Antler Restriction Bill?

[jjb4900]

does anyone else remember when you were only issued one deer tag with your license that was only good for one antlered deer during regular season or one of either sex during archery? in the early years if you filled it during archery, you were done for the year......later on, if you filled it during archery, you were allowed to buy a second for $5 that was good for the regular season..........simpler times

[WNYBuckHunter]

Not simpler times, they were times when the deer population could not sustain any larger of a harvest rate. If you did that now days, the deer population would quickly get out of hand in many areas. Thats actually why they stopped doing it that way.

[Witty]

You are right, I'm an awful shot that's why I'm in favor of antler restrictions. You found me out. <br /><br />I'd say I practice more then most. I'm obsessed with accuracy, please don't question my shooting ability. Experience on the other hand,I'll give you that. I've been reading as many books, magazine articles and looking to places like this to improve as a hunter. On the other had I've had many encounters with bucks, large and small. So some may count experience on number of dead deer, that I don't have.

[jjb4900]

Not simpler times, they were times when the deer population could not sustain any larger of a harvest rate. If you did that now days, the deer population would quickly get out of hand in many areas. Thats actually why they stopped doing it that way.

problem is, is that they hand out the tags as if each area is the same........there was no overabundance of deer in my area (4w) prior to them opening the floodgates and issuing multiple tags........ I think they need to rebuild the herd in some areas before even thinking about AR's.

Edited June 11, 2013 by jjb4900

[RangerClay]

I'm trying to wrap my mind around why some are in favor of AR.

 

I was flipping channels some time ago and "Whitetail Freaks" was on and they were featuring Kandi Kisky on her farm.  She was in a ground blind over a food plot.  She had a dozen or more bucks in front of her but was still waiting for that monster buck.  I thought to myself how unexciting that kind of hunting must be and I was glad for the rush that I get when any buck steps into view.

 

If this is what AR is all about, leave me out of it.

[jjb4900]

I'm trying to wrap my mind around why some are in favor of AR.

 

I was flipping channels some time ago and "Whitetail Freaks" was on and they were featuring Kandi Kisky on her farm.  She was in a ground blind over a food plot.  She had a dozen or more bucks in front of her but was still waiting for that monster buck.  I thought to myself how unexciting that kind of hunting must be and I was glad for the rush that I get when any buck steps into view.

 

If this is what AR is all about, leave me out of it.

yes, unfortunately that is what it's all about.........and even worse, as you may find out, you don't have the choice of opting out, it'll be forced onto you.

[Witty]

I not what I want to see either. AR or no AR, I want to see a better buck to doe ratio. Any way NY gets there is what I'm in favor of. If it's AR ok, if its education to hunters even better and if there is another way to do it or help do it fantastic. I wouldn't exactly call what happens on all of those "hunting shows" hunting. More like going to the farm and picking out your cow.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

does anyone else remember when you were only issued one deer tag with your license that was only good for one antlered deer during regular season or one of either sex during archery? in the early years if you filled it during archery, you were done for the year......later on, if you filled it during archery, you were allowed to buy a second for $5 that was good for the regular season..........simpler times

I remember those times as well as the times of 3 and 4 on a party permit, accumulating preference points to get one doe tag. where I hunt, if I only had one buck tag to use in any season I more than likely would go without a buck becasue I know what is wandering around. Pretty tough though letting a 120-130 class buck walk by even if you know there are bigger ones around the area. I don't think I have it in me...lol

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I not what I want to see either. AR or no AR, I want to see a better buck to doe ratio. Any way NY gets there is what I'm in favor of. If it's AR ok, if its education to hunters even better and if there is another way to do it or help do it fantastic. I wouldn't exactly call what happens on all of those "hunting shows" hunting. More like going to the farm and picking out your cow.

Where do you hunt Witty?

[phade]

You are right, I'm an awful shot that's why I'm in favor of antler restrictions. You found me out. <br /><br />I'd say I practice more then most. I'm obsessed with accuracy, please don't question my shooting ability. Experience on the other hand,I'll give you that. I've been reading as many books, magazine articles and looking to places like this to improve as a hunter. On the other had I've had many encounters with bucks, large and small. So some may count experience on number of dead deer, that I don't have.

 

You are missing the point. What I am saying is that had you shot better, you'd already have mature bucks on the wall. You've proven to get close enough to them, so you don't need AR to kill mature bucks.

 

Again, please take this as literal and not a bash against you. As you noted, you want better hunting. Sealing the deal is much better than AR brother.

[Witty]

Montgomery county (charlton state forest area/rual grove state forest area and I few private parcels). This will be my first year hunting in Saratoga county.

[phade]

Also, AR doesn't factor into B:D ratios. Doe tags, do, however.

 

If you kill a young buck or an old buck, you still kill a buck.

[Witty]

Also, AR doesn't factor into B:D ratios. Doe tags, do, however.

If you kill a young buck or an old buck, you still kill a buck.

If that is true (I'm not sure I totally agree with that statement), maybe I'd be more in favor to a earn-a-buck program.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

You can increase the number of bucks to does by killing bucks. Only killing does. Some ares maybe could benefit from an earn a buck but not statewide. NY is too varied in deer density and habitat. if you want to come out to 8C and find access you can shoot as many doe as you want, until you take a buck and then it is over. (archery only) in 8H they never give out their allotted DMP tags, most times not even in the second offering.

[jjb4900]

Also, AR doesn't factor into B:D ratios. Doe tags, do, however.

 

If you kill a young buck or an old buck, you still kill a buck.

exactly......... so if I pass spikes and 4pts all season in search of that monster 1.5 year old 6pt, and on the last day of late muzzleloader I shoot a button buck, I've impacted the herd the same as if I shot the spike, 4pt or 6pt..... right?

[Early]

I have always viewed deer hunting as a traditional sport. I see no need for regulations such as antler restrictions to make it something else.

[phade]

exactly......... so if I pass spikes and 4pts all season in search of that monster 1.5 year old 6pt, and on the last day of late muzzleloader I shoot a button buck, I've impacted the herd the same as if I shot the spike, 4pt or 6pt..... right?

 

Whoah, I didn't say that. All I said was that the B:D ratio was not impacted.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

exactly......... so if I pass spikes and 4pts all season in search of that monster 1.5 year old 6pt, and on the last day of late muzzleloader I shoot a button buck, I've impacted the herd the same as if I shot the spike, 4pt or 6pt..... right?

Don't shoot the button buck. Shoot it's Mother. ..lol.

[phade]

If that is true (I'm not sure I totally agree with that statement), maybe I'd be more in favor to a earn-a-buck program.

 

You should be...is a mature buck suddenly worth two small bucks or something? Last time I checked, both have a pair...and only a pair.

 

AR is most often joined at the hip with an over-the-top DMP/doe tag plan. Withouth the doe tag management, you are not impacting the B:D ration with simple AR.

 

You may be thinking of herd dynamics?

[Witty]

No idea what I'm thinking. Only things I know is it's pouring outside, no one is coming in to buy a car today and I appreciate this conversation not turning into a online argument lol. I'm hunting a new area, for all I know there are pics on my trail cam showing 10-1 buck to doe ratio and I have no need for AR lol

Edited June 11, 2013 by Witty

[Doewhacker]

Montgomery county (charlton state forest area/rual grove state forest area and I few private parcels). This will be my first year hunting in Saratoga county.

Not to not pick but it will be your first year in 5r and you already think AR's are needed? I live in and grew up in Saratoga county and can tell you AR's would be pointless here. Plenty of nice ones out there that I have seen first hand.

[Witty]

Doe whacker I think you missed my last post :-)

[Doewhacker]

Doe whacker I think you missed my last post :-)

Yes, I'm on my phone lol.

Pm me what area you are hunting if you like and I can tell you if I have hunted near there. Don't need specifics obviously.

[jjb4900]

Whoah, I didn't say that. All I said was that the B:D ratio was not impacted.

gotcha...............I still think that if I take a spike or an 8, the herd is still impacted the same.

[phade]

gotcha...............I still think that if I take a spike or an 8, the herd is still impacted the same.

 

There are some impact differences - assuming that the button is merely a YOY and the 8 is 1.5, 2.5, etc.

 

The button is statistically less likely to survive winter and the 8 is likely more proficient at breeding.

 

A better statement would be a 1.5 4 point and a 1.5 6 pt.