Doc

Now think back to all the previous years. Don't you remember that October is traditionally one of the windiest months? I can't remember an October when I wasn't all ticked off at the near constant howling winds. About the only time it stops is when it is a drippy, drizzly, damp, ugly, gray, day. Yes, some of the prettiest and pleasant days happen in October, but more often than not the weather just plain sucks!

I have seen the difference before and after the maze of mountain bike trails were hacked into the state land that I hunt. There has been a definite change in deer behavior and these formerly productive areas are now quite ruined for hunting. Yes, you may see deer hold tight while the "spookers" (I love that word....lol) go by. And yes they will continue to hold tight in their beds until after it gets dark. That's the other thing they have become accustomed to. They know that after dark these invaders are no longer there and the movement can commence. If you are a hunter, that's not exactly a useful pattern for them to develop unless you are a jack-lighter...lol. What can you do about it? .... Nothing. The state land is for the use of all citizens, and they are now deciding to push their right to use it and in the process pushing us out. And the state is encouraging it by allowing mountain bikers to hack trails into the hills and splatter paint all over the trees, and saw and remove trees that get in their way ..... All things that hunters would get severely fined for. One good thing is that as soon as gun season rolls around and the shots start going off, the terrified hikers and bikers and bird watchers run out of the woods in terror.

Ha-ha-ha ..... I guess as long as you are not the one paying the lawyer bills and the settlement, that advice is pretty easy to give. It is amazing how the attitude changes when you find out you are being sued.

GOL 9-103 does not totally exclude the liability of landowners toward recreationists. Assuming no fee is charged, the statute states that the landowner owes no duty to keep the premises safe for entry or use by recreationists pursuing the listed activities, or to give warning of any hazardous condition, use of property, structure, or activity on the property to persons entering for recreation. It also states that farm owners or lessees have no duty to keep their farms safe for use by recreationists or to give warning of hazardous conditions or uses of the property. However, landowners are not protected if they intentionally harm a recreationist, or if they "willfully" or "maliciously" fail to guard against, or warn recreationists of, a danger on the property. http://www2.dnr.cornell.edu/ext/info/pubs/LegalFinancial/liability_boundary_posting.htm

Does NYS have a law against the waste of game animals? I know some states do, but I have never seen such a law here in NYS. If we don't have it, perhaps we need to have one.

Likely, the first challenge to such a law would result in the law immediately being struck down by the first court in which it were tested. There is a requirement in the system that makes criminal punishments fit the level of the crime. It is likely that there would be unanimous court agreement that treating trespass as a felony does not meet that standard.

Right. I was talking about an average law enforcement situation where there are no special and rare circumstances (and can be cleared up by showing proper paperwork). If any hunter was to be caught with a bullet hole in their archery deer, the enforcement of the law would be a piece of cake. Either you show paperwork that proves a legal right or get ready for a hefty ticket. That is a law enforcement tool that I would not want to see go away.

Well, of course it would be abused. Whenever you make poaching easy, even people who otherwise might not break the law are suddenly tempted. I think there is enough law breaking and poaching going on without practically promoting it.

OK, now there is one kind of tangible evidence that I was talking about in terms of finding out something about the effectiveness of a product. There is a demonstration that doesn't rely on some marketing scam or on the word of some hunter-hero on TV. Whether that is still enough evidence that it works in a deer hunting situation in terms of fooling his nose, remains to be seen. But at least it is evidence that the product does eliminate some odors and likely will help to some extent. Now let's spray up a skunk-sprayed dog with the stuff, and I will be a believer if that works too .... lol.

I am a little concerned with what weapons are used in the special seasons, otherwise I would be arguing for the abolition of all special seasons. There wouldn't be any need for them.

I didn't understand the original post to be limited to a "3 inch open sight mouse gun". In fact, I didn't see mention of handguns at all. The way it was worded was "firearm". That could include a scope sighted Thomson Contender or a 30-06 rifle ....right? And in terms of the "poachers poach" comment, I guess I don't understand that one at all. Just because people break laws we should make everything legal?

Yes, you always hear that you should go in deep enough so no one else will go that far. Ha-ha-ha..... that has been said so often that everybody wants to go there. I remember a bowhunt where I went way back in on some state land bow hunting. Right at the end of the day I watched some jogger all decked out in his shiny fluorescent tee-shirt and flashy jogging shorts running through the woods like a goofy-looking gazelle. This was on top of a super steep tall hill about 1-1/2 miles from any road. There have been other times when a gang of mountain bikers came shouting and laughing and screaming along the maze of trails that covers the land. Again, a long way from any road and at the top of a monster hill. And then there was the bowhunter that also had heard the story about how if you go in deep enough you will have everything all to yourself. This was dripping with sweat, and panting like a race horse looking for that mythical spot that no one else goes, carrying a loaded back-pack and a huge treestand, pretty much outfitted like a sweaty pack mule. He looked like he was having a wonderful time .... lol. He was a bit disappointed to see me sitting there. So, in today's health conscious world, there really is no place that is too far for a good many people to go.

It would be interesting to get an ECO's take on this question. Would he write you up? They still have a lot of leeway on how they enforce the laws. But here is a thought.... You need to do a little after dark tracking, and so there you are on the side hill with a loaded gun, and a light trying to do "the right thing". You lost the blood trail so your attention is focused on the ground. You don't notice that truck pulling over to the side of the road way down in the valley. Next thing you know, you have an ECO standing by your side writing you up for attempted jack-lighting, and he is confiscating your expensive gun, and generally making your life miserable and talking about a super high-dollar fine and maybe loss of hunting privileges. Was it worth it? What would happen if you had called the DEC and explained the dilemma before you started off with the gun and light? Any chance that they might have some less harmful suggestions that wouldn't wind up with all these dire penalties and still allow you to try to recover your deer?

If you can find an e-mail address at the DEC, I would think this would be the best way to make legal inquiries rather than using the phone or personal visits. That way, you receive back a hard-copy answer that you can keep. What I keep hearing is that a lot of the questions that are asked, are relative to things that are not clearly written. And if the laws can confuse you, they can confuse those that are supposed to be in-the-know. You may get a wrong answer, or an answer that an arresting ECO might not fully understand. It's always good to have something in your pocket that shows what you were told.

Does it make any sense to pass a law that make it impossible to enforce a whole battery of other laws? I hate to be a party-pooper, and the bearer of bad news, but when you make laws that make law-breaking easy and unenforceable, you have just written up an open invitation to have at it. Human Behavior 101.

First of all, such a law suggests that the bow and arrow is inadequate as a deer hunting weapon and needs an accompanying firearm to finish the job properly and ethically. Forget the ridiculous impossible quandary that such a law would pose for law enforcement. What would such a law say about the legitimacy of the bow as an ethical and adequate deer hunting weapon? I think that coalition of animal rights groups that proclaimed bowhunting as their primary target for elimination a few years back would be heartened by what this suggestion is really all about and what it is trying to say about bowhunting.

In my case, I am not dismissing anything, but simply questioning those that swear by the stuff without a single shred of evidence other than the word of the manufacturers or those that count on sponsors for their existence. Generally speaking, if I cannot find independent evidence that a product works, I will not recommend it to others, and often will not use it myself. And yet I hear people raving about the effectiveness of these sprays but when someone asks them how they know it works, or how they know they are using the best maker of these products, and all you get is blank stares and a shrug of the shoulders, which is pretty much what I got here when I asked the question.

This has some truth to it. Lately I have spent some lonely days in total silence on the hillside of state land, listening to all the slam-banging ruckus on the private land across the valley. They have plenty of people to keep the deer on their feet, while I sit quietly on stand and the deer are all bedded down in their favorite places, enjoying the peace and quiet.

http://www.wunderground.com/ It has already been mentioned, but this is the most complete and detailed forecast site that will do some pretty good focusing on little towns that most other sites won't even mention. just type in the name of the town and it will take you to the closest town and give you hour by hour forecast, wind direction and speed, and temperatures and precip chances and cloud conditions, sunrise/sunset times, etc.

If that is your goal, wait until gun season and use a rifle. Why go half-way? No crossbow will ever "put the deer into the next world as quick as possible" as reliably as a gun.

No, not really. There is no need to create any questions about whether the arrow was stuck in the deer by hand after it was shot with the gun. Right now there is no legal way that a deer taken in bow season can have an accompanying bullet hole in it. Let's keep it that way.

Actually, compared to the "good ol' days", the chunk of state land that I have always hunted has really diminished significantly in hunter density. Plenty of action on surrounding private properties, but the state land has quieted right down. I think it has to do with all the proliferation and exaggeration of horror tales of the past. All the tall tales have been embellished to the point where people are afraid to hunt there. That's ok with me, I won't discourage it. If it keeps going, there will soon be fewer hunters here during gun season than there is during the bow season. In fact, when you get into the second week of gun season, it already is like that.

Back in the olden days before I came down out of the trees, I remember using one of my milkweed seeds to check wind direction out of my treestand, and watched it go out a few feet and then drop straight down to a few feet off the ground and then circle its way down wind. That phenomenon was helped out by a damp cold drizzle, but it did point up the fact that treestands are no guarantee against getting nailed by wind direction. It doesn't happen all the time, but it sure makes it worthwhile to check the wind no matter what your set-up is.

Yes, that is what keeps marketing people in a job and what made the sellers of pet rocks rich.

Every morning when my feet come out of the bed and touch the floor. I'm retired and live in the woods. So anytime I can avoid necessary appointments with doctors and other pain-in-the-butt people, my time is my own.