Non political corona virus thread

[Chef]

So at what point is it "close"? How far do you let the snow ball roll down the hill before it is too large and too fast to stop? Did it happen over night in Romania?
For the record I am wearing a mask even though I know it is useless. 

How do you” know “ it’s useless ?


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[Chef]

So at what point is it "close"? How far do you let the snow ball roll down the hill before it is too large and too fast to stop? Did it happen over night in Romania?
For the record I am wearing a mask even though I know it is useless. 

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449


So you are smarter than dr’s at the Mayo Clinic


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[Culvercreek hunt club]

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449


So you are smarter than dr’s at the Mayo Clinic


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Nope. Never claimed to be. I do know math though and when you look at the weave on the fabric of these masks and the size of the virus you tell me. The article you said said they work in conjunction with social distancing.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

How do you” know “ it’s useless ?


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Simple math

[Chef]

Nope. Never claimed to be. I do know math though and when you look at the weave on the fabric of these masks and the size of the virus you tell me. The article you said said they work in conjunction with social distancing.

Yea they do, more so if the infected person is wearing a mask. The mask you wear is not to protect you from others but to protect others from you


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[Culvercreek hunt club]

Yea they do, more so if the infected person is wearing a mask. The mask you wear is not to protect you from others but to protect others from you


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So if the virus can pass the though what protection is there? Standing is a super market within 3 feet. Both people have masks on. On is infected and sneezes. The mask protects the other person? What is the visit size and why is the mask fabric size. Many folks are basically wearing tshirt material

[Chef]

So if the virus can pass the though what protection is there? Standing is a super market within 3 feet. Both people have masks on. On is infected and sneezes. The mask protects the other person? What is the visit size and why is the mask fabric size. Many folks are basically wearing tshirt material

It will block some of the particles from traveling as far as they normally would. Between that and the limited protection you get from your own mask it is better than nothing. I myself wear a N95 or kn95 when out and about


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[Culvercreek hunt club]

It will block some of the particles from traveling as far as they normally would. Between that and the limited protection you get from your own mask it is better than nothing. I myself wear a N95 or kn95 when out and about


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Most do not wear those. All it takes is one virus to infect. Social distancing and hygiene is the most effective. That isn’t me. That is medical professionals. Is really like to see the numbers and expanding of antibody testing. The states they are touting as having this big resurgence have extremely low death rates. Rope death rates per million is currently NJ and NY per million. Out here in Rochester at Strong there hasn’t been a patient with COVID in ICU in a week. Even longer since the last ventilator case

[left field]

8 minutes ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

All it takes is one virus to infect. 

I'm not sure that's the case. My understanding is that it takes a certain viral load to infect and the greater the viral load the more severe the disease. Do you have a study that shows a single virus can infect? 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I'm not sure that's the case. My understanding is that it takes a certain viral load to infect and the greater the viral load the more severe the disease. Do you have a study that shows a single virus can infect? 

They are not certain but the medical community believes it is very very small quantity. Much less viral load than say influenza. Viruses replicate exponentially and short of intentional infection there is no way to know for sure what the actual load is. It only takes less than 20 particles of norovirus to cause a sever infection. There is one study from China I heard referenced that suggests the viral load variations had no bearing in the severity of Covid (Taken with a Grain of salt since it is coming out of China).

There was an influenza study that concluded for that virus the higher the viral load the more severe the illness. They just don’t know for this one yet.

I was using an extreme example to illustrate a point but even if the load required is twice as high as norovirus how many virus particles are in a single sneeze? I’ve seen reports that a single Sneeze could have up to 200 million virus particles. (Depending on the stage of illness, worst when symptoms just present). Add in velocity of a cough to 50 mph and a sneeze to 200 mph or over and that is a lot of force. But how about the asymptomatic folks. They are walking amongst us. I think it is naive to think if 200 million particles are expelled and that a coarse weave mask is any help at all. Water droplets from a Sneeze or cough in the 5 micron range can stay airborne a long time depending on air flow. So hitch .12 micron corona virus on the particles and tell me the masks most are wearing mean anything. Yes a N95 will take out 95% above .1 microns but how many people have you seen with N95 masks. And that is only if worn properly. I’ve seen improper fit evaluations as high as a 60% efficiency reductions

Relying on what most people are wearing is akin to using a piece of yarn as a lanyard in a tree stand. It may slow you down some but is it even noticeable or spraying a fire hose through a screen door. In my opinion. And I know what they say about opinions

[Rattler]

The simple fact there is no standard a mask has to meet, proves they are not effective.  When people can wear a mask that allows their breath to exhaust from them, or wear it without covering their nose, the idea they are preventing any spread of the virus is laughable.  

We have nothing to fear, but fear itself.........and stupid.  We should be scared to death of stupid.

 

BTW: For the man with the Romania wife, I'm a product of the Hungarian Revolution of 1956 and understand Communist totalitarianism perfectly.  It's not just the mask mandate that is at issue here.  It's the entire economic agenda at the core of this virus issue that is totalitarian.

Edited July 7, 2020 by Rattler

[Elmo]

You don't get infected y just one particle.  It takes several particles.  Sneezing in a closed area causes the particles to linger.  Sneezing in open air causes the wind to dissipate the particles fairly quickly.  A masks and clothes may not completely prevent particles from entering/exiting but it reduces the number of particles that are expelled.

They estimate that standing next to someone who is infected and breathing the same air, it takes a little under 10 minutes for enough particles to transfer for a successful transmission.  A mask would reduce the amount of particles and the distance it travels.

I mean at this point the science and data is overwhelming.  Yes, you can always find the one crack-head doctor or two to tell you otherwise but the majority of the doctors and scientist out there say masks can only help.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/getting-healthy-now/202004/coronavirus-the-importance-viral-load

Edited July 7, 2020 by Elmo

[Elmo]

Long video but worth watching.  Independent documentary of Wuhan after they've re-opened.  In Japanese and Chinese so you'll have to read the subtitles.  It's crazy the amount of testing they do and the precautions they take.  But Almost no cases since they've re-opened.

 

 

 

[Jeremy K]

2 hours ago, Elmo said:

Long video but worth watching.  Independent documentary of Wuhan after they've re-opened.  In Japanese and Chinese so you'll have to read the subtitles.  It's crazy the amount of testing they do and the precautions they take.  But Almost no cases since they've re-opened.

 

 

 

There are also reports of the disgusting lengths they went to stop the spread which in America we would never be do.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

5 hours ago, Elmo said:

You don't get infected y just one particle.  It takes several particles.  Sneezing in a closed area causes the particles to linger.  Sneezing in open air causes the wind to dissipate the particles fairly quickly.  A masks and clothes may not completely prevent particles from entering/exiting but it reduces the number of particles that are expelled.

They estimate that standing next to someone who is infected and breathing the same air, it takes a little under 10 minutes for enough particles to transfer for a successful transmission.  A mask would reduce the amount of particles and the distance it travels.

I mean at this point the science and data is overwhelming.  Yes, you can always find the one crack-head doctor or two to tell you otherwise but the majority of the doctors and scientist out there say masks can only help.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/getting-healthy-now/202004/coronavirus-the-importance-viral-load

so what it the viral load required for to contract COVID? 

[Elmo]

2 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

so what it the viral load required for to contract COVID? 

I can't remember where I read the article as I read several but I believe it was around 5000 to 7000.  A single breathe is roughly 900.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Just now, Elmo said:

I can't remember where I read the article as I read several but I believe it was around 5000 to 7000.  

That isn't even close to what I have read. I'd love to see that source. 

[Elmo]

5 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

There are also reports of the disgusting lengths they went to stop the spread which in America we would never be do.

Such as mandatory lock down and restricting travel to only essential workers within the city but not in the suburbs or country side?  Nothing different from what they did in NYC.  Only difference was the penalty was much harsher.  The is they track people.  When you enter a restaurant etc, you have to scan yourself in.  Serves 2 functions.  Reports to the restaurant if you've passed your most recent test to which they'll deny your entry.  And mark your presence at the restaurant.  This way the next time you're tested, if it comes back positive, they warn everyone that checked into the same location around the same time you did and have them tested as well.  I don't see that flying over here.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

8 minutes ago, Elmo said:

Such as mandatory lock down and restricting travel to only essential workers within the city but not in the suburbs or country side?  Nothing different from what they did in NYC.  Only difference was the penalty was much harsher.  The is they track people.  When you enter a restaurant etc, you have to scan yourself in.  Serves 2 functions.  Reports to the restaurant if you've passed your most recent test to which they'll deny your entry.  And mark your presence at the restaurant.  This way the next time you're tested, if it comes back positive, they warn everyone that checked into the same location around the same time you did and have them tested as well.  I don't see that flying over here.

Nothing different ...EXCEPT....lol 

[Elmo]

51 minutes ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

That isn't even close to what I have read. I'd love to see that source. 

I can't find the article and I'll admit that such research would be difficult since it would require several people to willingly get infected.  Logically, if it only takes one particle and a particle can live for several hours, when if an infected person sneezed into the wind then half the easter sea board will all get infected.

[Elmo]

38 minutes ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

Nothing different ...EXCEPT....lol 

Except harsher penalties.  The tracking is post re-opening.  I take it no one actually watched the documentary.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

1 minute ago, Elmo said:

Except harsher penalties.  The tracking is post re-opening.  I take it no one actually watched the documentary.

My laughter was becasue to say it was no different and then list the ways it is struck me funny. 

[Elmo]

Put it this way.  I see it as two likely outcomes.

1. In the end, we may find out that mask don't do anything and I'll be annoyed that I wore one like an idiot for several months.

2. In the end, we find out masks do indeed have an effect.  I walk around with the guilt that I am directly responsible for several deaths.  Of course knowing that they're most likely elderly and no one I know and most likely going to die anyway, who cares?

[Culvercreek hunt club]

4 minutes ago, Elmo said:

I can't find the article and I'll admit that such research would be difficult since it would require several people to willingly get infected.  Logically, if it only takes one particle and a particle can live for several hours, when if an infected person sneezed into the wind then half the easter sea board will all get infected.

Viral load of Norovirus is around 20 and most I see agree this is as, if not , more contageous. 

[Jeremy K]

56 minutes ago, Elmo said:

Such as mandatory lock down and restricting travel to only essential workers within the city but not in the suburbs or country side?  Nothing different from what they did in NYC.  Only difference was the penalty was much harsher.  The is they track people.  When you enter a restaurant etc, you have to scan yourself in.  Serves 2 functions.  Reports to the restaurant if you've passed your most recent test to which they'll deny your entry.  And mark your presence at the restaurant.  This way the next time you're tested, if it comes back positive, they warn everyone that checked into the same location around the same time you did and have them tested as well.  I don't see that flying over here.

I was talking about them putting people in incinerators while they still had a pulse