Variable Eye Relief

[Elmo]

I noticed on some scopes, the eye relief changes as you adjust the magnification.  What is the purpose of this?  Do you adjust your hold as you change magnifications or are these scope really meant to be used as fixed magnification once it is mounted?

[Pygmy]

I am no authority on optics and don't have a scientific/ technical answer, but I do believe that in any variable scope the eye relief shortens as the magification increases. Just the nature of the beast.

Are variables meant to be used as fixed power after mounting ? I don't think so. That would cancel the only advantage that variables have over fixed powers; the ability to increase magnification to adjust for longer distances or smaller targets.

Edited December 9, 2014 by Pygmy

[Mr VJP]

The higher quality variables do not have a significant or obvious change in eye relief.  The less expensive ones are very noticeable.

 

[greensider]

thats why i am updating my scopes to the new nikon monarks theres does not change so the aim point wont change

[wildcat junkie]

I am no authority on optics and don't have a scientific/ technical answer, but I do believe that in any variable scope the eye relief shortens as the magification increases. Just the nature of the beast.

Are variables meant to be used as fixed power after mounting ? I don't think so. That would cancel the only advantage that variables have over fixed powers; the ability to increase magnification to adjust for longer distances or smaller targets.

All very valid points. Perhaps a better word to discribe the differing eye relief would be narrows. While low magnification will allow more leeway as far as eye relief, generaly, the narrower high magnification eye relief will be somewhere in the short end of the low magnification eye relief envelope.

 

I set my eye relief so that I can get full field of view at high magnification & the wider range of full field view at low magnification takes care of itself.

 

I NEVER leave my variable power setting on anything other than the lowest maginification to allow fast target aquisition on targets at close range which will likely require a quicker reaction. Shots taken with high magnification will in all likelyhood be taken under a situation where there is plenty of time to not only crank up the power, but also to snuggle up to the eye relief.

 

Due to being caught off guard, I took this years buck at about 100yds with the scope still on 3X. That's plenty of maginifcation for that distance or even farther. The biggest advantage I find with 9X is for sizing up the rack on longer shots. Most shots from my tri-pod are in the 200-250yd range. Those long shots have alway been at unalamed deer that gave me plenty of time. 

Edited December 9, 2014 by wildcat junkie

[wildcat junkie]

thats why i am updating my scopes to the new nikon monarks theres does not change so the aim point wont change

CF rifle scopes generally have the parallax adjustment set 100yds. Shotgun/ML at 75 yds & RF scopes at 50yds.

 

The parallax distance is where there will be no shift in POI regardles of eye position.

 

Adjustable objective scope can be adjusted for parallax at any realistic distance that a shot might be taken.

Edited December 9, 2014 by wildcat junkie

[wildcat junkie]

thats why i am updating my scopes to the new nikon monarks theres does not change so the aim point wont change

I once had a 2-7X32 Nikon Monarch. The optics were right up there with the more reasonably priced Leupolds & European scopes. Great value & very capable. I let it go on my M700 Mountain Rifle DM 7mm-08. The only reason I left it on the rifle was because of some cosmetic damage. Every deer that was shot at with that combo died with the 1st bullet.

 

I loaned it to this young man that killed his 1st deer with it from my tri-pod..

Edited December 9, 2014 by wildcat junkie

[irish_redneck]

thats why i am updating my scopes to the new nikon monarks theres does not change so the aim point wont change

I have a monarch 3. Eye relief is considerably different between 5x and 20x

[ATbuckhunter]

I have a Nikon BuckMaster and the eye relief doesn't change at all when adjusting the power. 

[moog5050]

I think you really notice the difference on high mag scopes.  I had a swaro z6i 5-30 and at high mag I hated the eye relief.  It was very sensitive.  Stupid buy because its definitely not needed where I hunt and considering my capabilities.  Sold it.  Good news was that I bought it right and made money on the sale.  lol

[shawnhu]

I checked the scope out, definitely a variable eye relief, and has nothing to do with the narrow band on high mag. Very odd.

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[wildcat junkie]

I have a Nikon BuckMaster and the eye relief doesn't change at all when adjusting the power. 

I'd bet that there is more leeway at the low magnification setting.

[Pygmy]

I have whine about this at least once per season..Ask Wnybuckhunter..LOL..

I've always been puzzled as to why a person would ruin the graceful lines and good handling qualities of a nice sporter by saddling it with some bulky, heavy, awkward monstrosity of a high power variable scope.

Most of us would be better served by a high quality fixed power 4X like the Leupold M8. Outstanding optics and clarity, absolute simplicity and dependability, light weight, ample eye relief, and NO danger of getting caught by a close up shot opportunity when you have set your scope to 9x or 12x and forget to turn it back down.

Ask Jack O'Connor...On second thought DON'T ask Jack..He's dead...

I feel better now.. I won't bitch about high powered variables again until next year.. <<grin>>....

Edited December 10, 2014 by Pygmy

[moog5050]

Pygmy - I tend to agree and have fixed 4x leupold's on two guns, including the 270 that previously had the hi mag swaro.  That said, my only shot on a deer in regular season this year was at or about 250yds.  It would have been nice to have some more magnification then (deer looked pretty small in those crosshairs).  I recognize that type of shot opportunity is a rarity for me, but it would have been nice to at least have a 3x9.  The 4x is fine for 99.9 percent of my shots though.

[Pygmy]

Yeah, Moog, I understand...Everything is a trade off.

However I have shot a fair amount of game, from proghorns to moose from 250 to 400 yards with my 4X Leupys, and I have never had a problem with lack of magnification.

That said, my current long range rig, a M70 in .280, wears a fixed 6X Leupy, which I bought used but like new for $150.

I also own a couple of variables, a 1X 4 leupy and a 2x7 Burris..

I bought the Burris when I bought my M700 Mountain rifle..The store would provide free rings, bases, and bore sighting but only if you bought a BURRIS scope, and they did not HAVE Burris in fixed 4X.

I must admit it has been a good little scope. I almost never set it about 4X while hunting with it, though, and if I am doing anything other than stand hunting I set it on 2X.

[Lawdwaz]

I like my 2-7, 2.5-9 and 3.5-10 Leupolds but can certainlly see the benefits of a fixed 4x.  What I don't get is the guys that need a 50mm objective.  WTH man, with the legal shooting hours we have whats the need?

[Pygmy]

The light gathering ability of a Leupold fixed 4x is amazing...You can see clearly much earlier and later than legal shooting time..Better than my 8 x 42 Leicas. And that scope has a 32MM objective.

[moog5050]

I suspect if I did more long range practice with the 4x it wouldn't have seemed so daunting.  I generally only shoot at a 100yd range.  I did kill that deer, but only because it allowed a follow up shot.  My first shot was well under-ranged.  Put the crosshair on top of the back and had a good shoulder shot.  A range finder would have been helpful at that point too.  lol

 

The leupold 4x does a great job of gathering light.

[wildcat junkie]

I like my 2-7, 2.5-9 and 3.5-10 Leupolds but can certainlly see the benefits of a fixed 4x.  What I don't get is the guys that need a 50mm objective.  WTH man, with the legal shooting hours we have whats the need?  

 

 

 

An objective lens that is more than 5X (in mm) larger than the highest magnification of the scope is not any more effective than a 35mm objective lens on 7X or a 45mm objective lens on 9X under any condition where there would be enough light to identify a target with the naked eye in the 1st place.

 

In a situation where there is any extranious light, the human eye can only admit light through about a 5mm "exit pupil" which is determined by the 5:1 ratio. In total darkness the pupil will dialte to about 7mm, but the it is way beyond anything even approaching leagat shooting hours.

 

Why do you think most old school, high quality 2-7s have 33mm objective lenses & 3-9s have 42mm objective lenses? Big objective lenses on moderate magnification scopes are a marketing ploy.

 

Far more inportant is the light transmittace value. The new Leupols VX-1 has 92% light transmittance, the VX-2 has a little better, 96% I think.

 

Google "exit pupil" & "twilight factor" for more on low light optical effectiveness.

[wildcat junkie]

I once went out on a summer evening with several different brands of scopes.

 

All were in what I would call the moderate price range of between $300 & $500.

 

I had a piece of (dull) orange surveyers tape tied to a tree trunk at about 245yds. The area was in deep shadow as the sun went down. I viewed the tree from my tri-pod stand looking West.

 

The best performing scope was the 3-9X42 Kahles, which was the most expensive of the bunch. Next best was the older VX-II 3-9X40 Leupold which has similar performance to the new VX-1 3-9X40. At that time they were selling at Cabela's for $299.

 

The Kahles would brighten up ever so slightly when I cranked the magnification back to about 8X from 9X. It was barely noticable.

Edited December 10, 2014 by wildcat junkie

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Wildcat, Ever check out the Vortex line of scopes?

[wildcat junkie]

I have whine about this at least once per season..Ask Wnybuckhunter..LOL..

I've always been puzzled as to why a person would ruin the graceful lines and good handling qualities of a nice sporter by saddling it with some bulky, heavy, awkward monstrosity of a high power variable scope.

Most of us would be better served by a high quality fixed power 4X like the Leupold M8. Outstanding optics and clarity, absolute simplicity and dependability, light weight, ample eye relief, and NO danger of getting caught by a close up shot opportunity when you have set your scope to 9x or 12x and forget to turn it back down.

Ask Jack O'Connor...On second thought DON'T ask Jack..He's dead...

I feel better now.. I won't bitch about high powered variables again until next year.. <<grin>>....

A 2-7 variable isn't much larger than a 4X fixed. On a small rifle they look good. I had a 2-7 Nikon Monarch on my 7mm-08 M700 Mountain Rifle DM. It looked proportinal to the the 22" barrel on the short action.

 

 

I would like to have a 3-9X33 Leupld compact on my 8X57, but they are never on sale & cost considerably more than a 3-9. Even a 2-7 costs more than a 3-9X40 as the 3-9X40s are a big volume item & are often on sale.

 

Cabela's has 3-9 VX-1s on sale for $199.99 shipped & they are every bit as good as the VX-IIs were & they used to cost $299.99.

Edited December 10, 2014 by wildcat junkie

[wildcat junkie]

Wildcat, Ever check out the Vortex line of scopes?

I'm partial to Leupouds because the have a "forever" gaurantee. They are not even interested In where the scope came from, it's gauranteed no mater how old or where you bought it..

Ever try to find a deal on a used Leupold on e-bay? They are just about as much as a new one.

 

I did damage a 1Vari X I, 1-4X20 Shotgun scope once when I shot several foster slugs through a .620" extended turkey choke. The recoil was horrendous & it knocked the reticle loose. At least that was my take. the scope did end up with a loose reticle somehow. I sent it & had it back in about 7 days, good as new.

 

I have several Scopes that have resided on more than one firearm, many of the firearms I no longer own. It's foolish to leave good glass on a used firearm when you sell/trade unless the new owner is willing to pay what the glass is worth. Many would rather pay $100 for cheap (new) Tasco than $175 for a used Leupy that is already on the gun. Good optics last a long, long time if you take care of them. The same can seldom be said for $80-$100 Wally World specials.

 

The European stuff has awesome optics. (Leupold is from German heritage, that's why it's correctly pronounced Lew-pold, not Le-a-pold. With new VX-1 3-9X40s going for just under $200 shipped, they are quite a bargan IMO.

[moog5050]

wildcat, the vortex have the same guaranty and dollar for dollar, may be better optics.  I am sold on vortex but do have several leupolds.  You should at least check them out.

[wildcat junkie]

wildcat, the vortex have the same guaranty and dollar for dollar, may be better optics.  I am sold on vortex but do have several leupolds.  You should at least check them out.

I just checked out their site, interesting. Where are they made?

 

I prefer made in the USA but will buy Japanese or European as they support higher wages than USA.  I don't buy Chinese if I can help it.

 

Scopes/optics are one of the few things that still gives one a choice. I just bought my son some Red Wing Irish Setter boots for Christmas & was disappointed to find "made in China" on the tongue.

Edited December 10, 2014 by wildcat junkie