court support yeah right

[bubba]

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Judge-Rules-SAFE-Act-Constitutional-255622831.html

[bubba]

I hope those who think the courts are the answer see this.  Voting the bums out is the answer.

[fasteddie]

It had to be a Far Left Leaning liberal judge that made the decision !

[philoshop]

I feel like I've been kicked in the constitution.

Inform and mobilize the voters, people!!

[Doc]

And while we are at it, this "Message of Necessity" nonsense really needs to get some reins on it. Who knows given that the Governor has all these little legal goodies at his disposal, maybe the ruling was correct. They have made all this crap so complicated and with so many legal loopholes, that when it comes to constitutional Law, I doubt there is any of us who is qualified to have a credible opinion on this part of the action. Absolutely we had to challenge it in the courts, and we must pursue any other legal avenues. Just as sure as I am that almost all of us have no clue what-so-ever as to whether illegal or unconstitutional acts have been perpetrated, none of has a clue that they have not either.

 

No, the court challenges are a must. HOWEVER, the most important process that has to be used is the election. And I don't want to hear all the "quit before we get started" whining. Just do it! Nothing comes with any guarantees except it is guaranteed that nothing will change if we all just sit in the corner sucking our thumb and whimpering about how all is lost in this country.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Remember, this is not the only case that is currently ongoing with regards to the safe act. It is also not done with, as this case is being taken to the court of appeals.

 

We do need to vote these people out though.

[NFA-ADK]

Safe Act:  Making criminals safer when they rob, steal and murder knowing one less weapon is allowed by the victims.  These criminal will be happy when all guns are banned so they are the only ones with them. 

 

When will they realize criminals do not care about any laws but are happy when it makes them safer.  They want to help ban all guns with the other idiot who slipped this law in at midnight. 

[bubba]

Remember, this is not the only case that is currently ongoing with regards to the safe act. It is also not done with, as this case is being taken to the court of appeals.

 

We do need to vote these people out though.

 

 

That is true this is not the only case, buyt remember the first case said the only unconststutional part was 7 bullets.  Both rulings set precedent for future rulings.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I agree, but we will have to wait and see what happens with all of them. Did any of the rejections from the other case (the one that ended up striking down the 7 round part) ever go to the court of appeals? I dont remember seeing anything about that.

[Mr VJP]

These NY Judges are appointed by the same politicians that make these bad laws.  Expecting them to rule against their benefactors is foolish.  The courts have become the enforcement arm of the legislature, and that is never supposed to happen.  Judges are bound to rule on laws as they relate to the "Rule of Law", not how they fall in line with the "Rule of Men".

 

Since 1968, Americans have allowed unlawful infringement on the 2nd Amendment.  It should never have been allowed to happen then.  If it hadn't, we wouldn't be here today.  the goal is a total ban on all firearm ownership and use, and at this rate, that will only be a decade or so away.

 

[Doc]

We have to use all resources at our disposal. We have the court system and the electoral system. It's not an "either/or" arrangement. we have to use them both. We needn't get all wrapped up in any defeatist's attitudes, but concentrate on using the tools that we have.

[Mr VJP]

Doc, someday you will see all of these "resources" have already been corrupted to the point of being tools of the government used for oppression.

[philoshop]

Doc, someday you will see all of these "resources" have already been corrupted to the point of being tools of the government used for oppression.

 

Your viewpoint has been duly noted, and we appreciate it.

Many of us, however, are going to continue to work to dismantle the current regime as best we can given the circumstances.

Inform and motivate the voters!

[bubba]

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Lewis-County-Sheriff-Among-Those-Against-SAFE-Act-at-Rally-255890171.html

 

 

what I did today  My group hosted the event

[Doc]

Doc, someday you will see all of these "resources" have already been corrupted to the point of being tools of the government used for oppression.

I hear a lot of that kind of talk, and it makes me curious as to what you have in mind as a solution. Once you have decided that our system of government is not up to your expectations, what do you have in mind to replace it with. Anarchy? Some form of benevolent dictatorship? Or just decade after decade of civil war? Honestly, in your vision is of revolution, just who would you hand the reins over to? Would that be some revolutionary government. Perhaps Castro's version of a revolutionary fix. Have you ever really thought that far or does your thinking start and end with the commencement of armed insurrection? Just curious. I know it's rather easy to gripe and whine and talk of how all is lost, but I really wonder what actual solutions that you have and what that world would look like.

[Mr VJP]

Doc, you've asked me this question before, and I answered it extensively for you.  It's obvious you do not read my answers, or just don't understand them.  Armed revolt is not the action to take ....... yet.  But as long as we allow elected authorities to get away with corruption, we continue on the path towards it.

 

When was the last time you saw a high level elected official go to prison for corruption?

Let's start doing that.

[Doc]

Doc, you've asked me this question before, and I answered it extensively for you.  It's obvious you do not read my answers, or just don't understand them.  Armed revolt is not the action to take ....... yet.  But as long as we allow elected authorities to get away with corruption, we continue on the path towards it.

 

When was the last time you saw a high level elected official go to prison for corruption?

Let's start doing that.

So are we now back to working within the system. The hopeless picture you keep painting of "the system" sure sounds like that is not an option.

 

I do remember a similar discussion about a year ago or so, but as it was left, it sounded like you were ready to pick up where Terry Nichols and his buddy Timmy left off .... lol.

[philoshop]

What's going to happen, or has already happened with regard to the registration of 'assault' rifles is an act of mass civil disobedience.

We'll find out just what that mass is when the figures are released by the authorities. If they're ever actually released.

CT estimates they've had as many as 100,000 people disobey. Some guesstimates for NY run around 1,000,000. We're an 'army' of political dissidents and they can't and won't lock us all up. If I personally become the one the state locks up to try and send their message, I'll be ok with it because for me it's a matter of obeying the law or obeying my conscience. I'll accept jail before I'll accept tyranny.

 

In the meantime I'll work to vote the tyrants out because that is the tool we have at this time.

[Mr VJP]

Doc, you really don't understand my responses at all. I can't make things any simpler for you than I already have. Perhaps the complexity of the solution is too much for you to grasp.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I hear a lot of that kind of talk, and it makes me curious as to what you have in mind as a solution. Once you have decided that our system of government is not up to your expectations, what do you have in mind to replace it with. Anarchy? Some form of benevolent dictatorship? Or just decade after decade of civil war? Honestly, in your vision is of revolution, just who would you hand the reins over to? Would that be some revolutionary government. Perhaps Castro's version of a revolutionary fix. Have you ever really thought that far or does your thinking start and end with the commencement of armed insurrection? Just curious. I know it's rather easy to gripe and whine and talk of how all is lost, but I really wonder what actual solutions that you have and what that world would look like.

I certainly don't like what we have and what we have is not as the founders had intended. Quite the opposite I believe. I think they structured the Constitution to avoid what has happened. What would I like to see? I would like to see a Constitutional Republic. Wouldn't that be a novel idea?

[Doc]

I guess I take a little more realistic view of things. I'm kind of a "nuts and bolts" guy. I can listen to all the doom and gloom of how things are, but at some point, I like to hear about what we want and exactly how we are going to get there. So my simple question for those of the Rambo persuasion is how do you get from where we are to where you want to be? With things as hopelessly broken as we often hear, the only direction left is through armed insurrection. So again, back to the nuts and bolts of the situation, which one of the militia groups do you trust to make it all nice again? And why would you trust any of them anymore than the supposed leaders that we have now? And how do you know that the revolutionary talk that they are pedaling is for true positive change vs. using revolution as a self-serving tool to set up their own version of total power and corruption. That's kind of the first thing that runs through my mind whenever I hear all this falling sky talk .... "What's their angle"? That takes a whole lot of trust to throw the baby out with the bathwater and place the future of the country in the hands of a few crazy revolutionaries. After all, we saw how well that all worked in Cuba....lol.

[Doc]

Doc, you really don't understand my responses at all. I can't make things any simpler for you than I already have. Perhaps the complexity of the solution is too much for you to grasp.

That is because you are leaving giant gaps in your logic. You are telling me that government is an evil thing that is completely out of control, as in: "Doc, someday you will see all of these "resources" have already been corrupted to the point of being tools of the government used for oppression." Now if you really do believe that, I don't see any alternative left to you but armed revolt. So which is it? Are you for working within the system that you claim is corrupted beyond actual use, or are you for trashing what we have, crossing your fingers and hoping for some miracle that restores a more representative and just government. I don't know maybe there is some third alternative that you are keeping secret, but I don't see it in anything that you have said so far.

[jjb4900]

What's going to happen, or has already happened with regard to the registration of 'assault' rifles is an act of mass civil disobedience.

We'll find out just what that mass is when the figures are released by the authorities. If they're ever actually released.

CT estimates they've had as many as 100,000 people disobey. Some guesstimates for NY run around 1,000,000. We're an 'army' of political dissidents and they can't and won't lock us all up. If I personally become the one the state locks up to try and send their message, I'll be ok with it because for me it's a matter of obeying the law or obeying my conscience. I'll accept jail before I'll accept tyranny.

 

In the meantime I'll work to vote the tyrants out because that is the tool we have at this time.

from what I've heard the registration numbers are confidential...........we'll probably never know the real #...........and I'm assuming they really don't know who owns what, they are just hoping people will offer up the info.

[philoshop]

Exactly right jjb. Fishing expedition to see how many will bite. Judging by the folks I've talked to, it's going to be a pretty slim catch for the 'powers that be'. I think of it as a kind of radical polling. Pass the law first to get a feel for just how many are really that opposed.

 

The law as it stands, the SAFE act, is the law. It will never be fully repealed. Parts of it may come under consideration in the courts now and then in certain circumstances, but overall it is what it is. What we're fighting for now is to maintain the rights that we still have. That means voting out the people who have put us in this position of having to fight with our backs against the wall.

Will a change of politicians in Albany make a substantial and long-term difference in NYS? Probably not. Showing those in power that we do actually care about how we're governed will help to slow down the political agenda that is currently in place.

We've all chosen to live in NYS, for any number of reasons. That we're placed in this position of 'the forward battleground' for second ammendment rights in the US is probably not one of those reasons. But we like it here and we want to stay, and we want to be able to live our lives as we see fit. A tyrannical government isn't working for me, so I'm expressing my dissatisfaction through acts of civil disobedience and fighting to remove that government through the power of the ballot box.

[Doc]

Exactly right jjb. Fishing expedition to see how many will bite. Judging by the folks I've talked to, it's going to be a pretty slim catch for the 'powers that be'. I think of it as a kind of radical polling. Pass the law first to get a feel for just how many are really that opposed.

 

The law as it stands, the SAFE act, is the law. It will never be fully repealed. Parts of it may come under consideration in the courts now and then in certain circumstances, but overall it is what it is. What we're fighting for now is to maintain the rights that we still have. That means voting out the people who have put us in this position of having to fight with our backs against the wall.

Will a change of politicians in Albany make a substantial and long-term difference in NYS? Probably not. Showing those in power that we do actually care about how we're governed will help to slow down the political agenda that is currently in place.

We've all chosen to live in NYS, for any number of reasons. That we're placed in this position of 'the forward battleground' for second ammendment rights in the US is probably not one of those reasons. But we like it here and we want to stay, and we want to be able to live our lives as we see fit. A tyrannical government isn't working for me, so I'm expressing my dissatisfaction through acts of civil disobedience and fighting to remove that government through the power of the ballot box.

The most important thing to a politician is getting re-elected. That transcends even their ideology and principles. That's what makes the election this fall so important. Our state legislators have made an assumption that the gun lobby is too weak to be a credible threat to their employment ...... Hence the support and votes for the Safe Act and the direct in-your-face challenge to the gun owners. What do you think would be the attitude toward gun legislation in the future if all of a sudden they saw a significant number of their pro-Safe Act buddies come up missing after the election. We could send a message that would last for decades. Of course the other side of the coin exists too ..... What do you think the attitude toward gun legislation would be if all these politicians that voted for the act go absolutely unpunished. That will mean that the gun lobby is neutered and an open season on the 2nd Amendment can be declared..... guaranteed.

 

We can do all the civil disobedience that we want, and the politicians who create these anti-gun laws will continue to do so without risk. The only risk is taken by the gun owner with that slam-dunk confession to a felony sitting in his closet.