wolc123

If you try the nuts, make sure to do them with butter like him and Chef do. I used olive oil the last time, and they were not as good. Also remember to slit them first, so they don't "explode" in the frying pan. I only like liver from a 6 month old deer. On the older ones, it is always a bit too tough for my liking. Pickled heart is very good. That makes it easier to understand why he passed that bear from the initial post. I would be pretty reluctant to kill another if that happened to me.

Can you PM me your address so I can send you the lower jaw for proper ageing ? I will do the Euro on Saturday with my power washer. I usually determine the age based on the skull size. My preliminary guess for this one is, based on the 182 pound field-dressed weight and the 10" G-2 lengths is 3.5 years. By "normal", are you talking about one of those $ 40 "made in China" Harbor-freight models ? What is wrong with a "legal for trade", "made in USA", Chatilion butcher's balance ?

I don't see how that would help. The weight was 12 pounds over not under. I suppose a seamstress tape would have broken if I pulled it as tight as the carpenter's scale though, and the looser pull may have given better agreement with the PA chart. I think the real reason both SJ's daughters and my own heavier field-dressed weights, compared to the PA chart predictions, is because the farther north you go, the heavier the deer get.

I got around to butchering the 182 pound, 42" chest girth western NY buck that I took on opening day last night (was up past midnight doing it). After 11 days of hanging with the hide on and the temp at 33 - 40 degrees, it was aged just right. The meat felt like it did when fresh killed. Surprisingly, the meat damage was far less than I expected, having taken (3) 12 gauge sabot slugs (one just below the spine, one just above and a "finisher" to the neck). All three passed thru, so energy transfer was incomplete. The bloodied meat likely totaled around 1 pound. I also trimmed off most of the fat, which might have totaled 5 pounds. I left the liver in the woods, as I always do from deer more than 6 months old. I wonder if the PA chart considers that part of the edible meat. The heart was big (kept for pickling), probably weighing about 1.5 pounds. The high slug took out just a couple of chops and what remained of the tenderloins filled (3) quart bags. I also made (2) small quart-bag sized roasts. The rest made (38) quart bags of grind. We ate the tenderloins the day after the kill. The total weight of edible meat that we kept had to be around 90 pounds. The PA chart shows 94 pounds edible for a 42" chest girth and 103 pounds edible for a 182 pound carcass weight. That is plenty close enough for me. Next time I might not pull the tape measure quite so tight, then maybe the weight correlation will be a little closer. The PA chart showed a field-dressed weight of only 170 pounds for a 42" chest girth.

Nice going. You got a tape measure handy ?

Because it is a meat-hunter's paradise. I can't even imagine another state where it would be half as easy to live a subsistance lifestyle, off the fat of the woodlands and waters, and none have a better climate or scenery (I can take the cold a lot better than the heat). Watching them reality shows from Alaska, it looks like even those folks usually struggle to get enough meat to last thru the winter. I am thankful for our high taxes, and semi-disfunctional politics. Without that, the traffic would be a lot worse on the roads and the competition would be much greater for our abundant fish and wildlife. Some of that tax money goes towards feeding the poor, disabled, and elderly and I have no problem with that. The gun laws don't bother me because I have little use for a semi-auto or pistol anyhow. I would be happy with a bolt-action if they ever come for my Ruger 10/22. Heaven will be, but certainly no place on earth will be better than living in upstate NY. Those who are thinking the grass is greener someplace else might be in for a rude awakening.

No one has thicker skin than me, so let's hear it. I will forgive you in advance. I have not heard of anyone else cleanly executing a THS . You are the one I owe the thanks for proving the perfect shot placement with that handy orange plastic bore gauge. Why do you think they shorted you 4 points in the 2018 whitetailNY challenge ?

Mostly due to all the horror stories I read here of folks knocking them down and then loosing them. In addition, a buddy from work had that happen on my farm on opening day last season. He chose to text me that he had one down, rather than using his finger on his trigger to put it down for good. I ain't into feeding coyotes and you can't eat those little green tags. This one stayed on his feet after the first hit. The second hit knocked him down with a broken back. He was pulling himself up with his front legs when I gave him the third to the neck as a "finisher". I hate to see any animal suffer. All the slugs passed thru though, so they did not contribute to his 182 pound field-dressed weight on a 1/4 pound accuracy scale. All the shots were broadside, the first striking above the spine, the second right on it from about 100 yards away. The third to the neck was from point-blank range. Had he been facing away I probably could have put him down with one of those of the type that TF mentioned. It would have been tougher fitting a big 12 gauge into that hole where I put a .30 cal last time. Surely it would have bruised up the tenderloins a little bit.

Anyone seeing any on the deer this year ? I just completed skinning my fourth one and have yet to find a tick on one. Two of those were from an Allegheny county town, where I have found a few while skinning deer in years past. The other two were from an Erie county town, where I have never found any. One from each spot was a 6 month old (bb and doe) and were skinned the day after they were killed. The other two were mature bucks that were skinned over a week after they were killed (hung with hides on and temperature in the mid 30'3 to low 40's). Maybe the colder weather this fall has kept them in check. Next weekend, I will probably head up to the Northern zone town where I found hundreds on the last one I brought home. I will never bring another one home from there, to process myself, for that reason. I will have to ask the processor if they find any.

I also trim as much fat and silverskin as time allows, off the meat that I put into grind. It definitely effects the flavor. Does usually have a higher percentage of fat to trim off, which takes more time. I also trim off all the bloodied up stuff around the bullet wounds. That cost me a ton of meat on the one I cut up last night. It don't look like it will be quite as bad on the one I skinned tonight, despite my hitting it with (3) 12 gage sabot slugs. Those look like they messed up the meat considerably less than (2) .243's on the other one. The slugs all passed thru, taking some of their energy into the ground. Both rifle bullets stayed in the deer, turning all of their energy into bloodied up meat and broken bones.

I was not certain if I could "carry" both, but it does say in the NY hunting regs book (big game hunting section) "it is unlawful to hunt big game with: .... any shotgun loaded with shells other than those carrying a single projectile ..." It would have been nice to have a slug in the right barrel (for bears and coyotes), and a 7-1/2 in the left (for grouse and squirrels) but that would have certainly been illegal. I left the slugs in the car while I was small game hunting, just to be safe. It did not matter anyhow because I saw no bears, coyotes, grouse, or squirrels. I did see more deer sign than ever up there (no bear and just one lonely set of coyote tracks). One even walked by (about 75 yards away thru the woods) as I was blowing on a predator call. I had no binoculars at the time, and no optics on my side-by side, so I was not able to identify any antlers. Even that will not matter next weekend, when and if I head back up for the late ML season. I still have tags for antlerless and either/or that would be good up there then in that WMU. If those deer hang around until then, filling one or both of those tags should not be all that difficult. Based on how shot-up the last couple gun-season deer that I am butchering are, I could certainly put that extra venison to good use.

I appreciate your concern Chef, but I think we are going to be ok with these two, as far as the spoilage is concerned anyhow. I stuck a thermometer in one of the bullet-holes of the one that still had the hide on tonight and it read 38 deg F. I finished cutting up the 2-1/2 year old tonight and it was just about right with all the rigor-mortis out of it. Unfortunately it was badly shot up and lots of meat was lost on the rear quarters. I ended up with about 55 pounds of boneless meat after trimming out all the bloody stuff. That is only about 10 pounds more than I got from the big button buck that I killed with my crossbow. Those broadheads do much less damage than the bullets do. Hopefully, there will be a lot less meat damage on the other one. I will find out when I skin it tomorrow night. The temps will be in the lower thirties until it is processed on Wednesday night, so no more high-temp worries anyhow. The PA chart shows 94 pounds of edible from that one but I will be very thankful if I get 75. If I get that, we will have enough venison to last until October 15 next year when I include the roughly 25 pounds that I got from the doe fawn that I cut up last week.

I am processing a 2-1/2 tear old 7 point, that a buddy gave me, and my 3-1/2 year old 6 point over the next few days. The hanging/aging weather has been good, with the temp inside our insulated garage holding at 33-46 F. I always skin one evening, and process the next, to split up the work load. I thought we were going to have plenty of venison, but I am starting to worry a little now, having just got the hide off the 7-pointer last night. When I picked it up, I only noticed a neck shot. I picked what looked like a .243 bullet, out of the hide there on the exit side, and the neck roast is toast. The rear quarters are also in rough shape. It looks like another round entered the ham on one side, mushroomed on the way thru, and stopped under the hide on the other side. At least the backstraps and front shoulders look good. I will salvage what I can for grind from the rest. I always trim off all the bloodied meat. I am also worried about meat-damage on my own buck. I shot three times at it, striking the backstraps near center and the neck for sure. I count three holes on the inboard side and one on the exit. I think my own first shot missed and the other hole may be an arrow or an antler wound. I will know more after skinning it Tuesday night. I have no more vacation time left for hunting and will have to do what I can with my last three DMP's and my (2) archery/ML tags to make up any shortfall, on the next three weekends. Some good news is that the northern zone WMU where my in-laws live has a late ML season. I will have a valid antlerless and either/or tag up there for the weekend of Dec 8/9. While bear/coyote/grouse hunting up there last weekend, I saw more deer sign than I ever have. That looks like it will be my best chance at some more meat. I did not see any coyotes, bear or grouse but I did have one deer in range. If I can not use my late ML buck tag up there, it will be good around home the following weekend. The odds of me filling that around here are very slim however. I have only ever done that on one button buck. As far as next weekend at home with the slug-gun, the chances are slim there also. DMP's are tough to fill around here on opening weekend of gun season and nearly impossible in late season.

Math check: 10 (doe) + 10 (bb) + 16 (6 pt # 1) + 16 (6 pt # 2) = 52 Why is total 48 in running score thread ?

It was kind of like turning the crank handle of an antique tractor when it was left in gear. I did that once with my Allis Chalmers model C. It took off thru the barn crushing everything in its path against the far wall where it finally lost traction. I was very thankful that my crank handle was real long and that it had a tricycle front-end, allowing me to get out of it's way.

Big doe, 1-1/4" long blade knife (very sharp), road-kill tag issued by town police dept.

One time, while a buddy and I were driving thru a neighboring town where no hunting is allowed, we spotted a big "dead" doe next to a mailbox. Her butt felt cool to the touch. Having no idea how "fresh" she was, I decide to just cut off her tail (I use them for tying smallmouth bass jigs). Much to my surprise, that action woke the "sleeping" doe up. Instinctively, I hopped on her back, got her in a hammer lock with my left arm, while jabbing my razor sharp-knife (1-1/4" long blade) into her jugular. The hot blood strayed across my arm as she bucked me off, striking my lower leg with a hoof in the process. After she flopped around in the resident's snow-covered front yard for several minutes, creating a scene resembling a "bloody massacre", we tossed the carcass into the bed of my buddy's pickup truck. Needing a tag, and feeling a little guilty over the legality of the process, we drove directly to the town police station. I suppose the desk officer was somewhat surprised at my blood-soaked appearance when I walked in. He said the resident had reported the "dead" deer, but no one had time to respond (it was late and they were short of staff). He asked us if the deer had to be shot. My reply was: "no, I killed it with my knife". To that he replied: "that would be no". That was his last comment to us. He handed us the carcass tag, we took the deer back to my place to gut, and my buddy took it to his processor. His processor told him that it was the cleanest deer he had handled that season with absolutely no damaged meat. Most likely, the doe had ran into the side of a passing car, knocking herself out. The action of me grabbing her tail was enough to wake her back up. It all came down to being in the right place at the right time. Or wrong place wrong time considering the leg injury to myself. It took a couple days for the swelling to go down the hurt to subside.

That may have seemed like the right thing to do at the time, but in the long run it might have done more harm than good. Kind of like a night or two in jail might be a good thing for a new driver who gets caught with a DWI. Real life is not a Disney movie where there is always a happy ending. It would be interesting to know what that kid thought about it after his father told him the truth, or if he ever did. The hard truth always trumps a white lie

Actually, I should have said "one that would probably have caused the deer's death within 24 hours, had the finisher not been around". That rules out the leg hits and other long term infection type casualties.

Happy Thanksgiving to all those toughing it out, out there on this cold morning. I only made it a couple hours before throwing in the towel. I could have made it longer, had I brought along a quart of hot cider like I usually do on cold days but my daughter's drank up all we had in the fridge. No deer tracks around this morning on the fresh snow, and the only deer sign I saw was the remnants of a couple that I had butchered on the carcass pile across the creek from my bedroom window. I did run across a fresh set of fox tracks. The biggest excitement this morning was hearing something big crashing thru the brush on my walk back. I got into a firing position, just as a big tom turkey busted out of the cover, reminding me of what day it was. Our own venison supply is secure now with two little deer in the freezer and two big ones aging in the garage. My only motivation now is trying to fill one or more of my three remaining DMP's for my brother-in-law (he raises beef and makes the best jerky with a 50/50 venison mix), and to get 10 more points in the contest here. That is not enough motivation for me to endure that cold for very long.

One that is the direct cause of the deer's death within 24 hours. If it takes 24.00000000001 hours, then the other hunter should be able to claim it.

That makes more sense. The problem I have, in the DMU where our farm and my folks is located, is that local farmers hammer the antlerless deer prior to October 1. That makes them few and far between by the time hunting season rolls around. The vast majority of those deer are not tagged, but are left out in the fields to rot or for the coyotes and buzzards. I can get (4) DMP's here every year, but I can't kill what I do not see. The last few years while hunting, I have seen around 3 antlered deer for every antlerless one. In the last (5) crossbow seasons, I have had just one antlerless deer within range, but was able to fill my archery buck tags on (3) of those years. This would be a good zone to hand out some extra buck tags, or better yet, to allow DMP tags to be used on bucks the way it used to be. From what I have seen, antlered bucks cause most of the automobile accidents in this area. I scraped a 3-pointer off the end of my driveway while the kids were out waiting for the bus in early October. I imagine it did some serious damage to someone's car as it had multiple busted legs. All I salvaged was the rack and the tail. If they want to have some special "trophy" areas, where folks could take only one buck, that is fine with me. In other areas, I think the DEC is squandering a good opportunity to have hunters help limit car-deer accidents by limiting buck harvest. If and when one comes thru my front window it may be something to talk to a lawyer about.

A gut-shot is always fatal so my opinion is the guy did the right thing. The gut shooter ought to thank the dispatcher and give him a roast or two (maybe even a backstrap) for shortening his track (plus pay him for the bullet). The deer search guys probably love gut-shot jobs because they are smelly and easy for dogs to follow. If it were a non-fatal hit (like a leg), then the leg-shooter is SOL and the guy who kills it should get it, even if there is snow and the original shooter shows up on the trail.

I think those who purchase archery, regular, and ML tags should be allowed three bucks.

I always try and get the guts out asap, but there are some exceptions. On more that one occasion, dropping a doe with a shoulder blade shot, and not getting on that job right away, has resulted in the harvest of a trailing buck. In that situation, I like to delay it for about a half hour. I was delayed a half hour on the buck pictured above, because I had to get help to drag him thru a swamp. That is how long it took for my brother to arrive at the site. I did not want that muddy swamp water inside the carcass. If you have enough headroom for a hanging scale on your hoist then I agree with the back strain thing. I do not have that much room where I skin and hang (I use to prior to insulating the garage). If you think the PA chest girth chart is "nonsense", why don't you complain to the PA game commission ? I find it a handy tool to estimate the volume of venison that I need to last my family thru the year. In fact, next to Chef's recommendation to the butt-out II, I consider G-man's recommendation of the PA chest girth chart the most valuable information I have learned on this site. It may not give an exact weight but it is close enough for me. Now that I put one on the scale for comparison, I have an idea of what kind of "correction factor" to apply. Weight is not all that important to me anyhow. When you put a fresh-killed deer on scale, most of that weight is made up of water, which has no nutritional value. Volume of venison is my main concern. I know about how many quart packages I need for a year. Keeping records of chest girth per quarts of lean meat obtained would likely be more consistent than correlating it to scale weight.