wolc123

Sometimes I envy the retired guys and the ones with lots of extra vacation time who can hunt thru the week all the time. I have to do most of my deer hunting on the weekends. Last holiday weekend I was away, so my local spots have had a real good rest from hunting pressure. I am looking forward to some action, which has been lacking for me since the first hour of opening day. My plans for Saturday, are to hunt my favorite hang-on stand in the woods over at my folks place in the morning, eat lunch with them, then head back to my big comfortable two-story blind at the edge of the woods until dark. I am going to "force" some action, by bringing along my pellet gun for the afternoon hunt. The area around that blind has been infested with gray squirrels this year. They have been running right up around the rails of my blind, taunting me as I sit there with my slug gun, waiting in hopes that deer will show up. They will be in for a surprise tomorrow. There is not room for much more venison in our freezer right now, but plenty for a few squirrels. I will be very happy with a single grey squirrel thru the weekend. Anything more is just a bonus. I will also have my slug gun with me the blind, just in case a deer shows up (still have (3) dmp's and my buck tag). The pellet gun should be silent enough to not scare away any deer.

It sounds like you agree that the mature bucks might be using the younger ones as "tools", or "scouts". I am just thankful that I stuck with my (at least three points on a side rule), during the first half of the season(s), to get a little more meat out of my buck tags. Does are nearly impossible to get in my spots, so I need to make those two buck tags count for as much meat as possible.

For a two week season, I am just fine with my $ 250 Barnett Recruit (5 for 5 on deer - all bucks, but 0 for 1 on grouse). I don't expect that I will ever upgrade, because I don't expect NY state will ever change the rules and allow full inclusion. No matter though, because we have the best two weeks of archery season and my cheapo gets the job done just fine every time. My crossbow deer take in six of those two-week seasons has almost caught up with my vertical bow take in thirty month(s) long archery seasons with my vertical bow. I have just about the cheapest crossbow of anyone I know (except MOOG). It almost seems to me that the more folks spend on their crossbows, the less success they have had with them. If a miracle does occur, and NY passes full inclusion, I will probably upgrade just a tad to one of them Centerpoint models. That would be more to give me a "spare" than an upgrade.

Like I said earlier, they don't "send them out". In fact, I don't believe there is any communication between the young and old bucks. The older bucks are simply using the younger ones as tools, to insure that the "coast is clear" before they enter a new area where they may encounter trouble. Certainly, the big two-story blind at my place is such a threat. The older buck this year gave me a stare down that was longer than any other has in my 38 hunting seasons, even after his "little-buddy" passed by unharmed. It seemed like a half hour, but was probably closer to 15 minutes. It was very obvious that he was suspicious of danger in the area. I doubt he would have ventured past that blind in the daylight, had the little guy not made it safely past first (my answer to your question is "after dark"). This was also not the first time this happened to me in that very blind, although the previous "older buck" was just 2.5. I have to admit that I was fully expecting and ready for the 3.5 when he came out this year. I would not have been, had the same thing not occurred, at the same spot, 3 years prior. Killing that older buck was litterally "childs play" this year, because I was ready and expecting it. I have not had an easier shot with my crossbow in the 6 seasons that I have had it. I would have had a much tougher time killing the scout, who appeared totally unexpected, and caught me unready. The bottom line here is, just like crow hunting: "don't shoot the scout".

I don't think he "sends him out first", but I do think that he deliberately follows him around to keep himself safe. As I said above, I don't think the young ones have a clue what is going on, but the older ones certainly do. I don't think we have any disagreement here. Do you think mature bucks might purposely stay close to but behind a younger buck ? Why would that be ?

Per FSW, the 2.5 that I killed in 2016 was not "mature", but this year's 3.5 might just make the cut. He was pre-rut, as his neck was not swelled up yet and there was still lots of fat on him. Certainly, the 3 pointer that preceded him, by less 5 minutes, might fit the definition of a "scout". Had I killed him, the big 8 might still be breathing. I can't help but wonder how many folks are missing chances at larger bucks, by shooting the first smaller one that walks into range, no matter what part of the season it might be. My examples occurred pre or early rut. Having seen this happen twice with my own eyes, you will have a hard time convincing me that older bucks do not use younger scouts. They certainly do at my place. Have you ever passed on a smaller buck and then had a significantly larger (and at least a year older) buck, appear from the same spot less than 5 minutes later ? If so, do you think there was any type of "relationship" between the pair ? In both of my cases, I doubt that the smaller/younger bucks were aware of how they were being "used" by the larger/older bucks. I have little doubt that the older bucks knew exactly what they were doing however.

Lots of folks seem to think that, but none of them must have actually tried it. I have power washed about about (7) and have yet to break a nasal bone. In fact, the nasal bones on all of them held up better than the one a buddy did for me using the conventional boil and pick method. My guess is that the hot or boiling water weakens the bones while the cold stuff from a pressure washer does not. One thing I have not heard of is someone who used a pressure washer and then went back to other methods. That ought to tell you something.

I would sort of like that "Riflemen" book by Oliver North.

Deer really only like soybeans when they are young and green. I never understood why anyone would want to plant them in the spring for deer hunting. If you want to plant just one time with minimal equipment, I would go with a mix of winter wheat, white clover, and soybeans, broadcast around September 1. Deer like wheat better than rye. That will give you good attraction the first fall. If the first killing frost is late, the soybeans will give you top-notch early October attraction. The white clover will give you a few more years of decent attraction, and can be maintained with just a few mowings per season. Chop off the remaining wheat with a mower before it goes to seed the following late spring. That will give you 3-4 years from just one day's planting on that area. With lots of equipment, if I only plant one thing, it is usually corn.

Go back about 45 minutes before daylight (longer if it is far from where you park). Check what direction the wind is blowing. Walk to a position that is about 50 yards downwind of where you think they were bedded and sit tight. Wait for daylight and hope to see them again. You can't shoot before legal daylight (I dont load my gun until then). The key is for you to see them before they smell, hear, or see you (wind will help with the smell and hear parts, and some cover and keeping still will help with the "see" part).

Congrats on that kill. I am not certain how many button bucks that I have killed in my 38 seasons, but the number might be between 12 and 20. Those included many "firsts" including my first deer with a gun, first with a bow, first during the late muzzleloader season, first from the ground with a crossbow, and first "double". When filling dmp tags, I always target the largest deer in the group first and that has often turned out to be a button buck, especially when it is just a single deer or a pair. I am the only hunter in our family and we get most of our protein from venison. I am not blessed with enough opportunities at antlerless deer to be real fussy about which ones I do and do not shoot at. Oddly enough, I have never killed a doe fawn. One thing is for sure, there are no finer eating bucks on the table. It is always cause for great celebration, in our family, when I bring home a "fatted calf" like that. The livers are especially good. Hopefully you did not leave that in the gut pile. One of the best things about button bucks, is that the meat can be processed and froze right away, without aging a while (at 32-42 deg F) for the rigor mortis to work out, as must be done with older deer unless you don't mind all the extra chewing required. I still have (4) antlerless tags left and I am really hoping to be able to use one of them on a button buck. I guess my regular season buck tag also turns into an either/or tag for the late ML season, so I could legally take (5) of them this year, if I still have it by then. I will be super thankful for just one however, but I really don't expect it. button bucks have been an "every other year" thing since my first year hunting. The odd number years are the off ones for me and button bucks. If anyone is heartbroken over killing one, shoot me a pm and I will gladly take it off your hands for you.

The 12 ga, 2-3/4" SST's have always grouped good from my Marlin 512 (except for last season when my old Bushnell Banner 4X scope crapped out on me). Most of the deer that I have taken with them have been struck on the shoulder blade and have dropped dead in their tracks. With the messed up scope, (2) SST's struck far left last season. The first shot (from a hundred yard range) passed thru just below the spine and above the guts. The 3.5 year old, 182 lb field-dressed buck kept walking. He stopped after a few steps and the second slug struck about 2" higher, breaking his spine and knocking him down on his back. I finished him off with a third off-brand slug fired to the neck from point-blank range. I was expecting to loose most of the backstraps from that deer, but was surprised to find that the meat damage was very minimal, and only a bloodied up chop or two had to be trimmed away. By contrast, I lost about 1/3 of the backstraps from a 3.5 year old doe this year. She was struck in the same place on the spine with a single 16-gauge Remington slugger, foster-type slug. I hope to try those 12 gauge SST's again this weekend. I treated the bolt and firing pin on my Marlin with a good dose of CLP and I hope that will prevent freeze up on Saturday. It froze up on me last year, after I dropped it in the swamp while dragging out the heavy buck. That cost me a "chip-shot" at a doe that ran thru right under my stand, pursued by a couple of love-starved young bucks. This Sunday is supposed to be warmer, so I should not have any freeze-up issues then, even if the CLP don't do the trick. I still have a buck tag and (3) DMP's and I have really been wanting to try out the new Redfield Revolution 2-7X scope that I put on that gun this spring.

48", and the largest one that I have landed. I rarely target them, but get a few by "accident" now and then while bass fishing. They only had to be 44" to keep on the upper Niagara back then (now they need to be 54"). I have a couple other "by-accident" fish mounted, including a walleye and a northern pike, but I have never had a bass mounted. I got the idea for the musky in the billiard room from George Bolt, at his place on Heart Island up on the St Lawrence.

The 3.5 year old buck on the left was boiled. Big mess to clean up, smelly, and took quite a while. The 2.5 year old one on the right was skinned raw and power-washed. It took less than an hour, start to finish, no smell, and the birds cleaned up all the mess. That is the only way that I do them now.

My grandad's old16 gauge Ithaca model 37 kicks like a mule but it has brought down every deer that I have shot it at, since I mounted a 1.5X Weaver scope on it back around 1983. I only hunted with my dad's Browning sweet 16 one time, but I went two for two on ruffed grouse on that hunt, and they were both difficult shots. Those experiences have made the 16 gauge number one for me. I also think the looks and proportions are just right. The barrels on the 20's look too skinny and 12's look too fat. The only downside is the ammo cost and availability. No big deal for me though. At the rate I am using them, I should have an easy lifetime's supply of 16 gauge Remington sluggers, that I picked up for 20 cents each. Here is this year's handiwork:

The white hots might be the cleanest currently available in pellets, but the loose blackhorn 209 is supposedly less corrosive, cleaner burning, and produces more velocity. It would be nicer if they made it in pellets however, and I am hoping they might by next season. This year, I am sticking with my remaining supply of 777 pellets. I hope I can fill my gun buck tag this weekend with my slug guns. If not, it is good to have the ML working again. I just scored a vacation day on Friday for ML weekend, and I already had that Monday off. If nothing else, I will still have an antlerless-only tag that I can use then. Good luck with your's also.

I was able to free up the firing pin on my T/C Omega tonight with some CLP. I put a few drops on each end of the pin and also removed the small screw below it and added a several drops of CLP in the screw port, then put the screw back in. After this lubricant treatment, I pushed/pried the pin back and forth with a screwdriver a few times, before it freed up. Now it is back to working normally. The hole thru the breech plug has also clogged up with corrosion a few times, and I had to open it back up with a small drill bit. Next season, I will switch to Blackhorn 209 powder and hopefully be done with the corrosion issue.

Liver from a pre-rut, well bled-out, 3.5 year old whitetail buck, with onions and a Genny light. Some red meat was a welcome change, after getting all of my protein from birds over the last (4) days. The key to making those livers from older deer tender, is to hold them in the fridge for about a week, prior to freezing. I am looking forward to the leftovers for lunch at work tomorrow. No photographers around today for a medium-rare "cooked" picture, but it is still inside on this one taken late in the morning, a month ago today:

I see that a lot late in the rut or post rut. I always attributed it to the fact that the bucks basically stop eating during the rut and loose strength in their legs, while the does continue to feed and remain strong and fast. I think that is part of nature's way of protecting the mature females from predators like wolves and coyotes. They can catch up with the rutted out bucks but the mature does are the hardest for them to catch, and the most necessary for the survival of the species. Mature bucks and fawns are more "expendable". That is just basic "nature 101". The mature bucks hanging around with a "little buddy", before and during the early rut seems to be an entirely different phenomena. It is almost like they are thinking "lets see if he makes it thru there safely, before I come out". That definitely seemed to be the case with the two 3-point - 8-point pairs at my place in 2016 and 2019. Each of those mature bucks was killed from a big two-story blind that has been in the same place for about 10 years. I think the older bucks associated the blind with danger, and refused to pass it in the daylight until their little buddies made it thru. In the case of the wild turkey scouts: in that particular woods, I frequently see deer and turkey together. Each species seems to use the other for their particular stronger senses. The deer appreciate the turkey's superior eyesight, while the turkeys benefit from the stronger sense of smell of the deer. It is kind of like the convoy systems that kept freighters safer from subs during WW I and II.

When I look back at the last (6) mature bucks (for me that means 2.5 years or older) that I have killed, I find it very interesting that 1/2 of them used scouts of one form or another. I had heard of that for crow hunting, but it is very clear to me that whitetail bucks also utilize scouts. My 3.5 year old gun-buck from 2012 employed a flock of wild turkeys as his scouts. I shot that buck in heavy cover, right in the middle of that flock of turkeys, wearing a blaze orange camo jacket, and having just descended from a tree stand that was above the patch of cover. My 2.5 year crossbow buck from 2016 used tiny-bodied, 1.5 year old 3-pointer as his scout. That little buck walked 10 yards from me, stood broadside, and looked away, almost begging me to shoot him. less that two minutes after I gave him a pass and he walked into the adjacent cover, the larger buck appeared from the same spot he did. The rack on this one was significantly larger, and the body looked to be at least 2X in size. He took a slightly different path and did not offer quite as easy of shot, but there is no doubt that he would have lived, had i shot the scout. I got a good look at the little scout a couple weeks later, when a neighbor killed him by accident. He did not see the tiny rack, and he thought he was a doe. Dejevu happened with my 3.5 year old crossbow buck this year. This time both the big buck and the little buck were considerably larger. Even though it happened in the first hour of daylight on opening day of crossbow season, I was sorely tempted by the 3-point scout. His rack was significantly larger than that from 2016. His neck was swollen and his body looked fairly large as he began to work a scrape just 10 yards from my stand. He stood up on his back legs, to reach the licking branch above the scrape, offering me a perfect Biz-o-world type "shirt-pocket" shot. It was all I could do to hold off, but maybe, just maybe, history would repeat itself. Sure enough, less than (5) minutes later, Mr big 8 shows up. Mr big 8, once again appeared from the exact same spot, but he hung up about 50 yards out, locking eye contact with me. I won the stare down, and eventually he started moving closer. I moved my eye towards my scope, taking full advantage of the crossbows ability to fire without a rapid draw movement. It was awesome watching him walk into the viewing field of the scope and only needing to move my trigger finger when he stopped, with his chest aligned with the crosshairs.

During gun season, I wear just a blaze orange hat, when walking to and from my stand, regular camo jacket and bibs. When I get up in the stand (out of the crossfire), I switch to a camo hat. If I am sitting on the ground (which is normally only in the lower hunter density northern zone), I hang the orange hat above my head, then put on the camo hat. I use to wear a blaze orange camo jacket during gun, but the deer in our area often use wild turkeys as scouts, which can pick that stuff out from a mile away.

The areas that I hunt in the southern zone are extremely flat, with a total change in elevation of less than 4 feet over an area of approximately 100 acres. In that situation, getting up in the air a bit, not only makes me feel safe from others stray rounds, but also gives me confidence that the ground will form a backstop for my own shots. With ground that flat, just 10 feet up is more than enough, and most of my stands are only about 7 feet up. Many years ago, I walked to the edge of our farm, to shorten the range to a doe which had stepped thru a hedgerow at the border. The next field was owned by a neighbor, who did not hunt, but gave permission to me and the neighbor on the other side. When I stepped thru that hedgerow, my hair was parted by the first of (5) slugs fired at that doe by a "guest" of the other neighbor. I hit the dirt, and the dirt started hitting me, as (4) more slugs landed nearby. The doe was out in the middle of the field, half-way between me and that neighbor's guest. I was wearing blaze orange, but all he saw was that deer. That was all it took to drive me up into a tree most of the time, where I am far more comfortable than on the ground. Feeling the pressure wave of a bullet, before hearing the report, is something that makes quite an impression on you. Many of those, who have been in combat situations, have a good understanding of that feeling. If there would be some way to demonstrate that feeling, in the hunter safety training course, there would likely be a lot less accidents. My fear of being shot by accident only applies to flatlands of high hunter density. I am comfortable hunting from the ground in hilly areas, of lower hunter density, such as exists thru most of the northern zone. For me, 7 ft is the perfect height. High enough to get out of the crossfire, and make a backstop for my own shots, but low enough that a fall would hopefully not result in serious injury. That being said, my most comfortable stands are 7 feet up and have a three foot high combination safety rail/shooting rest/wind break/cover fence, all the way around.

The "nonsence" is thinking there is a "lull" following the peak. In reality, there is a continuous lessening after Veteran's day, with no second peak.

Some doe come into heat early, some don't get bred on the first cycle, and go thru a second cycle. There is a continuous progression, starting about a month prior to Veteran's day, peaking on Veteran's day, and slowly diminishing until about January 1. The "2nd Rut" thing is basically nonesence. In NY state, the closer it is to Veteran's day, the better your odds of finding a buck on a doe.

My feet were just fine in a $ 40 pair of army surplus mickey mouse boots and a pair of wool blend socks, sitting still for 4 hours in 9 degrees F up north this morning. Why anyone would want to spend more than that on cold weather boots is beyond my understanding. They are also waterproof, but only about 10" high.