wolc123

4k sounds reasonable for that work. You could probably rent a backhoe and do it cheaper yourself, but that would involve some risk (buried electric, gas, water, and drain lines), and I am certain you can find better uses for your time at this time of year. I would look for a contractor who is not a deer-hunter, or his mind won't be fully on the job. It makes sense to get it done now, so you have time to get it ready for a spring sale. I think your spring sale would be at least 5k less if you don't take care of the problem.

The smaller they are the better they taste, and the easier they are to get out of the woods. That one sure looks like a shooter to me. I will guess 143 pounds live weight.

I ordered on from Amazon yesterday ($17). I have a couple nice waterproof blinds at home in the Southern zone, but I need something for early ML up in the Adirondacks in a couple more weeks. I borrowed one from a friend last year and it worked pretty good. It is especially good for ML hunting where you must "keep your powder dry". I did not see any deer while sitting under it last year, for a couple hours during a heavy downpour, but I did get a glimpse of a bear in the distance. The only deer I saw on that hunt was a 1-1/2 year forkhorn, just after the rain ended. He needed another year to get a shot from me, but it was nice to be dry and in position for the shot while stillhunting, thanks to that umbrella. Had I waited out the storm in the cabin, there would have been no sightings for me up there during ML season last year. I only had a long weekend up there then, but it looks like I will have the full week this year. I expect that new umbrella will get a workout with rain in the long-term forecast as far out as it goes right now.

Having a nice comfortable ground blind makes those occasional rainy, cold, windy days very bearable. Even if you don't kill the deer from the blind, being out there, "pre-positioned" thru the storm, allows you to quickly move into a better spot (ie treestand) the minute the storm ends. Immediately after a hard rain storm is definitely a period of maximum deer activity. That is a great time to be in a spot that offers a good view of a food source. The rain also hinders a deer's hearing, both by the additional background noise and by softening the crunchy leaves and twigs. As others have mentioned, that makes it a good time for still-hunting. It also seems like rattling works better for me in a light rain. As far as loosing a blood trail in the rain, I am actually looking forward to that a little bit. I picked up some "bloodglow" a few years ago, that is supposed to make blood glow bright under the moonlight when mixed water. If only the deer would stop dropping in their tracks or after a very short run, like they all have since I got it, I could give it a try. If nothing else, having it available has removed any fear I had about hunting in the rain or right up until legal sunset.

Most of my butchering is done during gun season, when the temperatures are more favorable for "out of the fridge" aging. I just keep the widows covered in my insulated garage by day, and leave the hides on the carcasses. I use the fridge or cut up and grind right away if the outside high temps are predicted to be above the lower 50's in the 10-day forecast. The fridge is real nice for late summer "nuissance-permit" and early archery season deer however. Controlling the temperature is easy for me.

I have noticed that the grind is chewier if I don't age the venison. With older deer, that is very important (you are now learning that lesson the hard way). It takes about a week at 40 degrees for rigermortice to break down on a 1-1/2 year old deer, and 10 days for a 2-1/2. Your buck was likely 3-1/2 or older, which means he should have been aged for 2 weeks or more. Last season I ground a 2-1/2 year buck two days after he was killed and the grind is a little on the chewy side (that is the one we are eating now). At 3 days after killing, you ground and froze that older buck right about when the rigermortice had the maximum effect on the meat. Also, your grind probably consists mostly of the lesser parts, including the lower legs, front shoulder, rib meat, etc.. How were the tenderloins and backstraps? As someone already mentioned, the crock pot will take care of it. I like venison-barley soup made that way. This season, find an old refrigerator and take the racks out of it. Skin the deer, cut it in half, just ahead of the rear legs, and hang in the fridge prior to processing (1.5 yr = 1 week, 2.5 = 10 days, older 2 = weeks). 6 month old deer can be processed immediately. You won't have any more trouble with chewy grind, or other cuts. Those who don't age their venison just don't know no better, and they have no clue what they are missing. Red meat is red meat, and it can all be improved by aging (google it if you don't buy what I am selling). When it comes to sharpening the grinder, it is not worth my time these days. The plates and knives are mostly standard sized (#10, #12, etc) and you can buy them new at Bass Pro or other large retailers very reasonably priced. A plate and knife costs less than $20 and may grind 100 deer before they need replacing. I know I have put close to 50 deer thru my last set and they are still chopping as good as new. The grinder has not plugged since I put them in. That old grinder takes the chunks of meat as fast as I can drop them in. It probably started out as a hand-crank model, but my grandad fitted it with a gearbox and 1/2 hp motor about 70 years ago. Prior to putting in the new knife and plate, I had to take it apart and unplug it once or twice on every deer.

They both look like 2.5's. As a pure meat-hunter, that is my favorite age to shoot them, when you get the best combination of quantity and quality venison.

I am not sure about the fireballs, but I know that spitting the dip can work. I killed my first buck many years ago, on opening day of gun season, while his nose was on the little brown spot in the snow below my stand. I had been spitting my Hawken juice there since it got light enough to see. He came in from directly downwind. I had seen that buck three times prior, during archery season, but never within range. I guess it took that dip to give me the chip-shot under the stand with my scoped slug-gun.

I have been to most of the lower 48 and never run across any with scenery that rivaled NY's Adirondacks. There is just something about that combination of mountains and lakes that takes your breath away, especially during archery season when you can catch the peak fall foliage, or late in rife season when the snow blankets the mountains. What that adds to the hunting experience can not really be put into words, but must be experienced to fully appreciate. Killing a doe up there (in archery or ML season) is more memorable to me than a record book buck in the flatter parts of the state. I cant think of a better place to head to after I retire. The deer up there may be fewer and farther between than in other parts of the state, but the lack of hunting pressure, coupled with the unsurpassed scenery, more than makes up for that.

I prefer to hang the deer in my garage, with the hides left on, but only do it if the outside temperature over the 1 week stretch has predicted high daily temperatures not much over 50 degrees. When it hits 50 outside, the temperature of the meat with the hide on and inside the insulated garage, with the windows closed by day and covered, stays well below that. The concrete floor really holds the cold and I sometimes open the windows at night to cool it down. The insulated garage and the hide also keep the meat from freezing when daily night-time lows get into the twenties. I cant recall there ever being a stretch during hunting season when it was too cold to hang them for a week in my garage, but there have been many when it has been too warm - that is where the old fridge comes in. Most refrigerators can be easily adjusted to keep the temperature inside in the optimum 32 to 42 degrees F range. Venison is red meat, as is beef, and just like beef, the texture and flavor can be improved by aging. You may like the fresh froze stuff but most folks prefer the aged stuff. I know some hunters who really like the flavor of older bucks after they have been aged for two weeks or more. Being a pure "meat-hunter", I don't kill too many that are more than 2-1/2 years old, so a week hanging usually does the trick for me. Even the grind is significantly better after the carcass has been aged a week. After you gain a very little experience with aging the meat, you will be able to tell when it is ready to be processed just by feeling it. It will feel like it did when it was fresh killed. Rigermortice begins to sets in within hours of a kill and that is what makes the meat feel firm, almost like a pencil eraser. After a few days (depending on temperature and age of the deer) it begins to break down, with a 1-1/2 year old deer, aged at 37 degrees F, taking about a week to return to that "just-killed" feel. Older deer take longer and warmer temperatures move the process faster but can also cause spoilage.

Walmart has got a lot of good deals going now at the stores. I just picked up a waterproof/windproof, medium weight insulated real-tree camo jacket for $40., and a bunch of other stuff. The selection was excellent, including arrow heads, muzzleloading and gun-cleaning supplies.

That looks like a good eating size one to me (about 200 pounds live weight). I am getting hungry just looking at that picture. The larger ones are not so good from what I hear. I ate some from a smaller one that a buddy killed a few years ago and it was excellent. I am hoping for one about that size up in the Adirondacks with my ML in a couple more weeks. There has been many sightings of one around camp up there over the last several years, but I fear it may be a little on the big side for good eating. You don't get a lot boned meat from any bear (only about 10% of their live weight), and the crock pot and some spices can make any meat taste good. If a bear offers me a good shot, I am taking it no matter how big it is.

The last few years, the oldest trick in the book (actually The Book itself ) has helped me more than any new gadget ever has when it comes to gathering venison (and fish). Get yourself a small Bible that fits in your pocket or pack. My 51 year old eyes do better now, especially in poor light conditions, with a large print version. There are also plenty of aps for that for the smart phone folks, or so I hear (I still use a flip-phone). Happy hunting

WNYBH: "Baloney. Id put my fresh cut and frozen venison up against your aged (incorrectly with that much of a temp range btw) meat any day of the week. You wont be able to tell the difference toughness wise, and you wont get the runs after you eat it. BTW, I wont eat yours, we would need a non-biased 3rd party to be the guinea pig." Why not try it yourself to see what you are missing? Do you have an old beer fridge out in the garage? That is an easy way to age them at the right temp. Just pull out the racks and hang the skinned halfs in there so the air can get around them. One week will usually do the trick, maybe rotate them every couple days. I usually get to compare at least one "fresh froze" one every year for one reason or another (usually because I am going away from home on another hunt). Except for those under a year old, which don't need any aging, the aged ones have always been more tender. My wife and kids really prefer the aged ones and no one has ever got the runs or even an upset stomach. Let some women and kids in on the comparison also. I have quite a few buddies who's wives and girlfriends don't like their venison, which puts a bit of a damper on their hobby if you know what I mean. It might have been different, had it been aged (most of them use processors or cut them up fast themselves). It sure is nice when your wife encourages you to hunt more because she wants some more great food. Archery season is coming up fast, so good luck and hopefully you will let us know how that turns out real soon.

I never noticed any difference in the flavor of summer nuisance permit deer. Due to warm temps, I always put them in the fridge for aging though, so that makes dealing with them and early archery season deer a bit more trouble than during gun season, when outside hanging temps are usually better. Last season was so darn warm throughout, that I had to cut up two right away during gun season so we ended up with lots of hamburg. My kids love that however, with their favorite meals being venison tacos and spaghetti with meat sauce.

I like cutting up my own because I know I can make whitetail taste better than most beef. The secret is to age it properly, especially with older deer (6 month olds don't require any aging for great taste and texture). I age the 1-1/2 year olds for a week, 2-1/2's for 10 days and older deer up to two weeks at 33 - 50 deg F, prior to processing. If it is too warm for that in my insulated garage, I can hang the front and rear halfs in an old refrigerator with the shelves removed. When deer are cut up and frozen too soon after killing, rigermortice is locked in, causing the meat to be tough. Lack of control of aging temperature accounts for most "gamey" flavor in venison (usually when it gets too warm). I remove the hide from those that hang in the refrigerator, but leave it on for the rest to insulate against daily temperature swings and to keep the outer meat from drying out too much. If I can not age the carcasses properly, I cut them up right away and grind most of it into burger (that breaks up the rigermortice). The backstraps and tenderloins are usually pretty tender, even without aging, so I never grind them. Processing them up is easy and requires minimal equipment. A sharp knife, and cutting board is all you need. Getting most of the fat off is important, which makes bucks easier to process than does, especially later in the season. A grinder is nice (we usually grind about half and make the rest into small roasts, chops, and steaks). A vacuum sealer is great if you will freeze it longer than 6 months. I always put the first one every year into zip-lock bags and vacuum seal the rest. The vacuum sealed stuff tastes fresh-killed for up to 5 years in the freezer. A vacuum sealer is a waste of time and money if you eat it in less than 6 months.

If you go out early in the morning, I would start in about 40 ft of water and troll large, chartruse, rattling j-plugs near the bottom on a downriggger and/or on a large dipsy diver. They will move a little deeper later in the day (100 ft or so), but come back into the shallows, especially at creek mouths, towards evening. Heavy overcast skies may keep them shallow all day long. The whole schedule seems to be pushed back about a month this year due to record high water temperature, so we are looking at normal late August/early September patterns right now. I would not expect to find many up the creeks or at the piers until the water temp drops into the mid to lower 60's. Make sure your line is fresh (I would go with 14 - 20 lb test) and your drag is not too tight. Most guy's are already done for the season, so you won't have much interference out there. Good luck.

I have an old set of "real" rattling horns, from a 2.5 year old 7-point, that have been effective during archery season and during late ML season in the Southern zone. I misplaced them for a few years, but found them again this summer. While they were lost, I bought a Knight & Hale rattle bag at Walmart. I tried it about 6 times, but never had any luck with it. It did not sound quite right to me either, so I traded it to a friend for an iron frying pan two years ago. I did like the ease of carrying that small bag compared to them bulky antlers however. Last week, I picked up a larger, Primos rattle bag for $5.00 at a flea-market. That one sounds more like my real antlers. That is what I will try first this season. I used those real antlers on about a dozen hunts, bringing bucks within shooting range on 4 of them (3 during archery and 1 during ML). I never tried rattling during gun season in the Southern zone, but I do plan on trying it in the early ML season and the start of gun season in the Northern zone this fall (Oct 15-23). That should be pre-rut when it has been most effective for me in the past. I am a lot more comfortable doing it with a gun than a bow because the bucks are guaranteed to be on "high alert", greatly increasing the chances of "string jump". I learned that lesson the hard way the last year time I used my "real" antlers. It was a rainy afternoon in late October and I rattled in a heavy 10 point. He came in on full alert, with the hair standing up on the back of his neck like an angry cat. At 25 yards, I loosed an arrow at him broadside and he dropped fast on the release, taking the hit square in the shoulder blade. There was no penetration, nor a drop of blood on his trail. 4 weeks later, a friend harvested him with a gun, healed up pretty good, with just a nice scar over his shoulder. The great thing about the gun is that the bullet does it's job before the shot is heard. I would have to be pretty hard up for venison before I would consider using rattling horns or a grunt tube during archery season again. It is so much better when they never have a clue what hits them. Fortunately, the Good Lord has provided plenty every year since I learned that lesson.

I don't even like head shots on squirrels. A .22 LR thru their ribs does not take out much if any usable meat. It don't make much sense not to allow the maximum room for error, and the center lung shot gives you that. I did go for and make a head shot on a squirrel one time while deer hunting during the late ML season. It was right at dusk on the last day and the gun needed unloading anyhow. Poor Mr. bushytail just happened to show up at the wrong place at the wrong time. The .50 cal round ball neatly removed his head without damaging any meat. Other than livestock we butcher or furbearers caught in traps, that was my only head shot on an animal. If deer need finishing, I use a neck shot with a gun or a jugular throat slit with a knife. It is good to see that most folks here are in agreement in their dislike of the head shot.

I did not have a scale up there, but I am 5'-11" tall and weight 200 lbs. With a rope thru a pulley, I was able to lift my feet off the ground while this 8-point's rear-end was still planted on the ground in the shed. We had to hook my father-in-law's 4-wheeler on the rope to pull him up. I killed him 2 years ago, midway thru rifle season, on private land just off the NW edge of the Adirondack park. Assuming a bit for friction on the pulley, I would guess his dressed weight at around 210 lbs. He had to be considerably heavier than the heaviest one I ever killed in the southern zone (weighed 178 lbs on the scale), based on the amount of freezer space the boned out meat took up.

The spikes on that first one might not make 3", so you will need to take him during archery season in the Adirondacks (if that's where he is).

It sounds like you are referring to me on that last post LJC . If so, it was actually a 300 fps crossbow. I would imagine that a 360 would get pretty close to full penetration at 59 yards. That was also an expanding broadhead which are not great for long range penetration. The warthog dude was probably using cut on contact fixed blade heads that were well tuned to his setup.

Hopefully it will be enough that they don't start using lake Ontario water. We are heading out there right now to try tangling with some kings.

One time two bucks arrived on the scene 2 minutes after I killed a big doe. The larger one stood right next to the carcass about 75 yards away. A shot to the shoulder blade flopped him down right there. Does that count? It made recovery easy as I only had to drive the tractor to one spot to pick them up. Since then I have been in no big hurry to get down from the stand and started on the gutting job after killing a doe, and I always aim for their shoulder (with a gun), to keep the "decoy" around for a while. This is also a lot easier than carrying a plastic decoy around, with the added attraction of "real" scent.

I also don't like bugs which is a primary reason that I spend more early fall time fishing out on the lakes and rivers than hunting in the woods until we have a few hard frosts. Hopefully we will get some prior to October 15 or all my squirrel hunting will happen after deer season. That is also a big reason why I don't do much spring turkey hunting.