the dogs have in mind when they hear them chasing after a coon or whatever. They don't understand dog talk, and likely don't stick around to find out ..... lol.

[Tacti_Steve]

I'm not saying that Deer don't spook off. They generally do once I get about 10-15 yards from them. My point is it does not impact the overall Deer movements. The Deer will return rather quickly. And a Deer the next day doesn't care that the property smells like hound dog. My main point is allowing a hound hunter into the property is not going to hurt your Deer hunting. Statistically it might even help it. 

[nyantler]

Deer movement might be affected temporarily from a one time or occasional hound hunt... it would take a consistent interruption by the hounds to change the long term activity of whitetails in the area. The only way you are going to permanently disrupt the deer pattern is if they can never feel comfort staying in the area. Even heavy hunting each year only displaces the deer some what for that season... it is highly likely that everything will return to normal after the season and into the following season. Good deer habitat is just that, good deer habitat. If there is good food source and cover they will always find their way back to their regular routine in that habitat.

[Jeremy K]

If you spook a deer enough times it will find a new place to set up shop.

[Doc]

I don't know how I would feel about someone hunting with hounds on the night before in an area that I was going to try to deer hunt the next day. I think I would be against it. Personally, I try to minimize my own intrusions into a bucks stomping grounds, and do all I can to make him think he's got the whole area to himself. Is that necessary? ..... I don't know. It is just one of those things that seems to make some sense given the mindset of adult bucks. I'm sure a guy could come to my house with a copy of this study, and I still would refuse permission for him to run his hounds through a sanctuary that I had been so fussy about avoiding myself.

[Tacti_Steve]

If you spook a deer enough times it will find a new place to set up shop.

This my friend is what the study and myself have proved to be untrue. If you spook a Deer enough times without harming them they will stop spooking. Otherwise you wouldn't have Deer living in my neighbors backyard or at parks where there are constantly people. 

[Tacti_Steve]

I don't know how I would feel about someone hunting with hounds on the night before in an area that I was going to try to deer hunt the next day. I think I would be against it. Personally, I try to minimize my own intrusions into a bucks stomping grounds, and do all I can to make him think he's got the whole area to himself. Is that necessary? ..... I don't know. It is just one of those things that seems to make some sense given the mindset of adult bucks. I'm sure a guy could come to my house with a copy of this study, and I still would refuse permission for him to run his hounds through a sanctuary that I had been so fussy about avoiding myself.

The problem here is that going into the property is not consistent enough. Sure allowing someone in right before opening night never have been in there is going to disturb the area a little. But consistently they would have no impact. You are entitled to your opinion. It's your land. Last night I walked 15-20 yards from two Does. I just kept walking and they just watched me go by.

[growalot]

Just go to Ithaca...or search some of the suburban buck pics people here have posted. That said though...even I will limit movement once summer buck groups break up. The boys roaming looking for doe haven't necessarily been anywhere near my place all summer or near as much activity. Though my cams have shown time and again.....them walking, feeding and bedding in areas of high activity..ie...the goat barn, garden, around farm/construction equipement.

Edited January 17, 2016 by growalot

[Berniez]

A few years ago three of us and 2 dogs went into a 5 acre swamp (in brush so thick visibility in most places is under 15 feet.)  We hunted this swamp chasing rabbits, pheasants and grouse for over an hour. There was quite a lot of shooting/laughing/talking as we walked out of it with 3 rabbits  and 4 pheasants.  As we exited and started to walk out the dogs jumped another rabbit who sought safety in the tangled morass we had just left.  The dogs ran the rabbit around that swamp for 10 more minutes. It was after all this disturbance/ barking/ shooting. that we saw 5 does sneeking away and discretely exiting the swamp using a scrubby swale as a path taking them to another brush-lot on the property.

While anecdotal that convinced me that the deer somehow knew we were small game hunting and that dogs, guns and laughter didn’t bother then in the least, if they think they are not the target of the disturbance.They did not want to leave the swamp but we finally disturbed them enough to slowly, without panic, move 300 yards away. 

After that I have no problem when a hunter asks to run their dogs for coons or coyote on my property. (Most don’t because I 88 is real close.).

[turkeyfeathers]

Just go to Ithaca...or search some of the suburban buck pics people here have posted. That said though...even I will limit movement once summer buck groups break up. The boys roaming looking for doe haven't necessarily been anywhere near my place all summer or near as much activity. Though my cams have shown time and again.....them walking, feeding and bedding in areas of high activity..ie...the goat barn, garden, around farm/construction equipement.

Every summer we go to Ithaca. Every summer at all times of the day even during the hottest temps there are deer(  wearing their collars) standing up on hind legs around someones Subaru (car of choice in Ithaca) eating tree leaves or their shrubs. I mean everywhere. Every year I stop in awe as we don't get that domesticated deer around here

Edited January 17, 2016 by turkeyfeathers

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Deer movement might be affected temporarily from a one time or occasional hound hunt... it would take a consistent interruption by the hounds to change the long term activity of whitetails in the area. The only way you are going to permanently disrupt the deer pattern is if they can never feel comfort staying in the area. Even heavy hunting each year only displaces the deer some what for that season... it is highly likely that everything will return to normal after the season and into the following season. Good deer habitat is just that, good deer habitat. If there is good food source and cover they will always find their way back to their regular routine in that habitat.

So you would say that if you replaced the word Dogs with the word Coyotes in your statement the words you speak would still ring true???

[growalot]

You have noticed many of my spots I have been setting up, are rather close to the house...barns ect...Also I have talked and shown pics  I have taken of the deer feeding and bedding right next to the dogs kennel and our deck...I have mention it is the coyotes activity that has moved the deer closer to the house and next to the kennel/run...They have gotten very use to the boys barking and smell...our activity here and they do know it's a safe zone from the coyotes that are bothered by the dogs..I have taken pics and posted here of two buck fighting 15 yrds off the side of the kennel run. Most of my best buck pics I have taken right off our deck as they walk past the kennel and me..mature buck.

Edited January 17, 2016 by growalot

[Tacti_Steve]

So you would say that if you replaced the word Dogs with the word Coyotes in your statement the words you speak would still ring true???

Yes and No because yotes are a predator of them. The yotes give chase. So while they'd be less inclined to watch them go by yotes won't change their pattern. I've seen them in the same field before the deer just keep an eye on them.

www.HuntingTactical.com

Modern Gear for Modern Hunters

[email protected]

[nyantler]

So you would say that if you replaced the word Dogs with the word Coyotes in your statement the words you speak would still ring true???

Nice try... not even the same thing... one is a natural part of the habitat... the other is not.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Nice try... not even the same thing... one is a natural part of the habitat... the other is not.

Bullsh!t...You keep an overpopulation of yotes on your property and they will put a damper on your deer herd fast.Not just their movement but their whole being. You think those deer give a rats behind that one dog has a strap around its neck and one does not? Wrong.

 

Truth is yotes will do it as much or more, Been there done that with both dogs .Before there were any dogs ran after yotes, There were no deer!   Yotes now gone and deer are here, Hunting dogs now a regular thing a few times a year and deer are still here.

[nyantler]

Bullsh!t...You keep an overpopulation of yotes on your property and they will put a damper on your deer herd fast.Not just their movement but their whole being. You think those deer give a rats behind that one dog has a strap around its neck and one does not? Wrong.

 

Truth is yotes will do it as much or more, Been there done that with both dogs .Before there were any dogs ran after yotes, There were no deer!   Yotes now gone and deer are here, Hunting dogs now a regular thing a few times a year and deer are still here.

No such thing as an overpopulation of coyotes... the family group is only as big as the habitat will allow

[Four Season Whitetail's]

No such thing as an overpopulation of coyotes... the family group is only as big as the habitat will allow

Riiiight....Its obvious that you have never seen a coyote overpopulation with a number of family groups on the same piece of turf. So what do you think happens to those dogs after they have decimated say 1000 acres of every living animal by either eating them or by just running them clear out of the county? Or Both!

[growalot]

Lets see if this worked...here is the wild turkey flock that let me walk around them taking pics...BTW No I do not feed any wild animals with any thing but food plots and natural fruiting trees and brush plantings.....and as you can see this was the road side at the end of our drive. Man I had to go through 110 pages of pics deleting things to post those Thanks Eddie..... not even close to being done...I post a lot of pics...I seem to have to show more "proof" than at a boarder crossing...  

 

Point is.... animals in different areas....  at different times, do not react the same...painting wild life reactions with a broad stroke just leaves a blurred picture in general.

[Tacti_Steve]

Considering one of the hound hunting activities I'm talking about is hunting yotes with hounds what we are discussing here is not the same thing. In your scenario they don't run them out. They eat them. In my scenario the hound runs by and doesn't give chase to the Deer. Your "situation" is unchecked overpopulation. That is not what we are discussing here. We are discussing the impact on Deer movement by allowing people to run dogs on other game.