Doc

Like I said, the list of reasons is very large, but do not belittle the part that animal rights groups have played in changing attitudes toward hunting. Those that are educating our youth and who also carry an anti-hunting agenda are getting their material from somewhere. It is also the animal rights freaks that are constantly keeping the issue of hunting before the public. I believe I have seen a definite change in attitude against hunting, and a general attitude of hunting being a low-brow activity that the social elite feel that we should have evolved past. These are the talking points of the animal rights activists, and more and more you hear them being parroted back to us by segments of the public that aren't even officially involved with these groups. In other words, those attitudes are slowly but surely becoming instituted into general public attitudes. The Bambi-ism message sticks, and it is the animal rights wackos that are peddaling that message. So let's not ignore these people even though their message seems ridiculous and uneducated to us, it sure is having it's effect when people decide whether hunting is something they want to be a part of or not. Kids don't feel that hunting, fishing and trapping are cool anymore? ..... That attitude has been sold to them by animal rights people and their converts.

As I understand it, the fox population has a disease cycle that effects their numbers. Distemper, rabies, mange, etc. So chances are pretty good that if you are seeing a bunch of them now, in a few years they will most likely return to being scarce.

20, 30 and 40. When the season starts, the 40 comes back off.

By the way, relative to flashlights, during gun season, I always have a lite going if I am walking in the dark or even close to being dark. However, during bow season, if I can navigate without a flashlight (moonlight, or some snow covered conditions), I will keep the light off. I use it strictly to keep myself from being shot during gun season, or falling over the edge of the ravine in bow season. ... lol.

Hey, a new handy phrase to clog up discussions! "Side step" ..... Good one! But the only side-stepping being done is by those that want to deflect the discussion into terminology. Would you care to take a crack at explaining why more people are chosing the crossbow in Ohio's bow season? If going a bit farther than simply dropping insults is a bit too much effort for you, that's fine. That's expected. But maybe you might try your hand at actually discussing something for a change.

OK ...... That'll be enough of that kind of talk! I know what you're saying. While we never think we have enough, there really is a whole lot of money around to buy distractions ..... for both kids and adults. By the way, I don't know whether I mentioned this or not, but diminishing youth hunters is not the only problem. We are losing adult hunters as well. At least that is what I see in my circle of aquaintances. And those are the people that would historically be the ones dragging in the kids. But just like the kids, adults have found other means of recreation and entertainment. The problem is that if you had a long-term crap in the economy, you might find a few more hunters here and there, but you also might find a whole lot more crime and such. The kids that you would like to coerce into hunting might be entertaining themselves by holding up the local 7-11..... . Land access: yes we have an abundance of hunting land, and no it may not be land that we would prefer to use. However, for introductory purposes, it probably is adequate. Yes, some of it can be a bit crowded, but there are ways around some of that such that you have a chance of avoiding the crowds. The state land that I hunt does have some additional pressures that I don't think most have. A dense system of mountain bike trails have been built and of course hoards of bikers and also hikers use it whenever the weather permits. The hill never does get a rest from constant pressure. But while it is no where near as good for hunting as it used to be, I still manage to blunder into a deer every once in a while.....lol. Let's put it this way ..... it hasn't driven me out of hunting yet. I guess I'm just hardcore.

You people keep droning away about what a piece of crap the crossbows are. It kind of makes you wonder what is wrong with the people of Ohio who are now seeing more crossbow users in their bowseason than vertical bows. Boy, are they ever messed up.

The list of contributors to the decline of hunting is pretty darn long and it's hard to point to any one thing and say that it is the "biggest problem". That is why no one has come up with a solution that will turn the decline around. There are a lot of suggestions that kind of pick around the corners of what we perceive as big problems, but there is nothing yet that will serve as the magic bullet and restore hunting to a universally accepted activity again. Frankly, I don't see anything as ever having any permanent impact on the future of hunting. It's a systemic thing that is a bit too huge to realistically be changed.

Sorry, but I am not that big a fan of winter that I am ready to wish away the fall. Rain is not my favorite thing, but at least I don't have to climb out there in sub-freezing temperatures and start to plow when there are other things I'd much rather be doing. Those who are looking at flooding as a result of rain are certainly going to view it all differently as I have done in other years when it was our turn with the flooding. But right now, the prospect of white-outs and snow-drifts and stuck cars is just not among those things that I am looking forward to.

Maybe that explains that occasional "gamey" taste in venison Chickens and pigs that you buy at the grocery store have never had any opportunity to eat anything but grain and grain products. We used to raise chickens, and they may have found an occasional worm out in the henhouse yard but 99.99% of their diet was mash, some oyster shells and water. No free range chickens at our place ..... lol. The pigs that we raised when I was a kid were fed commercial feed. One thing I am very sure of is that neither our pigs or our chickens went from one rotting roadkill to the next for their daily meals. However, I am sure that a crow or even a buzzard probably has processed all that filth to the point where there is no trace of it in their meat. So like I said, it is a mental barrier and not something that is based on chemistry. That's the nice thing about being a human in this country...... we are allowed to be a little picky about what we eat regardless of what it is or why.

It probably wouldn't make your day to put your hand up on the platform while coming in some morning, and feeling a big old fuzzy paw ...... lol.

First of all, I do not believe that there is any age group that is unconcerned over the future of hunting, and that includes the old folks. Perhaps what is being mistaken for lack of concern is frustration that comes along with the realization that society has taken huge steps away from activities and interests of the past. There definitely is a level of frustration particularly from those of us who have witnessed the changes first hand, when attempts to involve young people in any outdoor activities are met with total disinterest and lack of enthusiasm toward anything to do with the outdoors. I'm not sure how many people are aware that there have been studies that show that hunting is not the only victim of this new techno-culture. Youth interest has diminished in fishing, trapping, camping, and hiking as well. Some may try to make it an age thing, but the reality is that it is a societal thing, and the older people are simply those who see that the most clearly because they have lived the evolution of attitudes. My take is that creating interest is a family process that requires fostering appreciation and engagement with all things of nature. That includes teaching a love of camping and hiking and a curiosity of our natural world. This was the process that I was raised under, and the process that I followed when raising my boys. All of our recreation and family activities revolved around the outdoors, and hunting, fishing and trapping were things that naturally came of all that. I don't recall having to do anything to promote hunting, fishing and trapping. It was all just an assumed thing that they all expected to become involved in simply because it was just another extension of the more basic outdoor indoctrination. My sons now have a more intense involvement with outdoor activities than even I did because of that life-long indoctrination. Also throughout their upbringing, they involved others with their infectious addiction to outdoor activities. And so my efforts to keep the outdoors as a central part of our family had a ripple effect that went well beyond my two sons. That is the sort of thing that makes the difference, and it is the lack of that kind of dedication to nature in families that has caused a decline in youth interest. It is not lack of opportunities, or a lack of organized efforts to get these kids involved. There is far more of that kind of activity going on right now than at anytime in history. We are all looking for something easy that will reverse the decline in outdoor interests, some single event or program that will magically turn kids into hunters and fishermen or trappers. But the fact is that there is no single easy item. It is a cultural shift that has to be reversed. Older people understand that and yes, there may be a heavy level of frustration and perhaps even a bit of exasparation as the realities become clearer. I honestly have no answers, and I have no thoughts as to how you reverse decades of cultural evolution. I am fairly certain that many people have a very unrealistic view as to how easy they might imagine the solution to be. I do know that trying to lay the blame other generations is a pretty useless non-productive exercise as well as a mis-informed point of view. The fact is that the only reason that hunting is surviving at all is because of some of these older folks who have taken the lead in youth camps and hunter safety training activities, and even just their own infectious enthusiasm toward the outdoor activities. The reality of it all is that there are some mighty cultural and societal forces working against us and they may be proving to be more than a match for any generation. And of course the one thing that we are finding out is that it is pretty darn hard for individuals outside the family to make up for years of inadequacy within the family.

You bet!! My flashlight is a must. I use it on the way in or out whenever it is dark. Also, after getting on stand, I use it to signal hunters that may be setting up a little too close, that I am there. And yes, they do shoot way before legal shooting hours. I hear it every year, and at times, it is so dark that it's really hard to believe that they can even see anything at all to shoot at. Doesn't seem to matter to them. I just hope that they can't talk themselves into believing that deer carry flashlights.....lol.

Generally, there are blocks of woods, swamps or other unused plots spotted around among the fields. Didn't you find that to be the case when you googled the area? Blaze orange is still optional, however most of the hunters that are not suicidal do use some B/O during gun season.....

I guess I assumed from the original post that the dogs were official police issued dogs trained for official police work. The mention of the guy being a trooper kind of led me to think in that direction. Anybody know that that is not the case?

Saw one today along the road eating some sloppy road-killed something. It was something that was beginning to liquify from rot. I doubt that I could really work up an appetite for one of them critters ...... lol. Kind of like eating buzzard! No logical reason, just simply a gut reaction to their diet. I feel exactly the same way about possums, racoons and other carrion eating critters........YUCK!

A horse??????

8N (Ontario County)

It's not the bears that you have to worry about ...... It's the mountain lions that'll get ya'. How about this ...... how about a growling, slobbering, coyote with rabies (shades of Cujo). I know what you guys are talking about. I've heard that occasional twig snap in the pitch dark on my way to stand, and it always causes just a little quicker pace after that...... lol. But if you let your imagination get too big of a hold of you, you will be waiting until full daylight before you start out. Where the heck was it that I saw a picture of a bear perched up in some guys treestand? Now there is something to think about next time you approach your stand ..... lol.

I would not be real surprised if we were to find out that it is illegal to remove tarsels from road killed deer without a permit for possession of the whole deer.

I think even the DEC understands the weak points of managing with such large areas, but it probably is a point of practicality. So the DMP system will always be simply a compromise as areas with small populations get thrown in with areas of large populations. There probably is no magic bullet capable of making any significant change in that regard as much as we might imagine that there is.

I'm not sure the Castro regime will let you in. Just kiddin'. I've been through the area a few times (good cheese there). That whole stretch looks real "deery". In fact it wasn't too far from there were I saw a road-killed bear (big one) a few years ago. I'll bet there has to be a few members that hunt down that way that can give you the scoop on the area.

I guess I don't know of any reason why they wouldn't thrive in NYS. Their Russian cousins do pretty well in Siberia and grow to amazing sizes. Our climate is pretty darn nice compared to Siberia ...... lol. At any rate, those with some pretty good biological credentials are panicked at the thought of them becoming established here. They just may be right.

Now that's a damn shame! It seems that I am hearing more on this forum about stolen items this year than ever before. Take a close look at whatever is on those SD cards. There just might be pictures of two legged critters there.

However, conditioning your deer to become camera-shy is no joke. They absolutely do become aware of the camera eventually. At least in some of the experiences I have had with cameras, they do. Possibly the scent on the camera, or from the visits might also be aggravating this awareness. But I always have the best luck getting pictures when I first put a camera out and then the frequency of pictures slowly diminishes. Somebody is catching on to something.