America's Most Ineffective Deer Management Program

[Grouse]

Staten Island, NY

"The buck population quickly jumped 873%. Curtis thinks bucks from surrounding areas flooded the campus because the 74 does with tubal ligations couldn’t get pregnant, and kept cycling into estrus every four weeks from late October through March." -Patrick Durkin

https://www.themeateater.com/conservation/wildlife-management/incredible-waste-of-money-americas-most-ineffective-deer-management-program?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=5%2F10%2F21_Whitetail (America's Worst Deer Management) (Ykr5tM)&utm_content=None&_ke=eyJrbF9jb21wYW55X2lkIjogIll5Z1dRNyIsICJrbF9lbWFpbCI6ICJ2anBzckB5YWhvby5jb20ifQ%3D%3D

[phade]

I'm kind of surprised you sourced meateater. Do you know who owns them? 

It amazes me that people want to hold firm on those who are anti-2a, yet nobody brings up this topic because of the Rinella fanbois. 

It's literally owned by Peter Chernin.

Edited May 11, 2021 by phade

[Grouse]

I don't care who the source is if the information is factual.  Apparently you do.  I take Meateater's good with the bad.  I don't see them programming a lot of anti-gun stuff either.

Care to address the issues in the article at all?

 

Dr. Karl Malcolm, a frequent MeatEater Podcast guest and wildlife biologist with the U.S. Forest Service in Albuquerque, worries that Staten Island could turn deer into zoo animals.

“Deer evolved in nature to be productive, short-lived prey species,” Malcolm said. “They’ve always been hunted by humans and other predators. They’ve always died violent deaths. It’s a shame we’re so detached from nature’s realities that we’ll squander tax dollars on something with no realistic hope of solving problems our attitudes create.”

Edited May 11, 2021 by Grouse

[left field]

What is it you're hoping for? Acknowledgement that it was a stupid idea? I think pretty much everyone, including the advocates, think it was a stupid idea.

 

[phade]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I don't care who the source is if the information is factual.  Apparently you do.  I take Meateater's good with the bad.  I don't see them programming a lot of anti-gun stuff either.

Care to address the issues in the article at all?

 

Dr. Karl Malcolm, a frequent MeatEater Podcast guest and wildlife biologist with the U.S. Forest Service in Albuquerque, worries that Staten Island could turn deer into zoo animals.

“Deer evolved in nature to be productive, short-lived prey species,” Malcolm said. “They’ve always been hunted by humans and other predators. They’ve always died violent deaths. It’s a shame we’re so detached from nature’s realities that we’ll squander tax dollars on something with no realistic hope of solving problems our attitudes create.”

I find that terribly hard to believe. Terribly. 

 

 

 

[Grouse]

19 minutes ago, left field said:

What is it you're hoping for? Acknowledgement that it was a stupid idea? I think pretty much everyone, including the advocates, think it was a stupid idea.

Then why doesn't DeBlasio admit it's stupid?  Why aren't people holding elected officials to their pronouncements about following the science?  I'm hoping fools are exposed and continue to be chastised for stupid ideas until they stop them.

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, phade said:

I find that terribly hard to believe. Terribly. 

And I'm supposed to care?

[phade]

3 minutes ago, Grouse said:

And I'm supposed to care?

You. Care? 

C'mon now. Caring doesn't fit your agenda or MO. We all know that.

I was hoping you'd be actively engaged in the anti-2A component and be willing to learn something, but you schlepped it off by saying "I don't see much anti-stuff." You just keep on grousing, Grouse. 

Edited May 11, 2021 by phade

[Grouse]

Why don't you try to intelligently address the issues in the article and stop trying to derail the thread for your own juvenile reasons?

[phade]

The issue is that article comes from an anti-2A owned-org. Do you shop at Dick's? 

*Edit to be fair, I'm not perfect. But just being curious if you actually knew it was anti-2A owned, would you have posted such fodder?

I have to agree with LF on this one, I'm not sure what you are looking for? The obvious being pointed out? You posting and supporting an anti-2A is much more interesting. I do appreciate you posting a deer-related topic, though. Genuinely.

Edited May 11, 2021 by phade

[Grouse]

I have never seen Steve Rinella preach anything anti-2nd A.  If you have, post it for my edification. 

Nothing in the article is anti-2nd A either.  Obviously the owner doesn't interfere with the programming Steve puts out, and this article could be considered Pro-2nd A as it is showing how programs other than hunting are a waste of money.

I find it interesting you are more interested in what I post than what is in what I post.  I didn't realize you were a follower of mine.  Have we ever conversed in the past on the forum before?  I can't recall.

 

Edited May 11, 2021 by Grouse

[left field]

12 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Then why doesn't DeBlasio admit it's stupid?  Why aren't people holding elected officials to their pronouncements about following the science?  I'm hoping fools are exposed and continue to be chastised for stupid ideas until they stop them.

That's what you're after? Getting DeBlasio to admit it was a waste of money? Elected officials to admit their mistakes? Good luck with that.

I know you think you're doing the Lord's work by speaking truth to power but of all the dumb things to hang your hat on. I believe you once said that at your stage in life you were prepared to either give your life or spend the rest of your life in prison in the fight for your truth. Okay, here's a thought. Sneak into SI under the cover of darkness and take out a few deer with a bow. It may take a while before you're caught but when you are you will make the front page of every newspaper and have a national venue to speak about animal science, duplicitous politicians, and Biden. You'd probably only spend a few years in prison so will have plenty of time to find another cause once you're out.

[Grouse]

You have a serious hate problem Lefty.  Get some help.

[phade]

1 minute ago, Grouse said:

I have never seen Steve Rinella preach anything anti-2nd A.  If you have, post it for my edification. 

Nothing in the article is anti-2nd A either.  Obviously the owner doesn't interfere with the programming Steve puts out, and this article could be considered Pro-2nd A as it is showing how programs other than hunting are a waste of money.

I find it interesting you are more interested in what I post than what is posted.  I didn't realize you were a follower of mine.  Have we ever conversed in the past on the forum before?  I can't recall.

 

Peter Chernin wants to ban semi auto. Ban. All you note about is Rinella, a talking face because he sold out to an anti-2A owner. Would you sell your business to Dick's? 

[left field]

Not even close. I'm just speaking silliness to other silliness.

 

[diplomat019]

@Grouse 

Actually, people who support Chernin have responsibility for everything that happens on his watch.   And if you support Rinella you support Chernin.  
 

Nothing makes me more sick than people who want to limit our freedoms and those who support them. 

Edited May 11, 2021 by diplomat019

[Five Seasons]

5 hours ago, phade said:

I'm kind of surprised you sourced meateater. Do you know who owns them? 

It amazes me that people want to hold firm on those who are anti-2a, yet nobody brings up this topic because of the Rinella fanbois. 

It's literally owned by Peter Chernin.

I think there is some truth here, but your comments don't include the whole picture. Admittedly I'm a fanboi. Why he hunts, his banter/style and the fact that he's influenced me heavily to broaden my horizons beyond turkey and whitetail and what I eat is in large part why I watch his show and listen weekly to his podcast. 

Steve has brought on both republican and democratic politicians and generally supports conservation regardless of who is pushing it. Gave props to Trump for the wilderness act and expressed concerned about the native american selected to the dept of interior or whatever it was. He's made bets that trump would win a second term and I've listened enough to gleam where his leanings are.

Through all of the last 4 years they haven't changed their tune at all and in fact partnered with weatherby...

Anyhow, your point is fair but this is a quick easy read for some more color around the "principal investor"

https://meaww.com/meat-eater-inc-who-owns-steve-rinella-hunting-show-netflix-anti-gun-activist-peter-chernin-pro-biden

[Five Seasons]

3 hours ago, phade said:

The issue is that article comes from an anti-2A owned-org. Do you shop at Dick's? 

 

for those that wont click the link above. He is a principal investor, he's a democrat who doesn't support trophy hunting and has called for semi-auto weapon bans.

so "owned" and "anti-2a org" aren't necessarily completely factual. Nor would they dump 20+M into their investment if they wanted to push an agenda?

Edited May 11, 2021 by Belo

[WNYBuckHunter]

1 minute ago, Belo said:

for those that wont click the link above. He is a principal investor, he's a democrat who doesn't support trophy hunting and has called for semi-auto weapon bans.

so "owned" and "anti-2a org" aren't necessarily completely factual. Nor would they dump 20+M into their investment if they wanted to push an agenda?

Calling for semi auto bans makes you anti-2A. 

[phade]

20 minutes ago, Belo said:

for those that wont click the link above. He is a principal investor, he's a democrat who doesn't support trophy hunting and has called for semi-auto weapon bans.

so "owned" and "anti-2a org" aren't necessarily completely factual. Nor would they dump 20+M into their investment if they wanted to push an agenda?

You know how you push your agenda - make money off the people you are against. It's a double dip - you drain resources from opponents and add to your arsenal to pursue via other avenues.

That's how you push it. And it's $100M...two $50M injections. 

I admittedly bought a meateater branded Weatherby, not knowing this, but now that I do, I won't be supporting any longer. Rinella accepted money from someone who calls for a ban on semi...that is horrid.

Edited May 11, 2021 by phade

[squirrelwhisperer]

Man-o-man!!!

Oh how I would love to get certain people on this forum together in a room and add lots of alcohol, just to see what happens. You wanna talk about science, there is an experiment for ya.

Lets take this the other way, fellas...here is to hoping stupidity like deer sterilization programs helps them to realize how important hunters are and ultimately leads them to ease restrictions so we can be a larger part of the solution. 

[left field]

Happy to host.

It's a pretty dopey idea. I guess the residents would be up in arms over a bow hunt. 

[Five Seasons]

23 hours ago, WNYBuckHunter said:

Calling for semi auto bans makes you anti-2A. 

 

23 hours ago, phade said:

You know how you push your agenda - make money off the people you are against. It's a double dip - you drain resources from opponents and add to your arsenal to pursue via other avenues.

That's how you push it. And it's $100M...two $50M injections. 

I admittedly bought a meateater branded Weatherby, not knowing this, but now that I do, I won't be supporting any longer. Rinella accepted money from someone who calls for a ban on semi...that is horrid.

I didn't disagree with that, but this isn't a black and white issue, there's gray and nuisance to it. Steve himself is the face behind the brand even if he keeps accepting the cash or if he cancels the whole deal. Steve is Meateater, not the investor.

Both of your points are valid and I understand your concern. My only point is that this investment hasn't appeared to have changed a thing other than broadening its hunting and fishing content. Will there be some big ole bait and switch down the road? Maybe... but then they lose their investment. Why would they partner with a gun manufacturer? What would the investor gain by ruining their own investment?

I also stand by my point that the investors opinion on gun control doesn't necessarily mean he runs an anti-2A org. That's his opinion. Just like someone may be anti-abortion but doesn't necessarily picket outside clinics if that analogy works for you.

[phade]

2 minutes ago, Belo said:

 

I didn't disagree with that, but this isn't a black and white issue, there's gray and nuisance to it. Steve himself is the face behind the brand even if he keeps accepting the cash or if he cancels the whole deal. Steve is Meateater, not the investor.

Both of your points are valid and I understand your concern. My only point is that this investment hasn't appeared to have changed a thing other than broadening its hunting and fishing content. Will there be some big ole bait and switch down the road? Maybe... but then they lose their investment. Why would they partner with a gun manufacturer? What would the investor gain by ruining their own investment?

I also stand by my point that the investors opinion on gun control doesn't necessarily mean he runs an anti-2A org. That's his opinion. Just like someone may be anti-abortion but doesn't necessarily picket outside clinics if that analogy works for you.

What do you think Chernin does with the money he makes - cause that sure as hell ain't just opinion? Do you think he invests in Pro-2A lobbyists? Pro 2-A candidates? No. The other way around. He is taking money from hunters and 2-A supporters and using it to advance his cause. So I can't agree with "opinion" being separate from the money.

And you know what - Rinella knew that; he won't ever answer whether he believes AR-15s should be "legal" because he knows his answer would make him this generation's Jim Zumbo.

Meateater would not be a digital marketing company that owns things like First Lite without Chernin. They'd be just another brand in a sea of companies looking for growth. So, let's be real, Rinella sold out to become a talking face for a guy who takes his money and spends it toward anti-2A causes. You can continue to defend him. I won't. 

 

[WNYBuckHunter]

7 minutes ago, Belo said:

 

I didn't disagree with that, but this isn't a black and white issue, there's gray and nuisance to it. Steve himself is the face behind the brand even if he keeps accepting the cash or if he cancels the whole deal. Steve is Meateater, not the investor.

Both of your points are valid and I understand your concern. My only point is that this investment hasn't appeared to have changed a thing other than broadening its hunting and fishing content. Will there be some big ole bait and switch down the road? Maybe... but then they lose their investment. Why would they partner with a gun manufacturer? What would the investor gain by ruining their own investment?

I also stand by my point that the investors opinion on gun control doesn't necessarily mean he runs an anti-2A org. That's his opinion. Just like someone may be anti-abortion but doesn't necessarily picket outside clinics if that analogy works for you.

I do See what you are saying, but having an opinion and actively pushing for a ban are two different things. If someone just doesn’t like semi auto rifles and chooses not to purchase one, and even voices their opinion without restricting the rights of others, I have no issue with that. In fact, I support That persons right to have and voice their opinion which is different than my own. Supporting, sponsoring or organizing support of a ban that chips away further at the rights of all citizens is different in my eyes. Personally I will Do whatever I can To avoid giving any type of support to someone like that, and will speak out and support groups that try to stop those antis from being successful in installing their agenda.