wolc123

You are right on the money there Doc on the recoil. For those of us who grew up using a shotgun and slugs for deer, almost any rifle is tame. The .30/06, M77 Ruger bolt-action (identical powder load as your .270) that I use now does not feel much different hitting my shoulder as a .22 rim-fire when I compare it to my granddad's old Ithaca featherlight, 16 ga pump shotgun that I still use on occasion. Certainly I can't tell much difference in "shoulder punch" between the .30/06 and my .22/250 of the same model. The recoil reduction argument doesn't hold water with me. I guess it would make a bigger difference in light-weight, carbine models, but it is negligible in a standard weight rifle.

If you want a "challenge" and a heart to eat, put an arrow thru it. It doesn't bloody up any of that tasty meat.

They are all good eating, is that the theme? Not so sure about the stags, never had any, but they look similar to elk so I suppose they would be tastey. It certainly don't get much better than whitetail so your top three picks look good anyhow. I find elk to be close to top-notch on the table also. As for the birds, the only one I really like eating is ruffed grouse, but pheasants are not bad, at least compared to turkey and chicken.

I have not spring turkey hunted in a long time but I do regret not buying tags for the first time in a long time thanks to the changes and elimination of the "super-sportsman" licence. Naturally, I saw or heard/heard about toms everywhere this spring for the first time in many years. As I was planting corn at my place in WNY, 15 minutes after I talked to a couple neighbor hunters who were packing it in after hearing nothing but seeing a couple hens, a big old tom came strutting across the field I was in and I could have shot him from the seat of the tractor. Over at my folks farm, about 20 mi to the east, they talked about seeing toms out in the clover field behind the house almost every day throughout the spring. To top it all off, every morning over this past Memorial day weekend, at the in-laws new Adirondack camp, as I paddled the rowboat out alone on the lake to fish at daybreak, there were at least 6 different toms gobbling on the surrounding hilltops. I will get tags this late-summer for sure, when the Walmart employee asks as I purchase my new licence. Next spring I will carry the unloaded shotgun and a couple shells on the tractor as I plant. If that old bird pulls that trick again I will hop of, load and let him have it. I will also spend a little more time at the folks place who are always looking to get me over there to do "odd jobs" anyhow. And I will definitely pack the shotgun and a little extra bug spray (they were bad in the woods up there this year, but no problem out on the water - another reason I prefer fishing then) on the Memorial day trip. Even though I cant stand eating turkey, my wife and kids love it. The bugs would make that a "less than ideal hunt" however.

That is the best part of the crossbow which, rumor has it, may be made legal for all of archery season this year. Even if it's not, 14 days in the northern-zone and another 14 in the southern should provide me with ample opportunity to at least fill my buck tag again. The first 40 yard group I shot after assembling it last spring could be covered with a golf ball. About 20 more "practice" shots, and I smoked a buck with it, thru the heart, at 59 yards, on the only shot I took during the 14 day southern-zone season last fall. To call the crossbow a "wonder-weapon" is almost an understatement, given how much more capable even an "entry-level" one like I purchased, is on deer. Back when I did use a regular bow, I would pull out my older one in April and do about 20 draws right handed and left handed every other day during my regular workout time, skipping some of my other routines to make up the time. Around mid August, I would start shooting my newer "hunting" bow 3-4 times a week. By October 15 opener, I could keep it in a pie plate every time at 30 yards, but man did it take time and effort to get to that point. It was ok when I was young and single with lots of free time, but the crossbow is a real "God-send" for us old married guy's. Another huge advantage of the crossbow for us older guys with kids and more responsibilities is the elimination of the need to go high up in a tree in order to hide the close-range movement required to draw a regular bow. No big deal if I fell and broke my neck when it was just me I had to worry about. With 3 other hungry mouths to feed now though, that would be a real bad deal. One more advantage of the crossbow regarding drawing and strength-building is that it is a "two-handed" symmetric draw, and also uses some leg strength. It is a much better full-body workout than regular bow-shooting. You wont end up with a developed tricep on the left and bicep on the right like you would if you practiced shooting a regular bow right handed year round. That non-symmetry is also a real good recipe for shoulder issues.

I don't know if there has ever been a coyote attack on a kid in NY. A week ago I saw an adult coyote along the edge of a 3-acre soybean field behind our house at about 6:30 am. When I cultivated the adjacent 3-acres of corn a few days later, I lost one of the shovel/spring cultivator assemblies from the tractor somewhere on the field. Seeing that coyote kept me from offering my (2) 11 year old daughters a $10 reward if they found it for me. With hungry pups to care for now, I bet them coyotes will be a little less selective about what they try and eat. It sure would be nice if NY state let us shoot coyotes year round as most other states do. This would be the easiest time to pick them off, especially the pups before they get "educated". It will probably take a "kid-attack" here to get them to do that. The poor kid will have less of a chance of survival here against our larger, almost wolf-sized "eastern" coyotes, than those kids out in CA had with them pipsqueak, rodent-eating western versions.

I can see where using such a weapon on deer when you have a better one available shows some disrespect for you quarry, and could be seen as selfish by many. There is no hunter I know who could resist the temptation of shooting at the biggest buck of his life if the situation arose, even if it meant pushing the limits a bit. Talk and words are cheap, I would have to see that done to believe it. I would only use it on antlerless deer for certain, and only if my meat supply was secure. Then I could easily resist the temptation of taking a shot with less than 99% certainty. Of the hundred or so deer I have killed over 30 some years, I have only taken three shots where I was more than 98% certain of the kill and 2 of those escaped due to failure to fire, once from my slug gun once from my side-lock ML. Thankfully NY state has reduced the regulations that forced us to use those handicapped weapons and my center fire and in-line ML have never let me down. They are on the right track with the crossbow now also, and I am 1/1 for that and eagerly looking forward to this season where I hear a rumor that they may give us the whole archery season in the Northern and Southern zone. That would be great because I use it in both. I am a pure killer, and being such, the last thing I want to do is "challenge" myself with the possible result of a miss or messy kill. I will always use the most lethal weapon available and affordable to get the job done effectively. I know there are lots of "fighters" out there who thrive on the "challenge", but being a pure killer, I cant begin to "relate" to that. I think such folks should stick with better "fighting" sports like golf, football, baseball, boxing, wrestling, Wi/Atari, where "food" doesn't get messed around with. I even consider "catch and release" fishing as nothing but the "sensless maiming" of a good food supply. Maybe you can get a Wi hunting game that lets you mess around with different calibers and you could go all the way and try a "pellet" rifle on elephant.

Younger bears, under 250 pounds or so, are better eating in general. The taste is very good, nearly equal to that of a young whitetail. Proper care for the carcass, and diet also comes into play as mentioned earlier. Compared to deer, there is a lot more waste on a bear. A 200 pounder might yield the about same amount of meat as a 100 pound deer. Lots of fat to be trimmed away, heavier bones, hide, etc.. Kind of the same as wild boars in that respect. The perfect bear for me would weigh about 225 pounds field-dressed, which is large enough for a decent rug, manageable to drag myself from the woods and get onto the ATV rack, yet small enough to provide for some "prime" eating.

I have been on moose and bear hunts in Northern Quebec, and elk and mule deer hunts in Colorado when I was in my 20's and 30's. Now at 50, I am in better shape physically and financially than I was then but I won't go on another out of state hunt. Experiencing those places mostly made me appreciate what we have here in NY. The elk and moose were good but our NY whitetail is way better tasting than the mule deer. The black bear hunting we have here now is also getting to be better than in those places. I have never seen anyplace out of state that had scenery that rivaled that of NY's Adirondack mountains. The "High-deserts" of Colorado just don't do it for me, nor does the marshy, swampy, wooded bush-land of Quebec. Give me the tall wooded mountains, and glistening blue lakes and rivers of NY state any day. How great it is to not have to deal with air-travel, or purchase "out-of-state" licenses. After making me appreciate our NY hunting (and fishing) more, the best part about those other places was meeting new friends and strengthening relationships of those old ones who went on the trips with me. That, and a lot of great stories I can tell my kids, and grandkids someday, do make those out of state hunts something I will never regret. As for my ideal hunt, I had that last fall when I killed the biggest buck of my life up at my Father-in-laws new Adirondack camp. I imagine its going to be all downhill from there but I will love every minute of it. It might get better when and if I can get my pre-teen daughters to go along with me someday and they get to take a deer themselves.

For black bear in NY state the .30/06 is more than adequate. Even on Western grizzlies, it would be more appropriately sized than a .22/250 on deer. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the .30/06 has killed more of each bear species than any other caliber. I wish you well with your deer hunting this fall whichever rifle you choose. Confidence and bullet placement are more important than impact energy, and it sounds like you got that covered pretty good with the .22/250. How are you going to feel though if you are holding it when the biggest buck of your life shows you his front shoulder at a 300 yard range? Your 308 would put him down there in his tracks while the little 22/250 would likely explode on the shoulder blade sending him off crippled.

Someday, I may take my .22/250 deer hunting but (11) conditions would have to be met first. #1, my family's venison supply would have to be secure (at this point that means (4) average sized deer in the freezer). #2, my buck tag would need to be already filled with a "big gun". #3, I would need to locate some adequate bullets such as those which have been recommended here. #4-11, The shot would have to be perfectly clear, from a rest, broadside, center lung, non-moving deer, at less than 150 yard range with good light and wind under 10 mph. Had I "jumped the gun" and hunted with it last season it very likely would have cost me the largest bodied deer of my life. For the freezer, that Adirondack mountain 8-point counted as at least (2) average-sized deer, with a field dressed weight in access of 200 lbs. He also provided my Father in Law with a great looking "local" decoration for the wall of his new cabin. My .30/06 got the job done with less than half the above "conditions" met. The shot was quartering away at 300 yards. To the OP, I would suggest meeting the first (3) conditions prior to taking the .22/250 deer hunting, then make sure to meet the rest during the hunt itself.

We ate some of them smallies for dinner yesterday (the fillets were vacuum sealed and frozen a week ago). First "fresh" fish in a while and man was it good. I love venison, but it was time for a change after eating mostly that since mid-October last year. We baked the fillets on top of a layer of onions and thin sliced red potatoes. A little bit of garlic salt, lemon pepper, and a sprinkle of cayenne pepper. Wrapped in tin-foil, 30 minutes in a convection oven at 310 degrees. I cant remember ever having fish that tasted any better. The water up in the St Lawrence was considerably cooler than normal this year, and I am sure that was a factor in making the fish "extra-good". That also made the bass fight less than normal, which was ok with me since only one got away after it was hooked. The rest ended up in the freezer (fish-heaven). Also unusual this year was that none of the fish had eggs in them, as apparently all the spawning was completed during the brief "warm-up" we had in May. I feel better about keeping bass that have already spawned. We are very blessed here in NY to live in a state which offers such an abundance of fish and wildlife. Even Alaska has got nothing on us here in that respect.

You can get (4) hamburgers out of a horse without killing the animal.

The capital equipment required to manufacture rim-fire ammo is very expensive. Manufactures are not willing to invest the cash to meet the temporary spike in demand. For those impatient folks wanting to shoot more now, get yourselves a bb gun. Shooting is a lot more fun when you don't have to worry about finding and paying lots of money for ammo.

The 16 is my favorite gauge also. I have killed all of my grouse with them. The first with my Ithaca 37 pump with a "modified" barrell, and the most with my Stevens side-by-side double with I/C and modified chokes (both inherited from my granddad). My best grouse hunt was a two for two hunt with my Dad's Browning "sweet-16" auto. That gun handles better than any shotgun I have tried. I also used the 37 Ithaca (after mounting a scope on it) to take my first and later my largest racked buck. More than 30 years since the first, I still like to hunt deer with that gun when shots are expected to be under 75 yards. I killed a fine buck with it, from a 10 yard range, just 3 years ago. That "deerslayer" barrel has never let me down.

There is just so many better ways to challenge yourself that don't increase the odds of a wounded and non-recovered deer. Maybe hold out for a deer of a certain age or antler size, or try and hit the heart or center-lung every time. The kill zone on a deer with a .22/250 may be less than half the size it is with the top contenders like a .30/06, .270, or .308. Those slower, heavier bullets will also power thru unseen branches and bones much better. I do like my 22/250 a lot but I love venison and it would be tough knowing that I failed to get some because I was under-gunned when I had far more capable weapons to pick from. I imagine those who love antlers would feel the same way about that.

I am not as white now as I was after 5 days of fishing out on the St Lawrence and trying to take advantage of as much sun as I could when it showed up. Does that count?

That is cool when they start getting into it and putting on their own worms and taking the fish off and such. My youngest daughter (11) just graduated to that level this year. She needed a knife to cut the worms up however, I couldn't talk her into pinching them off with her fingernails. She caught lots of bluegills from the dock up at Alex Bay. I haven't had much luck on LM's this year, but the SM out in the river were fairly cooperative considering the east wind which blew steady for 5 days. We ended up with (37) 12-1/8 to 17 inchers for the freezer over the 5 days. One giant that I estimated at 22", 6-1/2 lbs, broke my jig off right at the boat. It was certainly above my "keeper" upper limit of 18", so I would have turned it loose anyhow. I also kept a 36" northern pike that had a large, hanging gut and when I cleaned it I found a SM bass almost 10" long in the stomach. Almost all the bass had gobies in their stomachs and seemed to be fat and very well fed as a result of that plentiful "invasive" food supply. We only landed (2) that were under 12" long.

The short answer to this question is NO, don't do it if you have a bigger gun to use. No doubt that it will kill a deer if you put your bullet in the right place, on that we all agree. I do admit that I have struggled with not using my own Ruger, M77 22-250 on deer. I have never missed on a "live" target with that gun and every animal ended up dead. Just a few weeks ago, I watched a chuck struggle about 5 feet, with its guts trailing behind, when my shot was a little too far back. I then grabbed my Ruger, 10/22 rim-fire to head shoot it. It was handy, the bullets were cheaper, and I felt sorry for the struggling animal. With a total of over a hundred chucks, foxes, and coyotes, that was the first time a second shot was needed to dispatch one quickly. I have to agree with the guy who questions the logic of challenging oneself by making it harder to kill a deer cleanly. Our family practically lives on venison and to loose some because of a dumb move like that would hurt me bad. If you have a .308 available, stick with it, for it is close to the perfect round for deer. I would call it # 3 after # 2 (.270), and #1 (30/06). The 22-250 would be very close to last place as an "adequate" deer rifle with hundreds of better choices available. That certainly qualifies it as a "dumb" move if nothing else. I apologize in advance if I have offended anyone here with my opinions but they are what they are.

In the central Adirondacks, If you get the chance to check out Buttermilk Falls near Long Lake, it is about the prettiest spot I have witnessed on this earth. It is a waterfall/rapids on the Raquette river upstream of Long Lake (wide spot on the river) Lots of good canoeing spots near there also (Durant Lake comes to mind). Buttermilk is a short hike from a parking area on the main road. There is lots of lodging in the vicinity at Blue Mountain and Long Lake.

No problem, fishing was tough on Honeoye with the water level at flood stage, only managed a couple small LM and didn't keep any. Headed to the St Lawrence today for SM, weather looks good. We always do good up there at this time of year with very few outings not resulting in limits of "eating-sized" bass. It has been getting a little tougher catching the smaller ones the last several years as growth rates have been way up since they have been feasting on the round gobbies. We end up releasing lots of 17" plus, fat ones while trying to get our limits of 12"-17" "eaters". No bass left in freezer now so the fish tacos will have to wait until we get some fresh ones. For those we just bake the fillets in the oven for about 1/2 hr after a short marinade in tariaki sauce. Make the tacos with the fish, shredded red cabbage, a white sauce, and chipoltle peppers to the desired "heat".

That's a big one for NY. Are you talking about Red House lake at Allegheny state park? We used to trout fish there when I was a kid. I can see how bass could grow very large there feasting on all the stocked trout. I am mostly a meat-fisherman however and I usually move trying to find smaller ones if I get into bass over 15" long. There is no fish I like better than properly prepared and cooked bass in the 12-15" range. The younger fish have great flavor and just the right oil content for grilling or baking. Way better that way than less oily fish like walleye and perch. I also move the boat when I get into those species by accident. Grilled bass tacos are about as good as it gets on the table, even better than the Mahi-Mahi ones they sell out in SanDiego.

You got that right. I will stick with my cheap little $250 Barnett Recruit until they give us some more time. It worked for me last year on the one shot I took at a deer with a heart-hit and quick kill at 59 yards. 300 fps and 135 lb draw got-r-done. A little more penetration than the 8" I got on that shot would be nice, but I'll just limit my shots to 50 yards max with the pea-shooter until we get the whole archery season and I spring for a faster x-bow.

Anybody else going after smallies or largemouth tomorrow? Weather looks good. Hopefully Honeoye lake is reopened after they had closed it down for a stretch due to high water. Time to start catching some tasty, good-eating sized 12-15" largemouth. The following week it will be the St Lawrence river for smallies. We are very blessed here in NY to have some of the best bass fishing in the country for both species.

Clearly there are lots of folks, myself included, who take little things like game laws, politics and food gathering a lot more seriously than they should from time to time. None of it matters in the long run. The purpose of life is to gain entrance to heaven and there is but one way to do that - belief in Jesus Christ. Life gets a lot easier once you realize that is the only thing you need to worry about. Go ahead and keep barking up the wrong trees if you wish, but always remember that there is a "better way".