HERE COMES THE GUN LAWS

[Culvercreek hunt club]

20 hours ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

 and those professionals should have the ability to deny a gun buyer if they see fit.
 

So becasue they don't like the look of someone they should be able to deny a purchase to a person that can pass the required checks?

[Buckmaster7600]

So becasue they don't like the look of someone they should be able to deny a purchase to a person that can pass the required checks?

If he has a justifiable reason not to absolutely. What actual gun shop would turn away business just to turn it away? If an owner was a racists he wouldn't be in business long. But if someone comes in with bloodshot eyes acting very nervous etc etc the gun shop has to sell the gun if the individual passes the nics check.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Culvercreek hunt club]

1 minute ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

If he has a justifiable reason not to absolutely. What actual gun shop would turn away business just to turn it away? If an owner was a racists he wouldn't be in business long. But if someone comes in with bloodshot eyes acting very nervous etc etc the gun shop has to sell the gun if the individual passes the nics check.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm with you. It just gets me a tad nervous turning over decision ability to others. It's hard to see a need when we are thinking about us making the purchases. 

[bugsNbows]

2 hours ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

If he has a justifiable reason not to absolutely. What actual gun shop would turn away business just to turn it away? If an owner was a racists he wouldn't be in business long. But if someone comes in with bloodshot eyes acting very nervous etc etc the gun shop has to sell the gun if the individual passes the nics check.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Actually, no. A gunshop can refuse the sale. Whether they do or not, that's another question.

[philoshop]

15 hours ago, greg54 said:

Jimmy Kimmel is an A#@Hole

He's a Leftist tool who is paid to be...well, a Leftist tool. It doesn't matter to him, his viewers, or his sponsors and benefactors that he's wrong about nearly everything, as long as he promotes the Leftist agenda.

I would LOVE to see Kimmel discuss something with Tucker Carlson, Laura Ingraham, Dinesh D'Souza, or just about anyone with an actual functioning brain. Kimmel wouldn't fall to the floor and cry, of course, because he doesn't actually believe in or care about what he says, but it would be entertaining. What's scary is that he has an audience that believes him.

[TACC]

If he has a justifiable reason not to absolutely. What actual gun shop would turn away business just to turn it away? If an owner was a racists he wouldn't be in business long. But if someone comes in with bloodshot eyes acting very nervous etc etc the gun shop has to sell the gun if the individual passes the nics check.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I disagree, I have been present 2 different times in gun shops when owners refused to let people even look at the firearm, even prior to a sale, told them as much. One was higher than a kite and I was almost gagging on the smell of the Marijuana on him, the other was about 7 sheets to the wind drunk. Both were asked to leave the premises, and argued they had money , didn't matter.

Sent from my SM-G900T3 using Tapatalk

[chrisw]

Actually, no. A gunshop can refuse the sale. Whether they do or not, that's another question.

This is exactly right. The FFL has the right to refuse ANY firearms sale regardless if they pass a NICS check. I was a firearms supervisor for 5 years and any retailer will support the decision not to proceed if they suspect anything odd... I've done it several times and my associates have done it. One Example: we had an old lady come in to purchase 5 Mossberg JIC shotguns. If that's not a red flag enough, I subtly questioned her, she told me she wanted 5 of them so she could have one in every room of the house. Another red flag. When I handed her the gun she didn't want to even handle it. Another red flag. I declined the sale and she got super pissed.... She left without a firearm. 3 days later the FBI called wanting to know her information, turns out she was buying them legally then selling them to people who couldn't legally obtain them.


Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[chrisw]

So becasue they don't like the look of someone they should be able to deny a purchase to a person that can pass the required checks?

I can tell you I've sold thousands of firearms and had plenty of A Holes as customers but never denied anyone other than sketchy answers or information. So if I go into buy a gun and I'm making weird statements to the salesman and acting suspicious you think by law he should HAVE to sell me the gun?? No.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[chrisw]

I also sold a 10GA single shot to a gentleman years ago who wasn't suspicious acting per se... But he was clueless to firearms and honestly gave me a weird vibe but nothing to say he wasn't just an awkward fella, that's not illegal. Well I hate to say I also got a call from the police department a few weeks later and 2 officers came to ask me questions about the actions of the individual at the point of sale, the gentleman took his own life with that very firearm I sold him. Now there's no way of knowing what someone's intent is fully but some things can be stopped, unfortunately this wasn't the case.... I will say most denials are a spouse trying to buy a firearm for a significant other or their son/daughter. In these cases we would not sell them to the person if their son daughter was old enough to buy their own firearm, or if it was a spouse who was also of legal age... That's the LAW. It's called STRAW SALE. We would sell them a gift card for the exact amount of the purchase and the person would return and fill out their own 4473. The FBI will also send agents into stores and give this information to the sales associate blatantly and if the sale is completed the company gets a hefty fine.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I can tell you I've sold thousands of firearms and had plenty of A Holes as customers but never denied anyone other than sketchy answers or information. So if I go into buy a gun and I'm making weird statements to the salesman and acting suspicious you think by law he should HAVE to sell me the gun?? No.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

I get it. I understand it. I am sure you have a grasp on it. But I don't feel comfortable with some of the clueless A holes I have seen behind the counter of places like Gander and F&S or Walmart having any clue what "suspicious" and what weird statements are.

[Buckmaster7600]

I get it. I understand it. I am sure you have a grasp on it. But I don't feel comfortable with some of the clueless A holes I have seen behind the counter of places like Gander and F&S or Walmart having any clue what "suspicious" and what weird statements are.

This is my exact point, and why I don't think guns should be sold at box stores.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[chrisw]

This is my exact point, and why I don't think guns should be sold at box stores.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's very foolish for you to assume that because someone works in a "box" store that they are somehow less competent than someone in a mom and pop shop. Stupid or I'll informed doesn't have boundaries, including store walls, box or not. I couldn't even begin to tell you the number of people that came in thinking they knew something only to accuse everyone in the store of being ignorant, meanwhile you have 3 guys with 50+ years of firearms experience/training telling them they're not right. The coin has 2 sides also...

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[Culvercreek hunt club]

8 hours ago, chrisw said:

It's very foolish for you to assume that because someone works in a "box" store that they are somehow less competent than someone in a mom and pop shop. Stupid or I'll informed doesn't have boundaries, including store walls, box or not. I couldn't even begin to tell you the number of people that came in thinking they knew something only to accuse everyone in the store of being ignorant, meanwhile you have 3 guys with 50+ years of firearms experience/training telling them they're not right. The coin has 2 sides also...

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk
 

I don't think it is foolish if his personal experiences prove that out. Mine do. Far more often than not the ones at the counter in the big box stores are not qualified to give advice that I hear them giving. I have butted my nose in before when I clearly heard them telling a customer something that was incorrect. 

[chas0218]

11 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

I get it. I understand it. I am sure you have a grasp on it. But I don't feel comfortable with some of the clueless A holes I have seen behind the counter of places like Gander and F&S or Walmart having any clue what "suspicious" and what weird statements are.

Good luck getting to look at a pistol at gander or field and stream. I have been in both stores with money in had to buy guns and walked out buying it somewhere else because they just ignored me. At field and stream I went in to buy a Glock and left with a Smith but tried about 6 different pistols and the guy behind the counter was annoyed that I kept asking to try different ones. I won't shop at field and stream unless it is an emergency and need something on a weekend late at night when my local shop isn't open.

[Five Seasons]

when you're having fun debates with your anti-gun friends and they cite some shit that kimmel said, remind them that he got his start on the man show. a show that ended with big breasted girls jumping on a trampoline. They're using him as a mouthpiece right now, but could quite honestly freak out if that show existed today. the SEXISM! 

[Five Seasons]

I'll add this. this is something us republicans might need to consider or compromise on. We have long held the belief that guns don't kill people and that many of the non-crime/gang related shootings and mass murders (which always spark these debates) are done by the mentally ill. And that we need better mental health services in this country.

well you can't preach and promote that and in turn be very anti-health services with your legislation. I'll admit to being anti-obama care. My premiums have gone up. life isn't roses, but there are bigger issues in the world and this whole thing feels like a grudge now and that's why it wont pass. 

In short, if you want to blame mental health and rightfully so, you have to support legislation to address it. And that doesn't mean taking guns away, but just simply having more affordable and better access to care.

Edited October 5, 2017 by Belo

[jjb4900]

4 minutes ago, Belo said:

I'll add this. this is something us republicans might need to consider or compromise on. We have long held the belief that guns don't kill people and that many of the non-crime/gang related shootings and mass murders (which always spark these debates) are done by the mentally ill. And that we need better mental health services in this country.

well you can't preach and promote that and in turn be very anti-health services with your legislation. I'll admit to being anti-obama care. My premiums have gone up. life isn't roses, but there are bigger issues in the world and this whole thing feels like a grudge now and that's why it wont pass. 

In short, if you want to blame mental health and rightfully so, you have to support legislation to address it. And that doesn't mean taking guns away, but just simply having more affordable and better access to care.

The problem with some mental health issues is it's just like drug addiction, the person with the problem needs to want help......unfortunately we can't just lock some of these people away and keep them away from society.

[Five Seasons]

7 minutes ago, jjb4900 said:

The problem with some mental health issues is it's just like drug addiction, the person with the problem needs to want help......unfortunately we can't just lock some of these people away and keep them away from society.

true. but it's a start. i don't disagree that these things can't keep happening and we can just keep shrugging our shoulders. Even with legal carry at that concert you wouldn't be able to defend yourself. I don't want to live in fear where even a church isn't safe anymore. 

heck the archery woods were safe until some guy just arrowed his buddy lol.

Edited October 5, 2017 by Belo

[jjb4900]

Just now, Belo said:

true. but it's a start. i don't disagree that these things can't keep happening and we can just keep shrugging our shoulders. Even with legal carry at that concert you wouldn't be able to defend yourself. I don't want to live in fear where even a church isn't safe anymore.

right, something needs to be done, probably a few issues need to be addressed. I get a kick at the ones who say "this is why I always carry" and "this would have had a different outcome if one or two people were armed"...........would make zero difference in a situation like this.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

5 minutes ago, Belo said:

true. but it's a start. i don't disagree that these things can't keep happening and we can just keep shrugging our shoulders. Even with legal carry at that concert you wouldn't be able to defend yourself. I don't want to live in fear where even a church isn't safe anymore. 

heck the archery woods were safe until some guy just arrowed his buddy lol.

I don't have a problem supporting better mental health care BUT, there needs to be a plan outlined (the whole plan) and specific avenues to pay for it. I would then want someone to tell me how this new plan would have stopped this shooter. 

[jjb4900]

I think this latest incident is going to create a new set of issues, the Country Music industry has a lot of pro gun people in it....so now when they become the target, do they just shrug their shoulders and say "sh*t happens", or do they flip sides...whole different ball game when what you've always been a proponent of effects you in a negative way.

[Five Seasons]

6 minutes ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

I don't have a problem supporting better mental health care BUT, there needs to be a plan outlined (the whole plan) and specific avenues to pay for it. I would then want someone to tell me how this new plan would have stopped this shooter. 

of course there needs to be a plan. There are numerous studies that show how anti-gun laws have not prevented or decreased gun crimes. WE all know that criminals don't care. This particular guy might be an outlier. And even with improved mental health there will be another in the future.

but if you as a gun owner were given an option. More safe act type legislation or a small ammo/gun tax or a small increase in healthcare premiums to help fund better mental health, gang and crime prevention etc. would you reluctantly sign off on it?

 

[Five Seasons]

btw, 2/3 of gun deaths annually are suicides. and bump stock were passed under obama. that's my favorite.

[Five Seasons]

2 minutes ago, jjb4900 said:

I think this latest incident is going to create a new set of issues, the Country Music industry has a lot of pro gun people in it....so now when they become the target, do they just shrug their shoulders and say "sh*t happens", or do they flip sides...whole different ball game when what you've always been a proponent of effects you in a negative way.

and that's why it's hard not to believe this wasn't politically motivated from the left. the cynic in me believes they're not releasing that info because of the fear that the divide this country is already in. waiting for it to cool. 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

1 minute ago, Belo said:

but if you as a gun owner were given an option. More safe act type legislation or a small ammo/gun tax or a small increase in healthcare premiums to help fund better mental health, gang and crime prevention etc. would you reluctantly sign off on it?

 

Those my only options? Can we tax abortions, unhealthy food and cars instead, since they cause more deaths by double or triple digit factors instead?