Doc

Yes there must be some way that it can be done, but I find it real hard to imagine. I find myself having to change my sight settings when the weather changes to the point where I have to start piling on the layers. There is a strain to reach a complete anchor. There is an awkwardness to the whole shot set-up, and a definite variation in accuracy (not making it any better, I might add). Maybe there will be some success pictures appearing here to prove me wrong. But so far I haven't seen any.

Probably the biggest "demonstration of ecological illiteracy" is the failure to recognize coyotes as being at the top of their food chain here in NYS, with no natural control other than communicable canine diseases and starvation. The only other population control is the so-called "He-Man Coyote Haters". As in all issues of hunting vs anti-hunting, there are damned few animals that die peacefully in their sleep of old age, and it is the lucky critter that meets his end with a bullet. A little bit of knowledge of the effects of rabies, distemper and mange gives you at least a small clue about the fact that these coyotes are not really the cute looking puppy-dogs that we see as family pets anymore than the deer are Disney's version of talking deer. They are animals that occasionally require some thinning. And those that do not get removed are likely to be relegated to an end of crusted up mange, or wandering around in circles being driven mad by rabies, and a similar end with distemper, or a lingering death of slow starvation. There are no wandering veterinarians with syringes of cures out there in the wild world to keep these cute little doggies healthy and not spreading diseases back and forth. So before we get all wrapped up in the anti-hunters world of anthropomorphism, let's understand that the coyote world could probably use a few more of those that we disgustedly label "he-man coyote haters". We can try to do the job of coyote population control or we can kill them with kindness by simply allowing them to multiply completely out of control because we think they are cute little fuzzy doggies. I have always believed in the role of hunting and trapping as we continue to rob the wild critters of their environment. If we are going to eliminate their habitat, I think we automatically inherit the responsibility of trying to keep their numbers in harmony with what shrinking lands we have left for them. Setting coyotes aside from that service simply because they remind us of Fido is not really doing them any favors.

Right now the thermometer says 2.5 degrees F. Yesterday and the day before I saw 13 degrees in the morning. I am trying to imagine anyone going out dressed for that kind of weather with a bow and still able to draw it back to full-draw and maintaining any sort of form to successfully hit whatever they are shooting at. Has anybody ever successfully shot a deer with a bow in those kinds of temperatures?

I understand that coyotes look like our fuzzy domesticated family dog, and they do produce cute little puppies, but it is important to remember that they are wild animals that belong in the wild. The appeal of coyotes is often used by the PETA crowd to tug at the heartstrings of the Disney in all of us, but that only reflects an unrealistic view of wild critters and how they relate to the human population.

How about one of those "big game" air rifles. They claim to have plenty of power, and I would imagine the sound is probably not really all that bad.

I have to say that wild animals living in urban areas are always a potential hazard to themselves and the other normal residents of those areas of condensed human activity. Especially those that have the meat-eating equipment that coyotes have. The problem is the same as any predator that becomes too familiar and unafraid of humans. It becomes a case of a ticking time-bomb awaiting just the right circumstances and the right predatory personality for a mis-calculation by the coyote resulting in a tragedy. The real problem is that these urban populations of wildlife are impossible to control.

13 degrees out there. I am trying to imagine the layers upon layers of clothing I would have to have on in order to stay on stand for more than 15 minutes. And then I am trying to imagine how I could ever pull my bow back and still maintain any kind of consistent form or avoid clothing interference to accurately get the shot off such that I could get anywhere near the vitals. How on earth do you guys do it? I know that for me it would be absolutely impossible.

This is something that I have to constantly remind myself of. Hunting and fishing are recreational activities, and whether I eat or starve is not something that is at stake. Taking a relaxed attitude will make the activity a much more enjoyable pastime.

Well, we have had republican governors here in NYS. Yes, it's a rare occurrence, and most of those Republican governors were more liberal that most Democrats....lol. But it is possible to elect a Republican governor in NYS. What we need is to get out the upstate vote. Will it happen? ...... I certainly hope so. Brian Kolb is a great guy!

I will tan the hides and make something out of them. Or more likely my wife will make something out of them. But first I have to start getting one or two. Mostly, it is another activity of challenge like most of my hunting is. Also, it makes the damn winter go by faster.

Ok, I have bedeviled the deer herd long enough. It's time to dust off the .223 and check out the caller, and go out and educate some coyotes for a while now. Anyone else starting to think about it yet?

I always figured that tag soup was the only edible product that can be made out of any unfilled tags. They're not good for anything else. Why they are unfilled is irrelevant.

One other difference is that one is legal in NYS, and the other is not.

Apparently your idea of hateful is a whole lot different than mine. But One of the most abusive personal attacks that I can think of is implying that someone is lying. As I said, if you are going to engage in that sort of thing, take it offline and do it with PMs. Nobody really wants to hear it here. Also, it is pretty sad when you criticize someone for posting on a forum. What the hell do you think a forum is for? I've got to say that I really don't get the connection between random senseless flaming and trying to insert the race card. But I do see where some think that playing the race card always works even when it really has no relationship to the subject Anyway, I know that I am not going to influence the personality of those that get some kind of kick out of forum flaming. I also realize that excessive arguing against such unfriendly attitudes begins to sound like flaming also. So in the spirit of the season, I will cease my participation in this argument and simply offer the thought that perhaps if you really feel an uncontrollable urge to vent, do us all a favor and use the PM messaging.

All good guesses, but we really won't know until the final tally is completed and published some time in March. And then it will only be a statistical "hail Mary" activity ..... lol. And when they get all done, assuming their results are correct, it still won't mean anything because the only place that numbers really mean anything is the tiny area that we happen to be hunting. Even the township numbers do not indicate anything specifically where you are hunting.

So I ask myself, do I really have to go to the store and purchase some chemical concoction to get my deer. Seriously, is that what it takes to call my season successful? Heck if that's the case, I guess I can call going to the supermarket to buy a beef roast, a successful hunt ..... lol. Of course I also ask myself if I really have to go out and turn my deer hunting into an agricultural venture to be a successful deer hunter. Is that really part of hunting ..... a good tractor and some tilling equipment and the best special deer blend of seed that I can buy? I have found out that hunting can actually be done without either of those shortcuts. I guess it is just about where you decide to draw the lines. I suppose I see hunting in a different way than a lot of people. Hey, but then I don't get a whole lot of record book bucks either.

It doesn't work for them all the time. I remember one pretty good sized buck that thought he was well camouflaged in our thicket as I walked down the driveway to get the mail. I guess because it was the first snowfall of the season, he didn't realize how perfectly silhouetted he was against the white snow. At 40 yards, he never got out of his bed until I gutted and dragged him out. 1,000 foot driveway through a swampy ticket.....I never leave my gun behind during season when I walk down for the mail ..... lol.

Every year the Christmas season and the other great surrounding holidays seem to be getting more and more important to me. So thank you Growie for the thoughtful offering of seasons greetings, and I want to return the same thoughts to you and all the rest of the forum members.

So I guess your comment is supposed to imply that I am some kind of racist. I guess that has become a knee-jerk reaction these days. If you can't think of something nasty to reply, just pull out the race card. It doesn't matter if it has any merit does it? Frankly, I am not a fan of any evil-spirited posts, or bullying, or piling-on, or any of the kind of crap that is going on in this thread. I haven't really figured out the real motivation for this open warfare against one of our long-standing members, but it wouldn't be any kind of loss if it were simply to stop. If you guys have some personal problem with growalot, and can't help but convey hateful things, perhaps the forum would be better served if you kindly took it off-line and used the PM feature of this site. I don't think your personal abuse of her will really be missed here. Regarding my lack of participation here lately, I was trying (unsuccessfully) to fill my buck tag.

So, how many of you people are going to go out during the late bow season? I'm going to pass ..... as usual.

Sounds like a crusade that we really don't need here

Hillside veal....... Leave it in one piece and put it on a spit to cook it over an open fire. Seriously, That little critter will most likely wind up coyote food before the winter is over. The question is could you take the abuse from fellow hunters even though it really is logical to take it rather than letting it go through the long, slow agony of starvation.

I have to laugh when those arguments start about shortening the gun season (or not). Things have gone nearly completely quiet around here for the last couple of weeks. State parking lots are nearly deserted. Very few cars parked along side of the road. And almost no shooting at all going on. The whole argument is a joke from both sides. We are arguing over is a period deer hunting time that is virtually unused. The handful of deer that are taken in the later times of deer season, are not even significant. I wish that one year, the DEC would publish exact numbers per date. I think hunters on both sides of the issue of season length would see that the whole controversy means nothing at all.

I took the sheet off the tree and brought it up from the basement the day after Thanksgiving. The lights and garlands and such were still on it from last year. All we had to do was hang the ornaments and voila..... all done. Fa-la-la-la-la....etc., etc.

I believe I heard that it passed the house vote. However, it will not supercede any local state laws. It just means that states will be honoring permits of other states as if they were issued locally.