nyslowhand

Now that's a new one! Never heard anyone reverting back to the atatal! Love to see that!

Sort of a twin to the "Why do you hunt?" thread, eh? Few things more pertinent to this topic than other are; Gave up auto shotgun years ago in favor of single shot ML. Had to give up having beagles, so I do miss rabbit hunting w/dog(s). Same idea of physical limitations, don't walk numerous miles while turkey hunting anymore. My ATV paths & stand locations are situated secondarily for ease of retrieval. No more long drags! Not that I'm lazy or physically unfit, but have to hunt much smarter with advancing age. Much more selective of bad weather days I might hunt than when my time in the woods was limited by work. Apparently I've developed ADD, my attention span is ~3-4hrs in the stand. All day hunts are a thing of the past. The kill has really become secondary to the overall experience! Pass on a lot more bucks than I would have 20 years ago. Haven't shot any small game in decades. Would rather simply watch & enjoy nature! Being a dinosaur, really hate some technology advances. Do have to give kudos for the advent of the cell phone. Not for the obvious texting, gaming or web browsing, but ability to be in contact with family &/or friends while in the stand. Peace of mind for everyone!

Early on in my youth, it seemed to be about the killer instinct and the meat I could provide my family. After 10-15 years of hunting, it became more about the escape from reality, getting back to nature & the mental therapy it provided, while still getting a deer for the freezer. Past 15 or so years, it has become solely about the challenge of hunting with a bow or ML, the ability to pick 'n' choose what I harvest w/o any "meat" pressures, donating venison and a general giving back to nature philosophy. Is this possibly the way hunters evolve or mature over their hunting lifetime? Am the outlier stat?

I strictly shot 340 wgt carbon arrows, so I can't speak of your comparison. IMHO, the shooting issues you put forth would effect any arrow regardless of wgt or construction. Think a misnomer might be that lighter arrows are not as strong as heavier alum arrows. Also an arrows length (total wgt) effects penetration. The 340gr @ 30" is pretty comporable in total wgt to a heavier 400gr @ 26" length. Back to the Ke formula - the "v" component of the formula is squared for the slightly faster light arrow and will achieves an ≥ Ke in the comparison I suggested. BTW - yes, "v" of an arrow varies, but for Ke calc it is at impact. The construction of modern carbon arrows is a phenomenon of technology. But they will snap compared to alum arrows merely bending. Ever watch any YouTube slo-mo vids of an arrow's flight? Carbon arrows do flex and gyrate somewhat until the fletchings gain control and they stablilize in flight, even under ideal conditions. Probably more so the slimmer &/or longer they are or the size/length of the vanes. Maybe we should suggest this as an episode for the Mythbuster to resolve by shooting arrows of different weights & BH types into those gel blocks! lol Back to our regular programming, trade-offs & personal preferences! Mainly, as others have suggested, there is a sweet spot in arrow wgt for your scenario & equip. I know it's aginst the guy code, but bigger isn't always better! Yeah, still taking arrow weight.....

In my experience, trying to sneak up on a turkey(s) is a futile, losing exercise. Generally, when you spot them with the naked eye, they've seen you first! Only bad things can come from attempting this! Glassing is something I don't do, but may work better. As was already mentioned and as tempting as it may be, never use a turkey call in pre-season scouting! Setting yourself up for failure when the season does open! Last thing you'll have to take for what it's worth - from my experience hunting turkeys annualy in the same habitat. terrain and for a minimal turkey population, I never get excited about their roosting locations until the week before opening day. At that time, they're generally roosting in the same general vicinity if not the same trees on May 1st. Typically in a normal year and as the season progresses, the Toms do venture further to find receptive hens and will roost in different areas. Of course, this may be different where &/or how you hunt!!!

Lawdwaz...Think a better analogy would be to compare being hit by either a golf ball or a baseball at ~260/270fps. Which BTW equates to ~180mph. My choice would be neither!! This is one of this forum's annual threads, that always seems to end up with no clear cut choice, other than personal choice! Much like discussions about the "best deer rifle"! Think this discussion is overlooking the idea or theory of what is the appropriate penetration to get a quick & ethical kill on a whitetail sized animal with "cut on contact" archery equipment. Okay, so if your shot is less than ideal and hits a shoulder blade, granted a heavier arrow will compensate for a marginal shot placement. The type of BH also comes into play in these scenarios! No offense meant, I've been there & done that myself. Game bigger than deer would certainly need to be considered in choice of arrow wgt. Assuming all the s/u variables (and physics) mentioned in above posts are equal; my question is.... Aside from the obvious blood trails, is a complete pass thru a more lethal shot than one with only 1/2 the arrow (~13-14") penetrating the chest cavity?? As most will already know, another confusing point to some may be that the physics of Ke in "stick & string" relates only to penetration. Not to be confused with Ke in the ballistic comparisons of expanding projectiles, bullets. If there were an obvious choice as to whether a lighter or heavier arrow were the better option, wouldn't there be only one available? Marketing & personal choice are the chief influences in arrow selection. I shoot a lighter arrow wgt for the benefits they offer and have been more than satisfied with their penetration. More power to those that choose heavier arrows, but they do come with their own drawbacks. In the end...chose what works best for you!

In theory, an owl call is for locating roosted gobblers either pre-dawn or after sunset. I use the owl call mainly the week before season opens in the pre-dawn hours. As smart as a tom is, he'll generally roost in the same vicinity during the breeding timeframe, if...undisturbed. Hooter is put away after the sun comes up and the crow call comes out. In my experience, they do NOT always respond to a locator call! Have heard toms gobbling at fire or police sirens, car horns, neighborhood dogs barking or any noise that will evoke a shock gobble. Toms will (generally) respond to a gobble, but use with extreme caution and only if you absolutely know you're the only hunter around. Definitely not advised for public land use!!!!!!!!!! They'll also usually respond to a hen yelp, but you had better be ready to instantly s/u if you get a tom responding. These locating calls have worked for my style of hunting, walking around trying to locate a gobbler (run & gun) after any stationary sunrise s/u. Suppose different calling stategies are required if you're s/u in a blind trying to intercept them along known travel/feeding routes. The disclaimer to using locating calls is that if not authentic, natural sounding or overused, you may not get a response to them. Secondly, they are wild animals and have moods, each one is a little different Not unlike a buck chasing a doe, a tom with a hen(s) has one thing on his mind and regardless of what you do (calling) he may not want to disclose his location and lose his chance at "love" with his bird in hand! lol

TW security system comes with Vign Rhames standing guard duty 24/7/365. lol

Out of curoisity, what do you attribute this seemingly high winter kill to? Early deep snow cover in your area that stressed the deer early & then downhill from there? Or aren't those #s unusually high?

Saw this in this AM's newspaper. Cartoonist has a bizarre sense of humor, which suits me!

^^^^ Do these mid-west states offer any explaination for this downward trend? Possibly the amount of that land for the "average joe" to hunt has become owned/leased by outfitters. Remember reading a couple years ago that the Lakoskys either owned or leased a combined total of ~5K acres.

I just know I'm going to get crucified for this, but here goes... Isn't this "mindset" the trophy hunting phenomenon? Which along with being propagated on TV shows and social media, the DEC has also bought into! The dilemma the DEC has created thru their own making is to promote trophy hunting and then saying that hunters must also shoot a lot of does while hunting for "racks". Yeah, right! Not to contradict Oprah or Dr Phil, but people rarely change and the DEC has no hope of changing this behavioral pattern with their current thinking.

Apparently I'm one of those individuals that isn't grasping the DEC's big picture or I simply have tunnel vision. Seems to be pretty obvious, in my feeble mind, if the goal is to get more deer harvested in the SZ overpopulated areas, why not have a any legal weapon season Nov 1st thru the weekend after Thanksgiving. Even if only for a trial peroid. Isn't regular (gun) season in the SZ "less important" strictly due to when it falls on the calendar relative to the deer's annual life cycle?

I use ladder stands soley. One of my pet peeves is the mfger's advertised stand height. Some are to the platform, while most are to the gunrail. I have one that is 20' to the platform, adding another ~4' when standing shooting a bow. This gives way too much of any angled shot for my tastes at 20yrds or less. For strictly gun hunting, this is a non-issue. The best ladderstand....sort of a subjective thing. Did you mean material & construction, safety or stability, comfort, platform/seat size, cost..? Firstly, any one with ladder rails made from more substantial material than the typical 3/4-1" rectangular tubing. All the ladderstands I own have terrible seat & back cushions, so you have to improvise per your own seating comfort. Another place the mfger's do "cost savings" is the supplied straps & lashing ropes. I've had to buy more substantial ratchet straps & larger diameter lashing rope to give me a "warm & fuzzy" feeling about safety. Last thing on my ultimate ladderstand list is mfger supplied foot pads for the base of the ladder sections. My DIY solution is a 20-24" length of pressure treated 2x10". Best ladderstand I own, a F&S model from Dick's with large platform & very substantial "D" section ladder rails. Believe I paid ~$135, during a pre or end of season sale. Everyone knows this, but beware of s&h for catalog or on-line sellers.

^^ Bingo ^^! There is no possible way to perform any scientific census of the deer population, understandably it's all guess-timation. Below is a quote from DEC's website, NY's Deer Mgmt and specifically the Data Collection section: "DEC staff inspect deer at check stations, meat cutters, and elsewhere and review mandatory "report cards." These yield information on age, sex, physical condition and location of deer harvested. We combine this with information from fieldwork, surveys and public input to assess deer populations and habitat conditions. We refine the deer management program as necessary to provide the best program possible." Don't know this for a fact, but betting the insurance & agricultural industries have a huge lobbying presence with the DEC. They'd probably just as soon see the whitetail become extinct than to pay out annual claims for car-deer accidents, agr crop damage or attempt to protect their investments. The DEC's surveys are a joke. Last Bow Hunters Survey I filled out, I reported seeing 60-70 deer at one specific location (township). Which were the same 10-12+ deer being sighted numerous times. So,..the DEC assumed I had 60-70 deer within that specific location? Overpopulation..? Also curious to know what "public input to assess deer populations and habitat conditions" means or entails. Sounds subjective.

Just talked to an apple farmer this AM that has a number of orchards of varied fruits, mostly apples. They use/hire a company out of Flordia also. He mentioned most of local fruit farmers do the same. Also said beekeepers won't allow them to use pesticides until bees have done thier pollination duties & are gone. Interesting stuff!

Saw that too, then realized it took into account the typical ~40/45% reported harvest vs actual kills. Fudge factor, of sorts!

As dumb as statewide AR is, this new proposal is even stupider. Can only speak about where I hunt (8F), but the 1st two weeks of bow season I rarely see a buck anyways! This is the time when I take a doe anyways. If I can't carry-over an unused regular season buck tag or an either sex tag into the late SZ ML season, I won't be hunting then. Only mgmt proposal I'd really buy into is an earn-a-buck plan. Or maybe a donate a doe to earn-a-buck..!?! Hint to the NYDEC...Why establish a long range plan like you did if you are only going to implement "knee-jerk" mgmt proposals. Maybe it's time for a new commissioner!??!

You're the man Wooly, no recoil pad. My NEF is possibly a newer or upgraded model (Pardner) in 12ga, 3 1/2", camo with an Xtra full choke tube. It has a modest recoil pad. I've had a bruised shoulder a few times from mine! See it also comes in a 10ga, 3 1/2"mag. That dude is definitely not for the faint of heart! Anyone that has shot a single barreled shotgun knows what I mean!

Anyone see this article in NY Outdoor News? Probably been on every deer hunter's mind considering the severe February we had this year. Mostly retreaded news, but some new &/or interesting points added. http://www.outdoornews.com/March-2015/Deer-need-a-break/

Anyone remember these 1st TVs? Humongous console with about a 10-12" B&W screen and packed full of tubes. How about hauling a shoebox full of the vacuum tubes to a store that had a tube tester so you could fix the TV yourself, since there weren't a lot of TV techs around back then.

Or during a job interview being asked this stupid question straight from Interviews for Dummies ; Where do you see yourself in 5 years?

My #1 (oops, the hashtag) pet peeve or grammarphobia is when someone is responding to a question during a conversation by starting it with: "Yeah, no....". WTH does that mean? Is that a yes, a no or do I assume you don't know???

Just when I thought I could start the countdown....you're not helping!!! lol

Does anyone remember the specifics about just why the corruption commission was disbaned? Cumo agreed to decommission the investigations if the legislature passed his proposed budget, on time. It was all over the news and I thought it was pretty odd at the time. He was sort of admitting he knew his legislators were corrupt, he'd look the other way if they'd greased his palms by passing the budget. What's that say about our NYS elected officials and how our state is run??? Pretty sure Silver is only the tip of the iceberg! May be just a personal vendetta, but I'm hoping Skelos is under investigation also.