bubba

I will bottom line ot for all of you. BO will never be mandatory in NY. it is not warranted and we have so few incidents due to education that it is not significant to legislators to risk pissing off hunters who are voters. Our previous vice president shot a colleague wearing orange at 28 yards. It sure works well. I would say there was a bigger problem there than orange is safe.

ok what history have I forgotten? All I said was go back further and look at before hunter ed was started. And per the doc's post the state started a campaign for more safety training not a blaze orange campaign. So if I forget these facts I will get shot? your post makes no sense. I am not the one trying to alter the facts to make it look like bo is the saviour

He isnt a doc but he plays one on the internet. Go back further like the late 50s when hunter ed started.

go back and look at the data you so love and see how many accidents there were before orange and now. Then go back and look at how many there were before hunter safety education and now. I think the numbers will surprise you. How did the hunting population of NY ever survive each season before there was BO, when everyone wore either red or green plaid? It is one thing to support your beliefs, but entirely another to be so narrow minded and biased, that what anyone else says in dismissed immediately and to make oolish statements like the carnage would be so tremendous without BO. 27 prcent of accidents were with people wearing BO. You say it is llow I say it is high. That tels me it isnt the wonderful life saver you portray it to be. Take your blinders off and see the whole picture. Again if I were so afraid of being shot or shooting someone, I would find another hobby, like video hunting. You say how unsafe it is, but continue to do so. Seems kind of to use your word stupid. It is not my job or any othe rhunters job to make fellow hunters safer. It is their own job. And as the data shows when someone was shot, there was some illegal activity fgoing on, so the person had little regard for the sport or the rules. it isnt the safe average hunter shooting other, it is the crimonal presenting themselves as hunters.

so again I ask if 73 percent of incidents involved not wearing BO, then 27 percent or more than one in four did involve BO. Simple math. I have to say that is a pretty high percentage for such a safety measure. I will post a link but there is somethng else to think about. 1 in 10 males and 1 in 100 females are colorblind. They do not see orange. My link will show what they do see. So, I would enter into evidence, there is a large number of hunters who do not see the great life saving color, so I would say it reduces its effect dramatically. Just something to think about. I am sure it will be decided it will be useless data, but the fact remains, there are lots of ppl who do not see orange, but can see through camo and see green much more intense. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_blindness

careful pygmy next you will be stupid. And as Ron White says you cant fix stupid. If people choose not to wear orange, it is their life they are putting is theoretic peril. As I have stated before, if the only place I could hunt, I had to be all dressed up and afraid of being shot , or had been shot at, I would quit hunting. It is not my job to make other hunters safe by wearing clothes they will theoritically not shoot at me. Yes, I admit 77 percent of people shot were not wearing orange. However, that means that 23 pecent were. So ask those people how wearng orange worked for them. I know doc data etc. But you keep avoiding the data that shows states with mandatory hunter orange have higher hunters shot rates than NY. I realize this data goes against your argument, but it is fact. Again the key is training and education and mentoring. The young hunters who are fresh out of courses are the safety statistically. It is older guys like myself who cut corners and think we know it all that are much more likely to shoot someone. We will legislate ourselves right out of hunting at the rate we are going. What next? Wanna be real safe stop hunting entirely or take guns away so no one can be shot. Scoff if you wish and again call me names or dismiss me, but it is next down the road. Want to cut down incidents, make hunter education mandatory every 5 years. A refresher never hurt anyone.

yes there is. I dont personally hunt waterfowl, but a lot around

I sho tone of those for three years with the 50 barrel and 270. I loved it and so did my nephew. long story short, he has it now, and I have put a bergara barrel on my encore. I think they make a great barrel.

so predictable, and pathetic have a nice day.

being from as north as you can get, I do not see where everyone thinks the weather is so bad compared to downstate. The past three winters, it has been colder and more snow in the South than here. we had one freak snow on halloween last year, then none until eason ended mid december. As far as seasons go, 8 years ago we were so over populated, they gave dmp's to virtually everyone. Where I am hunting, I am sure I will see as many deer as I would traveling south. 7 or 8 years ago, st lawrence county had around 5000 car deer accidents in one year. Now the pop has leveled off, so permit numbers are down. It has nothing to do with a bad winter kill, it has to do with hunters controlling the population. Last year I used my snowblower three times. The weather patterns are changing. there seem to be more storms that stay south and dump there while it is no snow here.

both

well said doc. Ask any two eco's and you will not the she same answer as to the law. A lot is left to the interpretation of the officer.

I never said I have not missed a deer. I said I have not missed with a ml. I also did not say that my way was the only way. And as soon as I fire off the ml, I am reloading., the same as one puts another shell in the chamber of a modern gun. I just dont get the hate. Call me names all you like the old sticks and stones thing. You are the one by admission in your posts took a gun with minimum experience with a site system with minimum at best experience and said you shot 4 times at a deer. Then when questioned you went into attack mode. That tells me you know what you did was not the best situation and you attack due to knowing so rather than say yup what I did was not the smartest thing I could have done hoping I will give up on you. See I still have faith in you that you can recover from this and do better. The first step to getting help is admitting you have a problem. I will wait for your next round of name calling and defending what was in all honesty a foolish unethical situation at best. I am willling to bet there are a lot more hunters than I that feel the same way.

My dad bought me a muzzleloader to start hunting with. I hunted the frst three years of big game with that ml. I learned to make one shot count. In fact, my modern gun is a single shot 25-06. I like the peole who fire three or four times at a deer to get it. I say the are true sportsmen and fire a couple warning shots, or they practice shoot and release. I guess it is all in what you learn. I personally think every new hunter should have to hunt at least two years with a single shot, but it will never happen.

My first deer was November 13th 1979. I was in a wooden treestand at my families hunting camp. The stand was between a cedar swamp and a field of millet in some hardwoods. At 4PM a crotch horn buck started meandering out of the swamp toward the stand. I was shooting 80 grains of goex black powder and a patched 490 round ball. The gun was a T/C Hawken 50 caliber sidelock. It was in the 30's and a bit if an east wind. The deer walked in front of me at 45 or so yards. I eased the hammer back and worked the gun up while waiting. There was an opening in the edge of the hardwoods and as he stepped out into the opening I took aim and pulled the trigger. A loud boom and puff of smoke filled the air. As the smoke cleared, I could not see the deer at all. As I shook, I climbed down and reloaded the ol smokepole. By th etime I was ready to look for the deer, my uncle was there as he had heard the shot. We went to where I thought the deer was and no sign of anything. My uncle was a very ptient man and waited while I gathered my bearings and went to the actual site where the deer was. He took about three jumps and was lying there. We took care of the deer and got it to camp. I was o pumped and could not wait for my dad to come and see it. See my dad bought me the gun and told me I was going to learn to hunt with a single shot , and know hoe to do it. When my dad got to camp, he had the biggest grin on his face and sure seemed proud. I would like to now tell you about the first deer I ever shot, but it is the same story. My first deer ever was with a muzzleloader and I have been hooked since.

well if you obey the law, you have no worries. It is like getitng a ticket for speeding and blaming the leo

I think more young bucks aka button horns are taken with DMP's than people realize. When the yearly take information is completed, it just says buck take and doe take. It dies not break down number of points etc. I wish it would because from what I have seen especially on my state in land hunting days, a lot of young bucks are taken out before they get a chance to mature and a DMP is put on them, which is legal.

bigget for me 199 9 point. next biggest 174 10 point. No pics sorry.

I was at that seminar also. I was less than pleased also.

Heuvelton area here

6 a here. I hunt the st law valley

oh yeah well my dad can beat up your dad. That is how foolish you sound. When you grow up, I hope you go back and read this to see just how sad it is. You refuse to nswer anything after you ask the question. Let it go man, it is truly getting pathetic

man you need originality. Let me get this straight. You post you took a buddies gun you at best had limited experience with, you admit you only took it to see if you would like open sites which again tells me limited experience. shot 4 times at an obviously dumb deer or a decoy, go home get more loaders and go back and shot a deer. First I wonder if you think anyone really believes this,or if you really are that bad of a hunter. And you get pissed and act juvenile when someone calls you on it. Tells me a lot about how you hunt and act in general. I have no clue where you live, but I hope it is a long way from me. Now again have a nice day. You are turning this into a freak show, so I will not respond again. I will end with the advice my dad gave me a long time ago. Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you know nothing then to open it and prove them right. Take care

just the response I expected. As I knew not assumed you shot it once or twice. If you can do simple math, I said I got my first ml in 1977. That is 33 years. But if in your head it is 70 what can I say but practice practice practice and let your wife balance the check book. You should take your own advice and not ask a question if you do not want the answer. Have a good day.

Even though NY has the highest age, and the young hunters statistically are the safest, NY also has one of the best safety records for hunting incidents. I think they go together. That beibg said, I think the age should be lowered with the correct supervision. And when I was 13 or 14, if my dad had a chance to go to a new place to hunt and I could go along, I would be there regardless if I could hunt or not. I love the line by moosemike. They are mentored, you just hve to be within shooting distance. I woud prefer to be next to them, now within the distance they can shoot me.