wolc123

My great, great grandfather built a 36 ft wide X 46 ft long post and beam barn in 1883 (the year is cut into the siding on the front just below the peak), and another one a few years prior to that. The roofs are failing on them now, and the foundations are in rough shape, from years of poor drainage on low-lying ground. I am in the process of tearing down the older one now, which is in worse shape. If I can salvage enough materials from it to shore up the newer "1883" one, I may put a roof on it, and try to get a few more years out of it.

My plans are to spend any free time that I get up there this summer, and early fall, out on or in the lake and NOT in the woods. That will apply until after we get a few good hard frosts. The reason for that is: I am scared of ticks and the Lyme disease that they carry. I picked over a hundred of them off from a buck that I killed up on the NW corner of the Adirondack park last Thanksgiving weekend. After the last "global warming" non-winter that we just had, they are bound to be even worse this year. Fortunately, those ticks are easy to catch and kill and not very active when it get's cold. Spring turkey hunters, summer deer scouters, hikers and bird-watchers should take adequate precautions however. As for me, I would much prefer spending my time fishing or swimming (I don't think ticks can swim). That beats the heck out of dousing myself and/or my clothes with chemicals and heading into the woods. Now that my in-laws have moved up there, I should never again need to bring a tick-infested deer carcass home to process. I found a place up there, about a 40 minute drive from their house, that will skin them, hang them in a cooler for 7 to 10 days, cut them up, and freezer wrap for just $45. They did an excellent job of trimming the fat from a doe that I dropped off during the early ML season up there last year. I was able to wait for that one, because I killed it early on a 10 day hunt. No such luck on the buck however, killed on the second last day of my hunt. Usually I process my own (I am very fussy about temperature control and trimming the fat), but $ 45 is well worth it for me, just for not having to worry about bringing the ticks home.

The OP is most likely referring to the personal attacks, which run rampant on this, and many other forums. As a Bible-thumping meat-hunter, I have been attacked here plenty, by both trophy hunters and by folks who believe that Jesus Christ has no place on a hunting forum. I appreciate that the moderators let those attacks go mostly unchecked. Those personal attacks always show me that what we have here is a "target-rich" environment, when it comes to lost souls. I can't think of many pursuits, except maybe fishing, that position folks better to absorb God's grace than hunting. If those lost folks would consider putting Jesus Christ first, who happens to control the fate of all living things (including animals and fish), they might be surprised at how much better their hunting gets. Regular (daily) Bible reading is a good place to start. Doing things for others, and putting their needs ahead of your own, is a good way to continue. Skipping a few Sunday morning hunts for a Church service with your family is also not such a bad idea. p.s. I do not refer to "trophy-hunters" as "lost" . It is ok with me for folks to hunt for different reasons. I appreciate them especially, because the smaller-antlered and younger deer that they pass may very well be the ones that the Good Lord blesses my family with. Happy hunting everyone.

Good question. On rare occasion, they chew off a few stalks, soon after they sprout. For the most part, they don't touch them. Deer are extremely efficient consumers of field corn. On our farm, they usually wait for it to get ripe and dry (mid to late October), then eat all the seeds from each cob, before starting the next one. They leave the shucked cobs right there on the stalks, with the husks neatly peeled back. I listened to a buck do that in early November last year. I was in my elevated blind, on the down-wind edge of the plot. When his vitals cleared the corn, I put my arrow thru them. I used all of my senses on that one, before and after the kill. As he approached, I got a real good whiff of that "rutty" smell, and I got to feel the warmth of the guts in my hands when I ripped them out after he fell. In contrast to deer, raccoons are the most destructive and least efficient users of corn that I know of. They knock down the stalks, and start nibbling the end of the field corn cobs, just as it starts to ripen (they hit sweetcorn about a week before it is ripe). Other critters (such as wild turkeys and squirrels) clean up the knocked-down stuff, but leave it alone otherwise. I once thought that the turkeys were the culprits hammering my corn, but it turns out that they only eat it when the coons knock it down for them. Fortunately, NY state allows land owners to trap and kill coons that are causing damage, and the coon is about the easiest fur-bearer that there is to trap. They do require that the carcasses be buried or burned if taken prior to the opening of trapping season (I suppose to reduce the spread of diseases like rabies, mange, and distemper). By aggressively trapping coons, starting at the end of the summer, I can get by with a lot less acreage of field corn, and still have it last well into hunting season. Back in the days of high fur prices, trappers and hunters, did a very good job of controlling the coon population. Now it is all up to me, coyotes, rabies, and distemper. I can usually create a "coon-free" zone, by the end of archery season, using a combination of box traps, baited with peanut-butter coated marshmellos and dog-proof "beer can" style traps with a little cat food in the bottom. This year, I am hoping my 4-1/2 acres will again make it all the way thru the end of late ML season. The same acreage just barely made it last year, with my neighbor killing a nice 2-1/2 year old 8-point buck on the last day of ML last year, on the edge of my larger plot (it expired right in the center of the plot). That was in spite of the worst drought we have had in more than 50 years last summer. I have not yet secured next years RR corn seed, so I am hoping that I can harvest and shuck a few bushels over the Christmas break this year, to use for next year's spring planting. That should not be a problem, judging by all the rain we have been getting so far, and I fertilized a little heavier this year. I did an experiment with some RR corn that had passed about half way thru a buck a couple years ago. Two little piles were all that remained of the gut pile after a week or so. I planted (10) seeds in a tomato flat. Not a single one sprouted. I will definitely test the germination of any that I harvest from the cobs and shuck myself this winter, prior to planting. I have heard of other folks who have done ok planting it, and they say it even carries the RR trait (I will test that also). Usually I can gather enough free, leftover RR corn seed, for my own use, from friends and relatives but they have not come up with enough yet. That stuff always germinates real well, even if I have stored it on a shelf in the basement for up to 5 years.

There are many reasons why I would prefer killing any buck over a doe, not the least of which is that does always take me longer to process. I don't like that doe fat that tends to stick to the roof of my mouth after cooking, so I spend a lot more time trimming it away. On average, I can usually have a buck processed and ready for the freezer almost twice as fast. Also, you got nothing left, years after a doe harvest, while all those buck racks, shoulder mounts and euro's instantly bring back all the good memories of hunts long ago. Even in pictures, does all look the same. I understand the importance of killing the does in overpopulated areas, and that, and the fact that two deer is not enough to feed my family, are the only reasons that I will continue killing does. I miss the days when a dmp could be used on a buck, and I don't understand why NY state won't give us a third buck tag if we purchase a ML, archery, and gun licence. Bucks are a renewable resource, and I would take any 1-1/2 year old buck over any doe, any day, if I had the choice. I won't complain too much about the way the DEC has been handling things however. It is hard to imagine things being much better for the meat hunter, than they are right now, in NY state. Last season my boneless venison cost me less than $1.00 per pound after subtracting all input costs. To the trophy hunters, I would recommend a move to one of the other 49 states that might do better in that regard.

^ That there looks like some good eating.

We have a couple thirteen year old daughters here right now (one will be turning fourteen in about a month) who are also into sports and have had some injuries and illnesses, so I know what you are going thru. The good news is, those prayers work, so here goes one for her full recovery.

Last season I killed a 1-1/2 year old doe prior to November 1, up in zone 6C, and an older one after, down in zone 9F. Therefore, my tally on deer abortions should have been less than (2). Since I am very pro-life, I am not being hypocritical when I have some feelings of regret for killing does after November 1. My regret is selfish, knowing that I will never get to taste the button bucks or 2-1/2 year bucks someday, that she may have produced. When hunting at home in zone 9F, I do my duty every time I can, when I have a tag and a 90% or better shot at killing a doe, for one reason only: I value human life a lot more than deer. A gross overpopulation of deer is not a good thing for humans. Does are significantly harder to kill here in 9F than antlered bucks, so I seldom fill all my tags (anyone can kill up to up to (9) does here, with (4) dmp tags, (2) transferred dmp tags, an either sex bow/ML, and an antlerless only bow/ML tag, and a gun buck tag that turns into an either sex tag during late ML season). When my buck tags are spent, and our venison supply is secure, I always loose most of my ambition to hunt, which does not help the situation much. I will try harder this year, because just last week, my good friend and coworker swerved to avoid a deer, then rolled and totaled his car. He is ok, and fortunately his 8 month pregnant wife was not in the car at the time. Deer are responsible for more human deaths and injuries in this country than any other animal. A driver was killed just a few miles from my house a few years ago when a deer came thru his windshield. The situation is much different in the Northern zone, so I do understand your reluctance to shoot doe after November 1 up there. In the part of it where I hunt (6C), they only give you a DMP with two preferences, so I could not kill more than one doe every three years after Nov 1, even if I wanted to. The one I killed up there with my ML last season, and another the same way about 4 years prior are the only two I have taken up there, so no northern zone deer abortions for me yet.

I will try one more time. Do you kill does after the rut ? If so, why is that ok, but killing button bucks or 1-1/2 year old bucks is bad ? Killing a single button buck or 1-1/2 year old removes just one "future trophy", while killing that mature doe often removes two or more, depending on her age.

What about killing does after the rut ? Does that bother you at all ? Have you done much of that ? It does not bother me too much while hunting in overpopulated zones (such as 9F where I live).

Prayers sent for Greg.

I'll take that bet and your gonna regret, cause it's the best there's ever been. There is a very well known Bible parable where the father kills a "fatted calf" for a big party, to welcome home his "prodigal son". Surely you have heard of that one. In payment for your lost bet, why don't you consider giving your soul to Jesus. I would consider that payment in full and then some. I do have a fondness for button buck venison, and my heavenly Father has blessed me with some just about every other year since I started hunting, some 36 years ago. I targeted about half of them myself (only if there was not a larger antlerless deer available). The other half were gifts from friends. I am always thankful when that happens. Do you consider button bucks and 1-1/2 year olds both "baby bucks" ? I know that you are against killing them. What about the unborn bucks that are killed, more often than not, when mature does are harvested after the rut ?

Last week Monday, the smallmouth were hitting pretty good, straight out from the gap between the windmills at the old steel plant, where the bottom dropped from 15 to 30 feet. We were catching them between 22 and 25 feet They tend to move out deeper as the lake warms up. The winds were light and variable, and 1/4 oz jigs, bounced along the bottom, were doing the trick. There were 4-5 other boats out there drifting bait, but I did not see any of them connecting.

For many years I was a pretty clueless hunter. I had some early successes, but I also made my share of mistakes. I am sure that most of those mistakes would have been eliminated, had I made the connection between Jesus, and a successful hunt a little earlier. A friend, and former coworker, who retired a few years ago, pointed out that connection to me (5) years ago, after I told him the story of how I had killed a mature buck, with a wide 8-point rack. He is a man of strong faith, who rarely misses a Sunday at church (other than opening weekend of deer season). I killed that buck on opening day, in the last minutes of legal daylight, from the ground, below a tree stand that was deep in the woods across from our house. The only reason I got down from that tree early, was because the Bible that I had been reading up in the stand, mysteriously slipped out of my hands and fell to the ground. As soon as I hit the ground, a flock of turkeys landed right on my position, in the little patch of brush below my stand. The big buck was with them, and took my 16 gauge slug to the neck from about 15 yards, dropping him dead in his tracks. I was wearing blaze orange camo. Had I been up in that tree, those turkeys would have spotted me from a mile away. Deer in those woods often hang with turkeys. I suppose that allows the deer to capitalize on the turkey's superior vision, and the turkeys to benefit from the deer's better nose. My friend told me that maybe it was not a coincidence that the Bible fell when it did, and that I must be "alright with the Lord". I believed him, especially after I remembered that it had been about 5 years before that when I started reading the Bible regularly, and I had not lost any deer that I had shot at since that time. Deer hunting has been getting better for me since then, culminating in the infamous "perfect shot" that I made on an Adirondack 6 point last Thanksgiving weekend. It has been easy to see the role that Jesus has played in all of my deer kills, since that guy pointed out the connection 5 years ago. Maybe it's all luck, but the better I keep my relationship with Jesus, the luckier I get. I would feel very guilty keeping that information to myself when I hear of so many who struggle here.

Spaghetti with venison meat sauce, and fresh green salad. It was awesome, and one of our kid's favorites for sure. It is time to start hitting that venison hard, to make room for the fresh stuff this year.

I am sorry that I did not put in any sweet corn this year, now that I see how good the field corn is doing. With a complete loss of my sweet corn crop last season, from the worst summer drought ever, and with a few other big projects going on this year, I did not have the desire or time to put any in. The few squash, cucumber, and tomato plants that I have up near the house are doing very well however. It should not be too long before we start seeing a little bit of fresh produce.

I have cleanly killed every deer that I shot at over the last 10 years, and none has taken more than an hour for me to recover. Some of the shots were not quite perfect. A few were, including the only one that was taken at a range farther than I had practiced (remember the picture of the 6-point heart with the broadhead x thru the center, if not I can post again for you). The best part of giving Jesus all the credit (which I do), is that the kind of "luck" He provides never runs out. I hope you have a good deer season this year, and that He blesses you with some clean kills. Thanks for the "bump" by bringing up His name again. It is impossible to have too much of Him on a hunting website. It is real good to have some help from others like you.

You sound like part of that group that will trade a little "collateral damage" (ie the occasional wounded and non-recovered deer) for more personal challenge. I am obviously not part of that group, but I am ok with you and many others who are. Deer are a renewable resource, and there are more than enough to go around, at least in most areas of NY state. The fact that you may have to fire 26 or so arrows to recover 25 deer is perfectly acceptable to me. I am not so happy with those who loose one or two deer for every one they recover though. Reading the bow-hunting section during hunting season shows all of us that may be the case with some. How many tales have we heard of endless searches for deer that were never recovered, or only found later after rotting or being half-eaten by coyotes? I give those folks who help others recover their mistakes using dogs and such a lot of credit, but I hope they don't get too many repeat customers. Those threads are always highly entertaining but often a little sad at the same time. What has been your recovery percentage over the last 10 years? As stated, I have cleanly killed and recovered 100 % over that period. A few initial shots were clean misses, or less than perfectly placed requiring a followup. All of the deer I shot at were recovered by me and relatively cleanly killed. On average, I take shots when I am 90% sure of a clean kill and recovery, with some minor adjustment based on point of the season and our venison supply at the time. I am well-aware of the reason 100 % of the deer have been recovered, as I have previously explained (it has to do with my standing with The Guy calling the shots in case you missed that part). This sure is a "target rich environment" when it comes to the number of folks who have no clue who is calling the shots. To answer the specific question you asked whether it was "sarcastic" or not: My family depends deer as our primary food source. Hunting them with only a scoped rifle would be ok, if I was the only hunter out there. I seek no "special" prilvledge, that is not open to all regardless of their physical abilities. (The Guy calling the shots would never condone that, for it is all about putting Him first and others ahead of yourself ). Less importantly, from a scientific/biological standpoint, the deer where I live go nocturnal, soon after the first sounds of gunfire in the woods when gun season opens. That is why there will always be a time and place for archery hunting. It would be considerably more difficult keeping my family fed, if only guns were allowed for deer hunting. Even if I were the only one using a rifle, that rifle would alert other deer in the area of my intent before I was able to get a sufficient quantity of them to "deer heaven" - mankind's food supply.

Nothing bothered me more in the sport of hunting, than loosing a deer I have shot at and hit, regardless of the weapon I used. Thankfully, it has been more than 10 years since it happened, and the last time was with my ML. In my early years of bowhunting, I lost a few. I remember everything about those lost deer far more clearly than I do those that I have recovered, and the changes I have made as a result will hopefully keep that from happening again. The single biggest change I have made, and the one that has prevented any "lost" deer, is the acceptance of Jesus Christ as my Savior. The Bible says's that "He knows where every sparrow falls". Certainly that also applies to deer. Why anyone would not stay on good terms with the Entity that determines the fate of all life is beyond me. It has taken me 36 years to get where I want to be as a deer hunter, and I was finally able to make a "perfect" shot (using my scoped rifle) on my last deer last season. I know that don't mean all of my future shots will be perfect, but that is what I will always aim for, using a ML, crossbow, scoped slug gun, open sight slug gun, scoped rifle, or open sight rifle. That last one will be new to me this year, so I am putting in lots of time practicing. Since NY allowed the crossbow (for a short time anyhow), I have stopped using a bow, but I have lots of respect for those who can consistently get the job done with those. I have accepted the fact that I will never get to that level with a bow, and now there is no need for me to try. I am extremely thankful for the opportunity I now have for the best 14 days of archery season in the southern zone, and 3 additional days in the northern zone. With my crossbow, I have gone 2 for 2, delivering "near-perfect" strikes each time. I can not over state how much easier it is to hit a deer where you want to, when it is in the same place when the arrow arrives as when it was released. That is much easier to do with a crossbow than with a bow, where deer are often moved to a state of high alert, as a result of glimpsing the draw motion. By eliminating the need to draw with a deer in close, you can eliminate the need to ever shoot at an alert deer. The carnage that the bowhunters leave behind does bother me a bit, and I also have seen far more of that from them, than I have from gun hunters.

I am sure you did not mean that comment and you might just be having a bad day. As a gun-hunter primarily, I forgive you of your transgression.

That may go for some, but not for all of us. I have been passing the smaller 1-1/2's early in the seasons for the last 5 years or so. More often than not, that has resulted in a larger antlered deer later, that also had a significantly larger body, and more meat for the freezer. For example, last archery season, I held off on a small-racked, small-body, 1-1/2 year old 3 point, and less than 5 minutes later, a much larger-bodied, 2-1/2 year old, busted up 5 point (was an 8 before the rut) presented me a nice shot, which I did not pass. That buck put about double the pounds of boneless venison in the freezer than the little guy would have added. I recognize the importance of killing does, and have killed about the same number of them as I have bucks. I always have some regret when I do it, thinking about the loss of the bucks she may have produced. In 36 years of deer hunting, I have not had any regret after killing a buck, regardless of how big it's antlers were. I will admit to not hunting as hard, after my buck tag is filled, but I still get out there if I have antlerless tags. Each time I have filled a buck tag, I have not seen a larger one later while hunting (antlers or body size). If and when it happens, I probably would regret the taking of the smaller buck. I have not shot a button buck in 5 years, which is my longest streak without doing that. Fortunately, my buddy shot one for us last season. We just enjoyed an awesome roast from it. Man, does that stuff just about melt in your mouth. It had the texture of the finest kobe fillet-mignon, and excellent flavor to go along with it. If I see a doe with a button buck this fall, I might just break from tradition and shoot the button buck first. If the doe don't stay around for the second shot, no big deal, for she can go make more of those tasty treats. Also, it is going to be very unlikely that we will have finished up all of the vacuum sealed venison leftover in the freezer from last season, so the lack of "quantity" should be a non-issue.

Kind of like the guy who puts a nice fat nightcrawler on a hook, watches his bobber goes down and reels in a trout on his spinning tackle compared the fella with the classic split-bamboo flyrod who takes one on a hand-tied "match the hatch" dry fly.

My grandfather, on my mom's side, was really into hunting. Unfortunately, he suffered a stroke and was bed-ridden before I was old enough for him to take me hunting. He also loved fishing and was able to get me started on that. I think I inherited my love for hunting and fishing from him. He left me his modest collection of gun's and fishing equipment in his will. He passed away the year before I got my first hunting license. I killed a lot of deer with his old Ithaca 16 ga, including my largest antlered buck. I also killed my second largest antlered buck, about 5 years ago, with that gun. My dad was never that into hunting, but took me out rabbit hunting a few times. I don't remember getting any with him. My first kills were squirrels, on my own, after school, in the woods across the street, with my .22. My dad's side of the family always did an opening weekend deer hunting trip to Allegheny state park. When I turned 16, I went with him for the first time. I did not see any deer, but he said that a bear ran right between us (about 50 yards apart). I did not see it either. I don't think you were allowed to shoot them the first week in the park back then. The following year on that trip, I killed my first deer (a button buck naturally), with gandad's 16 ga, while hunting with my dad's brother, who is also my God-father.

Would you consider yourself a trophy hunter ? As a meat hunter, it is hard for me to imagine better deer hunting than we have here in NY state. There is no place I would rather hunt. I am sorry but I find all of your posts nearly impossible to understand. It seems like you turn everything backwards. For example, in this case I said I was ok with 3 pt per side AR's but not 4 pts. What gives?

I was never a fan of turkey, even the farm raised stuff. That is the main reason I did not go after them when I was up there this last Memorial day weekend. My wife and kids love it though, so I would have went after one for them but I was scared of ticks, and I did not hear any gobbling around the lake at daybreak like I did a few years ago when we were up there at that time. Up on the NW corner of the park, where my in-laws live, there is some Ag including corn. That might explain why the venison from up there tastes as good as it does at home in WNY. It might also make the turkeys taste better than they do down on the SE corner of the park, where you hunt. Didn't you say that the deer don't taste too good down there also ? I guess the only way for me to find out if the turkeys are good, from up there, is to shoot one in the fall with my crossbow. I think the fall Turkey season ends the Friday before ML season, which should give me up to 3 days to get one with my crossbow. Maybe I will be blessed with such a "target of opportunity" while I am deer hunting. The only bird I ever liked the tasted of was ruffed grouse, and the ones from the NW corner of the Adirondacks are every bit as good as those from WNY.