Finding them dead on Long Island.

[growalot]

Oh... believe me that response was by no means my hackles being up...just  pure amusement...

[Mr VJP]

There's a video out there some where showing a deer eating a fish it finds on the bank of a stream.  Never knew they would eat fish before I saw that.

 

[Curmudgeon]

They eat eggs out of song bird nests sometimes. Same thing, a video can be found.

[growalot]

there is one of them eating a bird as well...I have witnessed them eating voles...in fact I have seen turkey eating small rodents as well....

 

 

PS...Single- Shot good video thanks...Now someone might say ..."well that could be a doe off spring social behavior"

 So heres a video of two adult bucks in fall doing the same thing...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYWtK90PnQ0

Edited February 23, 2015 by growalot

[mbucks27]

I was the one who found the fawn yesterday it was still alive when I found it tried to stand it up and get it to walk off and it just fell back down. Died right in front of me. People started basing me for saying that it was horrible to see so I removed the post. Also found another dead fawn yesterday as well that was frozen solid. Snow has been frozen solid and they can't break through to get to food and they can't reach the higher browse so they are starving to death. Hopefully the snow melts soon.

John

[dbHunterNY]

Any theories as to why?  I would figure isolation and or low buck population. 

 

at a couple months old they're just really starting to browse and aren't as dependent on milk.  they're still testing things out for browse opposed to one born months before.  a smaller lighter body can get cold easier or quicker.  it really just has to do with being later born versus sooner due to the which cycle the mother is successfully bred.  related to this is buck to doe ratio, so low buck numbers compared to doe could be a factor.  not sure what the situation is in long island other than high doe numbers but maybe the winter browse is scarce during these late season months with the high deer numbers?  also I'm not sure at the success rate but on very rare occasion a very early born doe fawn will reach weight late season to go into estrous and be bred.  like I said not sure on probability that the buck is successful and the doe actually drops a fawn.

[mbucks27]

Area in was in some spots snow was still up to my knees. Other spots it was only a few inches. They were eating bark off the trees all over the place. The doe was with the fawn

I jumped it about 60 yards away and went over to the bed to look for sheds and then saw the fawn.

[dbHunterNY]

If the biologist is correct that they were born in November and shot in January ........wouldn't they have still had their spots ?

 

 

Good point Water Rat and you also would not be seeing and under coat....they wouldn't have had time to go through a full molt.

 

years ago I would've known this.  I'm thinking it wasn't much like 2 or so months so it's possible they could've lost spots if born early Nov.  hard to figure out from trail cams as they're probably around a month old by then as they wander more and don't bed with the doe coming to them.  I'd think FourSeasonsWhitetails could answer this question.

[jjb4900]

I've seen fawns being checked in out in Montauk druing the January season that weighed less than 30 pounds, they didn't even appear to have fully developed winter coats......I can't imagine a deer that small could survive some of the brutal cold we've had out here the last few weeks, not to mention that some places out there have terrible food supplies even when there is no snow cover.

[The_Field_Ager]

Braved the thigh deep snow here to investigate a stand of pines near the house. The Deer are using the same tracks I saw  a couple of weeks ago and have packed down the snow on these corridors. Found some beds, thankfully no dead 'uns in them. Saw some very small tracks too. There is a denser stand of hemlock further out, where I suspect the main bedding area to be, but I didn't feel like going too far without snow shoes, and didn't want to push any deer either.

 

The smell of deer along these tracks was palpable. They must be getting a lot of use and the deer must be close by a lot of the time.

[First-light]

If the biologist is correct that they were born in November and shot in January ........wouldn't they have still had their spots ?

They did have spots

Edited February 23, 2015 by First-light

[phade]

Textbook scenario where doe fawns and bb fawns should be targeted during hunting season. I am sure more than one hunter passed them this season in LI. Now look.

Edited February 23, 2015 by phade

[jjb4900]

Textbook scenario where doe fawns and bb fawns should be targeted during hunting season. I am sure more than one hunter passed them this season in LI. Now look.

not me, I figured two or three little ones add up to one bigger one when ground up into chopmeat..............I'm well aware why they keep handing out antlerless deer tags down here, and am happy to do my part.

[Water Rat]

Don't think I would want to shoot a fawn with spots , let alone use a tag on one.

I'd rather have tag soup.

[jjb4900]

Don't think I would want to shoot a fawn with spots , let alone use a tag on one.

I'd rather have tag soup.

I've never seen one with spots while hunting, and we get another tag when you check one in, so it's not a loss of a tag.

[phade]

It's not even just a numbers thing now...those dead fawns consumed food during the critical loading phase for winter. Now that food source was for naught. Hunters shooting them in the season allows that forage to be consumed by deer that are more likely to make it through.

 

So, shooting fawns in the fall hunting season eliminates a deer and also makes available food for deer more likely to survive.

[mbucks27]

This is just natures way of thinning out the heard. Personally if i'm hunting and have a 25-30lb fawn come by i would not think about shooting it.  How much meat are you really going to get off of one of those? 6 or 7 lbs if that? The adult deer are doing just fine down here haven't came across one that has died yet from winter kill and have put on a lot of miles already this winter. These guys that are out there shooting 10-15 does really think they are going to stop this from happening and they are not. Do i agree with thinning the heard yes but no matter how much you thin there will always be fawns that wont make it when we have winters like this where there is a hard snowpack and the deer cant get through the snow to the food below for a long period of time.

 

John

[phade]

This is just natures way of thinning out the heard. Personally if i'm hunting and have a 25-30lb fawn come by i would not think about shooting it.  How much meat are you really going to get off of one of those? 6 or 7 lbs if that? The adult deer are doing just fine down here haven't came across one that has died yet from winter kill and have put on a lot of miles already this winter. These guys that are out there shooting 10-15 does really think they are going to stop this from happening and they are not. Do i agree with thinning the heard yes but no matter how much you thin there will always be fawns that wont make it when we have winters like this where there is a hard snowpack and the deer cant get through the snow to the food below for a long period of time.

 

John

 

Hunters are the main tool that controls deer numbers. If we don't, there will be other measures in place.

 

The winter kill down there is likely greater because of the overpopulation. Who cares if you only get 7lbs of meat when tags are plentiful - you are doing your part to control the population. That 25-30lb fawn probably ate food that would have otherwise been eaten by deer more likely to survive, so it's a double bonus.

 

Nature can be cruel, but if hunter's are not controlling deer numbers, people who are not hunters will take a larger role impacting something you value...deer hunting.

 

Its sort of like voting, if snipers come in, you don't have much room to complain. They won't think twice about shooting a fawn, because they'll have already shot it dead.

Edited February 23, 2015 by phade

[jjb4900]

This is just natures way of thinning out the heard. Personally if i'm hunting and have a 25-30lb fawn come by i would not think about shooting it.  How much meat are you really going to get off of one of those? 6 or 7 lbs if that? The adult deer are doing just fine down here haven't came across one that has died yet from winter kill and have put on a lot of miles already this winter. These guys that are out there shooting 10-15 does really think they are going to stop this from happening and they are not. Do i agree with thinning the heard yes but no matter how much you thin there will always be fawns that wont make it when we have winters like this where there is a hard snowpack and the deer cant get through the snow to the food below for a long period of time.

 

John

when I spoke with the Biologist, he more or less said that they were more concerned with the destruction caused by over browsing in some areas and not so much about the deer not making it through the winter......

[growalot]

That would make taking out adult deer even more important now wouldn't it...for taking out an adult doe in late season or even the rut would reduce the herd by a possible 2-4 deer....as oppose to the one fawn that may parish anyways and also may be a buck...but alas that may make sense to only me...

[mbucks27]

the areas that i am hunting where there are larger parcels of woods are not the problem areas. its in peoples backyards and smaller private parcels where there is a big problem. They keep increasing season dates which is really not helping the  problem at all. it is just pushing more deer out of huntable areas and into areas where they know they are safe which will not fix the problem. There is really no easy way to fix the deer problem on Long Island by just shooting as many as you can b/c its not that simple.

 

John

[steve863]

Hunters are the main tool that controls deer numbers. If we don't, there will be other measures in place.

 

The winter kill down there is likely greater because of the overpopulation. Who cares if you only get 7lbs of meat when tags are plentiful - you are doing your part to control the population. That 25-30lb fawn probably ate food that would have otherwise been eaten by deer more likely to survive, so it's a double bonus.

 

Nature can be cruel, but if hunter's are not controlling deer numbers, people who are not hunters will take a larger role impacting something you value...deer hunting.

 

Its sort of like voting, if snipers come in, you don't have much room to complain. They won't think twice about shooting a fawn, because they'll have already shot it dead.

 

 

That was the point I was trying to make last year, when I said that the LI hunters are not getting the job done.  I realize there are some road blocks for the hunters out there, the biggest being access to private land, but if they continue passing up does and fawn just to wait for those big bucks, this is what can happen.  Of course some had a cow over the statements I made.  

 

I will say it again, LI in general is piss poor habitat for deer.  Seeing them die like this may appear cruel to some, but if it will bring down some deer numbers that the hunters aren't bringing down, it might not be a bad thing in the scheme of things.  At least the hunters can't bitch that high priced snipers were called in for the jobs they could have done, or should I say COULDN'T get done.

[mbucks27]

Access is the main reason we cant get it done Steve just like you said and like i said before i know this is natures way of thinning the heard and i am fine with that. Get me into some private spots that are loaded with deer and i will gladly do my part and shoot as many as the land owner would like. But im not going to do it in the areas that i do hunt where the problem doesn't exist. 

 

John

[First-light]

Steve I agree that habitat is pitiful for the deer. I also follow FB page of LI deer hunting. A lot of these guys go out the first week and score on nice bucks. They then switch over to shooting does. A couple of guys took double digit amount of does. Sure there are guys out the passing the little ones up but from what I have seen a lot of does were taken by this group. I totally understand the logic you are putting forward but it isn't the case with this group, which is pretty big. 

[jjb4900]

Access is the main reason we cant get it done Steve just like you said and like i said before i know this is natures way of thinning the heard and i am fine with that. Get me into some private spots that are loaded with deer and i will gladly do my part and shoot as many as the land owner would like. But im not going to do it in the areas that i do hunt where the problem doesn't exist. 

 

John

exactly, it really falls on the hunters to adapt to the areas they are hunting and adjust what they kill accordingly.....you really can't apply a blanket harvest agenda in all areas.