Baiting for deer

[WNYBuckHunter]

I was just in Wal-Mart and this is what they have stacked on the shelves. I had to take a pic because of this thread. How can they sell it when you can't use it in this state!!???

 

I asked that very question of the DEC a year or two ago. Lemme see if I cant find the email they sent me....

 

[Doc]

I asked that very question of the DEC a year or two ago. Lemme see if I cant find the email they sent me....

 

I'll bet they probably said that the law specifies the illegality of using baiting products, not buying, selling or possessing them. That's my guess. I would really like to see exactly how they did reply. I hope you come across that e-mail.

[Doc]

I still think a good compromise is to allow baiting but not to allow hunting over it. I said it before, but some states allow it for attractant and cameras but you must be 100 yards and not within site of the bait to be legal.

There also is an interaction between Baiting and feeding, both of which are illegal in NYS. It's a pretty tough legal distinction when you try to separate bait and food. A big bait pile is also a "food station". Now you get involved in trying to enforce motives for that big pile of corn that you have your camera set up over.....lol.

[njg0621]

Yeah but you can't use lead split shot in NY and it's not on the shelf... You can't light off fireworks and they are not on the shelf... I mean I would think if it is illegal to use something in NY then it shouldn't be in the stores to buy.

[Doc]

Yeah but you can't use lead split shot in NY and it's not on the shelf... You can't light off fireworks and they are not on the shelf... I mean I would think if it is illegal to use something in NY then it shouldn't be in the stores to buy.

I'm not disagreeing with all that. I am simply proposing a possibility as to why those particular things are legally sold here. It may all have to do with the wording of that particular law.

[BackWoods Hunter]

Fireworks... . Don't get me started .

[jrm]

Yeah but you can't use lead split shot in NY and it's not on the shelf... You can't light off fireworks and they are not on the shelf... I mean I would think if it is illegal to use something in NY then it shouldn't be in the stores to buy.

 

 

Not really the same thing.  Sale/possession of fireworks is illegal as well as their use. If you put a bottle rocket in a package that called it a "wall decoration" with a "do not expose to heat or flame" warning, it would still be illegal to sell/posses in NY.

 

I have seen these products all over Dicks, Gander Mountain, Tractor Supply and some local stores. In one store I asked about them, not understanding how they could be sold since baiting/feeding is not legal. The clerk just gave me a "knowing" smile.

 

I think the issue is that the _contents_ of the product are legal and there is no way to regulate. One of the products shown in these photos is "50% pellets/50% corn." How do you outlaw or regulate corn? I am guessing "pellets" are the same/similar pellet feed I give to my horses... can you imagine showing proof of horse/livestock ownership and having all legitmate feed purchases tracked and monitored? Impractical, impossible and absurd.

 

What I find amazing is the marketing/packaging of these products. The package states and promotes a use that is completely illegal in NYS (feeding/baiting deer). They don't even make an attempt to appear legit. 

 

Actually, I always though it was a crime to promote and encourage someone else to commit a crime. On those grounds, this type of packaging should not be allowed. I am surprised that the big chains carry these items.

 

Changing the packaging will not eliminate the use or practice, but it may help prevent folks who don't know any better (non-hunters who just want to "feed the pretty deer") from adding to the problem. Those who want to break the law will always do so, especially when the ingredients are so readily obtainable. Heck, it is probably less expensive to buy some cheap corn and livestock fee to make your own.

[stubby68]

can not use fireworks in ny either but here is a list of places you can buy them in this state

Auburn-Telstar Display Fireworks Kay Rd Auburn, New York13021 315-252-0712

Fireworks By Grucci 1 Grucci Ln Brookhaven, New York11719-9423 631-286-0088

Philny Effects Inc 1 Grucci Ln Brookhaven, New York11719-9423 631-286-0802

Zenith Pyrotechnology 25 W Jefryn Blvd Deer Park, New York11729-5715 631-242-2110

Fireworks Unlimited Of Nj Inc 46 Ashwood Ct East Northport, New York11731-2321 631-754-3781

Rimfire Ltd 30 Vail Ave East Quogue, NY 11942-4118 631-653-4338

Young Explosives Corp Endwell, NY 13760 607-748-0667

Fog Valley Fireworks Lyons, NY 14489 315-946-6167

Skylighters Of Western NY 3362 Baker Rd Orchard Park, NY 14127-1472 716-667-0844

Young Explosives Corp PO Box 18653 Rochester, NY 14618-0653 716-394-1783

Alonzo's Fireworks Schaghticoke Rd Schaghticoke, NY 12154 518-664-5664

American Fireworks Mfg Co 716 Elizabeth St Utica, NY 13501-2415 315-724-9487

Bay Fireworks County Road 31 Westhampton Bch, NY 11978 631-288-6102

Majestic Fireworks Corp 6909 Fairway Dr Westmoreland, NY 13490-1217 315-853-6809

Desalvo Display Fireworks Inc 189 Woodbrook Rd White Plains, NY 10605-4447 914-949-4872

I do not use bait and I include plots as baiting because they are both something put out by people to attract deer or other animals to an area with the intent to harvest said animal. I also do not have a problem with baiting as long as it is legal and I do not complain about baiting products being sold in stores as I do not have proof as to where it is being used once it leaves the store. We all have a good idea yet unless we fallow the buyer and see them useing it in NY who knows for sure. Big deal it is on the shelf in the store,if you do not have a use for it then do not buy it.Why complain about it being sold. Personally I have better things to do with my time then complain about things like that. I do not have a use for Dodge trucks but I do not complain everytime I see a Junk dealership.

Comparing baiting deer with putting a worm on a hook to catch fish is stupid. That is like people saying there are size limits for fish and we should have size limits for deer ( AR ). You will not get fish without somekind of bait on your hook you can get deer without bait however. Yet we all still use bait for deer in one form or another,A farmers field,apple trees,water source or just that mast crops in the woods.

[PREDATE]

Yeah but you can't use lead split shot in NY and it's not on the shelf.

I just wanted to clear this up. There is no law against the use of lead split shot of any size in NYS. Lead sinkers of 1/2oz. or less cannot be sold in NYS.

[stubby68]

New York State passed legislation that will prohibit the sale of certain lead sinkers. Beginning in May 2004, the sale of lead fishing sinkers (including "split shot") weighing one-half ounce or less will not be permitted.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I'll bet they probably said that the law specifies the illegality of using baiting products, not buying, selling or possessing them. That's my guess. I would really like to see exactly how they did reply. I hope you come across that e-mail.

Exactly. I posted it on here a couple of times in the past. Actually a thread on here prompted me to write them about it. The Encon officer I emailed with seemed just as frustrated by it as I am.

[Deerslayer]

Yeah but you can't use lead split shot in NY and it's not on the shelf... You can't light off fireworks and they are not on the shelf... I mean I would think if it is illegal to use something in NY then it shouldn't be in the stores to buy.

Not to get technical here, but you CAN use lead split shots in NY. It is illegal to SELL but not use. Absolutely no law on the books that says you can't use it.

[njg0621]

To my statement about the lead spit shot, you guys are correct you can use it but not sell it.  Sorry I was just trying to make a point and worded my point incorrectly.

[Five Seasons]

I asked that very question of the DEC a year or two ago. Lemme see if I cant find the email they sent me....

The stores wouldn't stock them if people didn't buy it. No different than rage 3 blade broadheads.

And you can't ban food. Even if they removed the fancy deer marketing, farmers still buy this stuff. Baiters will just buy the same stuff the farmers buy for their animals. Or if they're really feeling froggy a bag of apples from Wegmans. To me it only makes sense to outlaw the use.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Belo

[BackWoods Hunter]

Yup. It's up to the individual to follow the law. I don't want the governments help.

[WNYBuckHunter]

The stores wouldn't stock them if people didn't buy it. No different than rage 3 blade broadheads.

And you can't ban food. Even if they removed the fancy deer marketing, farmers still buy this stuff. Baiters will just buy the same stuff the farmers buy for their animals. Or if they're really feeling froggy a bag of apples from Wegmans. To me it only makes sense to outlaw the use.

 

They can ban the sale of anything they want actually. I agree, that people that want to bait will just buy stuff from feed stores.

[Gun Jammed]

I saw a 45lb bag of mineral supplements at gander mountain the other day, saw some young kid and his buddy buying a bag lol

[Larry]

Two things one this has gone on for 16 pages on a subject that is illegal to do in this state. To those of you who try to justify baiting your a poacher and you can't justify what you are doing.  

[BackWoods Hunter]

Two things one this has gone on for 16 pages on a subject that is illegal to do in this state. To those of you who try to justify baiting your a poacher and you can't justify what you are doing.

Got it. Don't talk about baiting, don't read about baiting, don't even think about baiting, or you're considered a poacher

I think we're all clear on that one.

What was the second thing?

Edited September 25, 2014 by BackWoods Hunter

[WNYBuckHunter]

Two things one this has gone on for 16 pages on a subject that is illegal to do in this state. To those of you who try to justify baiting your a poacher and you can't justify what you are doing.  

 

The original subject of the post had nothing to do with baiting in NY.

[Bigreed]

I would rather see a food plot to help sustain the deer instead of baiting. I would like to know if baiting can drastically increase the chance of actually seeing that monster buck that your after

[BackWoods Hunter]

I would rather see a food plot to help sustain the deer instead of baiting.

X2

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Two things one this has gone on for 16 pages on a subject that is illegal to do in this state. To those of you who try to justify baiting your a poacher and you can't justify what you are doing.  

Did you even read the original post of the thread?