Does this load sound OK, or is the slug too light?

[Skillet]

Hey guys, I just picked up a traditions, 50. cal carbine for $50 from a friend of mine.  After monkeying around with it, it seems to be a real picky gun.  The only load that seems to shoot really consistently is a Hornady 240Gr, pr conical, and 90 Gr of Pyrodex RS.  I know it's not an inline, and I'm not trying to push it past 80 yards, but if I go much heavier on the bullets, I start to have significant drop inside of that range.  I can't bump the powder up enough to compensate for the drop without exceeding load limit (haven't tried it).  So, the question is, is this load enough for deer or black bear?  Also, I'm having trouble finding any more of these Hornady conicals, any ideas on where they could be found?  I'm brand new at muzzleloading, and any advice would be really helpful. Thanks.

[Doewhacker]

There are going to be others with far more expertise here but, I shoot 90 grains of Black powder and a 385gr Hornady Greatplains Bullet. I am good to 100 yards with open sites and a gun like your's. That load for sure will do a number on deer.

[fasteddie]

I use a 240 gr Hornaday XTP in my inline with 90 gr of 777 loose powder and it knocks the snot out of deer ......

[G-Man]

ok so its a sidelock so i'll stick with my side locks ..in my kentucky long rifle, 95 grains, and 50 cal round ball drops them to 100yds, my 50 cal kentucky pistol i only use 50 grains and a roundball off a rest i have cleanly dropped deer at 60 yards. most older side locks have a slower twist in the barrel and round balls are the ticket! (and a lot cheaper as well!) surprised your shooting a sabot.. whats the twist in the barrell? 1-48? or 1-66 or  1-32? most picky guns have a slower twist rate and modern sabots will not shoot consistant. if its a fast twist 1-32,(sometimes they will shoot good out of a 1-48) your ok with them and your shooting conicals maxi balls or mini's  it may be to fast and the lead is stripping as well...

[papabear]

  I shoot a 50 cal. Hawkins.

my load is 90 grains of FFFg with round ball at 50 yards using this load I hunt deer and took it up to Maine for a black bear hunt

Papabear

[Pygmy]

As long as your bullet is a solid lead conical, it should work fine for black bear or deer. The bullets I would avoid would be the sabotted pistol bullets, such as the 240 grain HP or SP, which are designed to expand at handgun velocities. Sometimes if you push tham at higher velocities in a muzzleloader, they blow up and leave a shallow wound with insuficient penetration for a clean kill. I've seen it happen on deer.

I'm a little surprised to hear you are getting excessive drop with conicals with 90 grains of powder. In my .50 cal. Hawken, I shoot a 460 grain Noexcuses conical with 80 grains of loose 777. It shoots very flat out to 100 yards. Sighted at 100 yards POI is only a couple inches high at 50.

After 100 yards it drops pretty fast, though.

[Skillet]

Thanks for the replies. The bullets I'm shooting are just lubed lead conicals with a felt wad under them, sorry for there being any confusion of them being saboted.  The drop wasn't horrible, a couple inches, with the heavier bullets (They were in my friends' stuff, he said he didn't remember how heavy they were, but he thought they were around 365Gr, does that sound right?)  I had to file down the front brass blade to get the elevation right for the 240 / 90 gr load, so if I were to go with a heavier bullet, I guess I would just have to file more off?  On the other hand, what would a typical 50. Cal round ball wiegh?  Would that shoot higher than my 240 gr.?  G-Man, it's a 1:48 twist.  There seems to be a lot that goes into getting this type of shooting down, hope I can get it figured out well enough for this season.

[Pygmy]

A 50 cal roundball weighs about 180 grains. I have had good results with them on deer, so I suspect they would work OK on black bears too...Shucks...The Mountain men used them for GRIZZLIES, not that I would want to try that... ??? ....

The 1-48 twist is a COMPROMISE twist that is designed to shoot both conicals or roundballs reasonably well..My Hawken is a 1-48 and it shoots both with good hunting accuracy.

However, every rifle is an individual.

If I were you and if you are satisfied with the accuracy of the bullets you are using, I would go ahead and use them for your bear hunt.

If, for whatever reason, you decide you'd like to try some other projectiles, that is OK too. Roundballs are an option, and a good conical to try is the Great Plains 385.

I have had great results with the Noexcuses 460. However, perhaps your short barrel would not do as well with those as my 28" hawken barrel does.

[nyantler]

  I shoot a 50 cal. Hawkins.

my load is 90 grains of FFFg with round ball at 50 yards using this load I hunt deer and took it up to Maine for a black bear hunt

Papabear

Papa.. why FFF?... you getting better groups with that instead of FF? I shoot the same gun 100 grains of FF at 50.. with about the same results

[G-Man]

i've found that a 5 grain increases in  powder will raise my round ball approximatly 1 in at 50 yards. if i use fff instead of ff at the same grain 90 for example it will have the same result. finer powder faster burn(more  surface area in smaller grain) and it will hit about an 1 in higher same as adding 5 grain. Course i'ver never cronoed the difference in velocities just an observation from the range. but i would assume higher velocity is the difference i see on the target.

[nyantler]

I'm not the kind of guy that gets all wrapped up in balistics and such as long as it kills deer... I was just curious about the FFF...  finer powder during hunting season for me has always resulted in more of my gun not going off... I don't have that problem with FF... I have shot 7F at the range (ran out of ff and thats all I had in the box)... and didn't see that much difference at 50 yards... but I had a ton of no fires

[Pygmy]

I have not had an issue with 2F in my hawken with loose pydrodex or black powder. However, when I decided to use 777 to work up a load for a heavy conical to use for elk, I noticed that the ignition of the 2F 777 seemed somewhat sluggish. There was a slight but perceptible hesitation between the detonation of the #11 cap and the detonation of the powder charge. I switched to 3F 777 and ignition seemed faster. I have never had any failures to fire with either 2F or 3F loose powders of any sort while hunting. The only failures to fire that I have experienced resulted from hunting several days in damp weather without reloading.Fortunately they occurred when firing the rifle at the end of a hunt to unload, rather than when I was shooting at game.

[papabear]

  When I first stared shooting my Hawkins it was at the Huntington range one of the shooters there took me to the side and helped me for an hour he was shooting FFFg with his Hawkins I have bin shooting it ever since's can not remember ever having a miss fire with this powder ether hunting or at the range  it works I  stick with it that's why I shoot FFFg .

papabear

[NYDeere]

I hunt with a traditions, 50. cal carbine as well. I use the Maxi Ball with 90 grains of Pyrodex and it shoots nice out to about 100 yards. I have never had the need to shoot farther so am very happy with this load.