Where to Buy Hunting land

[growalot]

Posted Today, 03:14 PM

growalot, on 12 Mar 2015 - 3:30 PM, said:

Ever thought about going to a farm...preferably older farmer...and saying I am looking to purchase so many acres...I would be willing to give you so many years of farming access for a reasonable price on said amount of land...would you be willing to sell?...There are also behind the scene incentives you could mention in passing say so much cash and so much per acre on books verses off...just saying....

 

you won't get a blade of grass that way.  go ask their kids.

 

 

 

 

Really?...hhhmmm I happen to have gotten 64 acres from one farmer full of blades of grass...and then 24 1/2 acres from another land owner for $10,000 doing just that sort of thing...though one did want to be buried and they were. The other just wanted us to do some farming...and not divide it..no problem

[jrm]

enough tillable used acreage, here it's 10, and you get an ag exemption.

I have been trying to look into this although I think I am under the minimums. From what I have read, it doesn't seem possible to get the ag exemption when you aren't the farmer. People tell me different, but I can't find anything to support those claims. In addition to acreage, there is also a minimum revenue from ag operation - I think it was about $10k. So unless you lease your land to a farmer for >10k/year you might not qualify.

Also, there are penalties if ag operations cease, with a 5-year claw-back. So if that farmer lease falls through inside of 5 years, you could be subject to back taxes and interest.

It also seems the tax benefit only applies to the portion of land used for ag purposes. If 50% of the land is farmed, discount is only applied to 50% of the land.

If the amount of land is big enough, I am sure it pays off. I think if you are right around the minimums, the juice isn't worth the squeeze.

This is what it LOOKS LIKE TO ME (not presenting this as fact). I have heard different conflicting stories from people who should know the real answers. The NYS website has some info, but it is written in "tax code," not regular english.

Land cost is going to vary, although I think you should be able to get acreage in the $2,000/acre range. Depends on so many things... utility access, views, location, topography, resources. A neighbor in Delaware County had 50 acres listed for 102k about 2 years back. I think she lowered the price about 10% and it sold. Absolutely gorgeous piece of land, with great views and decent hunting. Meanwhile, other vacant pieces in the surrounding area have been on the market for a long time with no sales.

If you are a cash buyer, there are deals. Someone mentioned looking at auctions... another great source of deals.

Either way, watch out. You want to make sure you can build what you want. You want to make sure you can place a septic system where you want it. Water availability is another factor. Watch out for deed restrictions. Some people have a "no hunting" restriction onto deed.

Buying vacant land is much different than buying land with a house. If you pay $50k for 50 acres it may sound like a good deal. But if it costs you an extra $30,000 to put in a septic system and you have to revise your home building plans, and then the building site means electric service will cost and extra $10,000 to install... things can add up real quick.

Taxes are also a big factor. NYS hits you hard with property and school. That is a recurring annual fee forever. Like they say... you don't own anything in the U.S., you merely rent it from the government. Stop paying and they take it back. Same thing on auctions... find out if there are any tax liens on the property that have to be settled to get clear title.

[jrm]

If you intend on living on the property that you intend on buying ( it depends on ) How much income you have when you retire. Can you afford to have someone plow you out almost every day as with the weather we had this year or can you afford a plow truck or what ever to move snow ?. House ( closer to a plowed road the better) Also a good generator and fuel supply if the power goes out. To supply and run the house and heating and refrig. systems. Many things to plan on. Add every thing up first and see if it is worth it.

So true. My February plow bill just came. Close to $500. Plow had to come eight times. At one point, the driveway was so bad, there was no where to move the snow. Had to get a bobcat in to move snow out... too much for the plow. There were 8 ft walls on the side of the driveway.

Taxes, electric, propane, maintenance. It adds up. A guy down the road planned on retiring to his place upstate. The place ended up going into foreclosure and was sold at auction. His retirement portfolio had problems and he couldn't afford the upkeep. bad situation.

On the other hand, if you work the numbers and can afford it... it's a great situation.

Edited March 12, 2015 by jrm

[HectorBuckBuster]

JRM, I am not sure what the Ag Exemption is in your county, but in my area if you are leasing the land to a farmer, you need to have at least 7 acres (on each parcel) that they will be farming. If you are the farmer and have a farm income of at least $10,000 any size property can get a ag exemption. Also they give us in my area a ag exemption on not just the tillable land, but up to 50 acres of woods. Right now you if you raise 10-12 cows for beef and then sell them in them off you can pretty much cover the $10,000 income to qualify to be a farmer.I have to renew my Ag Exemption every year by March 1st. All I need to do is sign the form attach a copy of my lease with the farmer and mine is done. But when I first got the Ag exemption I had to get copies of soil types from the Soil Conservation Dept.

[dbHunterNY]

JRM, I am not sure what the Ag Exemption is in your county, but in my area if you are leasing the land to a farmer, you need to have at least 7 acres (on each parcel) that they will be farming. If you are the farmer and have a farm income of at least $10,000 any size property can get a ag exemption. Also they give us in my area a ag exemption on not just the tillable land, but up to 50 acres of woods. Right now you if you raise 10-12 cows for beef and then sell them in them off you can pretty much cover the $10,000 income to qualify to be a farmer.I have to renew my Ag Exemption every year by March 1st. All I need to do is sign the form attach a copy of my lease with the farmer and mine is done. But when I first got the Ag exemption I had to get copies of soil types from the Soil Conservation Dept.

 

this is my understanding.  although I'm not sure about what acreage the exemption (reduction in taxes) is applied to.  I can get the answer but don't remember right now.  you don't have to lease it and make 10k the farmers income picks that up.  it's much easier route than trying to file and claim you are a farm yourself.  if you go that route it'll help to have another farmer look at it with you.  they could answer lots of questions to determine if you can successfully lease it or just let a farmer use it to keep it as field and for exemption.  too hilly, ledge ridden, size and shape not make it a PITA, access wide enough, etc. are all questions they can answer in a half an hour that'd take you days to sort out.  this is isn't really a determining factor to purchase though just something to think about. to get back.  also if you've got access for farm equipment you very well may have access to sections of woods to have parts logged.  same thing applies to a logger looking at it with you... just don't do it with the selling party around and make sure you're not slowing down the process for the seller if it's on or going to be on the market.  while you're screwing around someone else could buy it from under ya.

[Bone Seeker]

Thanks for the input fellas. However....everyone is telling me what they would do, what I should do, and Nobody is answering my original question.....WHERE would you buy if it were you.  This wont be the first property I bought in my life. I know what to worry about as far as taxes, building ect. And I will be a cash buyer.

 

What I was really getting at is....where? But then  again, Im sure there are many variables. 

Ive picked up alot from the posts. One thing is that if its the right piece, in the right spot, I may be able to be happy with much less acreage. I think 50-100 is a good range. Nothing bad about buying land, last I checked, they arent making any more of it. Im paying more attention to what Surrounds the land I like. Thats thanks to your ideas men.  Thanks.

[Bone Seeker]

Looking forward to seeing more "Posted" signs with out of town names and addresses on them.  We love that.

Its guys like you that I love meeting up with on my posted land. I promise you would never return a second time. 

[virgil]

Bone seeker, your original post describes exactly my situation and the reasons why I bought land in the first place.  I recently bought land in Otsego and have so far been very happy with it.  I had owned property in Cortland County and found that I can get a lot more for my money in Otsego.  My previous property was 20 acres surrounded by state land (forest).  My new property is 53 acres surrounded by mostly agricultural fields.  I've been thrilled with the quantity of deer and turkey I've seen so far.  Prices for 'hunting land' in Otsego were $1100 to $1500 per acre.

[steve863]

Its guys like you that I love meeting up with on my posted land. I promise you would never return a second time. 

 

 

 

Hopefully he was only joking, and only trying to make a point.  You'll never have all your property patrolled 24/7, even if you live on it.  Plenty of property owners have been given a lot of grief by trespassers and neighbors who set up stands right on property lines.  Standing tough with them like you think you will be able to isn't always a sure fire solution either.  People can be insane and can take revenge when you least expect it and in many different ways.  Instead of having a hunting utopia of their own, many property owners only end up with a lot of headaches.  Hopefully that won't be your case, but I think that's the point that poster was trying to make to you.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Thanks for the input fellas. However....everyone is telling me what they would do, what I should do, and Nobody is answering my original question.....WHERE would you buy if it were you.  This wont be the first property I bought in my life. I know what to worry about as far as taxes, building ect. And I will be a cash buyer.

 

What I was really getting at is....where? But then  again, Im sure there are many variables. 

Ive picked up alot from the posts. One thing is that if its the right piece, in the right spot, I may be able to be happy with much less acreage. I think 50-100 is a good range. Nothing bad about buying land, last I checked, they arent making any more of it. Im paying more attention to what Surrounds the land I like. Thats thanks to your ideas men.  Thanks.

Buy land next to a state park safety zone. You will never be sorry. You have some top notch hunting of your own on your land and you can jump over on the state/park land at any time.  

[Bone Seeker]

Bone seeker, your original post describes exactly my situation and the reasons why I bought land in the first place.  I recently bought land in Otsego and have so far been very happy with it.  I had owned property in Cortland County and found that I can get a lot more for my money in Otsego.  My previous property was 20 acres surrounded by state land (forest).  My new property is 53 acres surrounded by mostly agricultural fields.  I've been thrilled with the quantity of deer and turkey I've seen so far.  Prices for 'hunting land' in Otsego were $1100 to $1500 per acre.

Thanks Virgil for the reply. I have my eye on a 98 acre piece in Otsego county now. Glad to hear the deer population is solid. I may find a smaller piece if I can. Like you, its good to see what surrounds the land you want. That can add to your acreage without having to pay for it. The piece I saw is in Exeter area. Ill look at in when the snow melts.

[virgil]

Good luck to you.  You might want to try to see it while there is still some snow- a whole lot easier to see tracks on the ground.  You sound like you know what you're doing- my best advice would be to not rush it.  As far as my new property goes, it's the agricultural fields surrounding it that keep the wildlife there.  The deer and turkey have no reason to go anywhere else.  They have a few hundred acres of contigious woods surrounded by food.  Are you using a real estate agency?

[Chenango Dave]

Heres a good link to find land with camps. This is where I found my 55 acres with a camp already on it.

You can search by town or county. Chenango County has some great hunting and plenty of state land availble as well. Good luck with your search!

http://www.landandfarm.com/search/New-York-land-for-sale/

[Bone Seeker]

Virgil,  Not yet. Ive inquired about a few properties with them, but havent actually hired them for help. I let them know what Im looking for and ask them to contact me. Once the snow melts to where I can go to my leased land, I will stop and inspect some of these places. Im not ready to purchase just yet, till I sell a house here in NH first. Im still going to live here till I retire(8Yrs), but want to get something started out there. Even if its just planting fruit trees or other vegitation for the future. Its an exciting time, knowing I will have a new place to play with. Hopefully I find something with a small camp already on it. I prefer not to have to build right away.  M

[stoneam2006]

As a member who hunts a few parcels with out of state owners...it may bennifit you to make friends with a local maybe a guy with a kid or 2 who hunt and would be willing to help post maintain and keep an eye on it overall durring times when your not down there....we do ours strictly for hunting abilities it's a win win for all as we clear paths of fallen trees brush and try and help control the coyote population. O and we also hang a few stands that they use when they are down too.

Edited March 13, 2015 by stoneam2006

[skully]

If it's land that you will eventually live on, maybe it's worth buying.  To live on you surely don't need 100 acres.  But to buy 100 acres just to hunt on for a few weeks each year is a waste of money.  In NYS the price of land seems to be at least $1000 per acre in most places I've seen.  That will add up to at least $100K in cost and taxes each and every year after that.  For that kind of money I could go on some really nice hunts elsewhere until I die.  Actually, I could probably go on a nice hunt each and every year with the amount I will need to pay for taxes alone on those 100 acres each and every year.  I'll also have no headaches of running back and forth to the property to maintain it and monitor it throughout the rest of the year.  That's how I see it anyway.   

 

Totally disagree.....  It is an investment and if you find a good piece of land cheap it is a great investment plus you get to do what you love on your land.  Your gonna get all that money back some day and then some.  Just like buying a house, why rent when you could buy.  Tax for recreational land is not that expensive and you could always lease your land to  someone in off season to pay taxes.

[growalot]

I only know the Alleghany,Stueben ,Livingston areas,So I'm no help on where your looking, other than to say 25-125 acre peice,  doesn't really matter as much as configuration.

 

This is mostly true when you have to concider what does and could possible border you in the future. Like it or not there is still a 500ft rule for gun hunting.

 

[Berniez]

Don't listen to the nay sayers,  If you want property go for it.  (100 acres allows you some room to walk around on and do some habitat improvement.)

In my teens I was tired of finding places to hunt only to be shut out the next year because somebody either rented it or sold it off for housing. The year I graduated college I started looking for 100 acres with a house barn and trout stream.  It took 4 years but I found my slice of heaven.  I had a choice to either go on an elk hunt out west or use that money as a down payment for the property. I chose the property,  I can hunt upland species, waterfowl, deer and take a trout or two. For 30 years it was a place to hunt and I rented the house out to help with the mortgage. Eventually I fixed the barn up for us to use as a weekend place.  As I grew older I started managing the place for small game and found out that the deer and turkey like it too.  Eventually it became an every weekend place and the locals finally accepted me as one of them. (Being a good cook and having them over didn't hurt  The BARN became a place to meet dine and just have a good time. Everybody finally realized I had no other motive other than wanting to hunt, fish and enjoy the area. Eventually  they started asking me if I wanted to hunt on their place.  So 35 years later I have my 100 acres to hunt, great neighbors and permission to hunt on their 2,000 acres too (I know a lot of neighbors).  My advice is if you want it.... do it. 

The economy sucks in Otsego county and there is plenty of land available at a reasonable price.  Watch the towns tax rate where you plan to settle because taxes range from ok to you gotta be kidding me (Oneonta, Laurens are prime examples of towns that think they need to suck the landowner dry)

,,,,,and if the State ever stops their tramping on our property rights and allows drilling for gas....that $1000 an acre will be a bargain.  In any case a place to hunt to for the next 40 years would come out to about 2,500 a year +taxes to hunt on your property the way you want to.

BTW  I never regretted canceling the elk hunt to buy the property....it has payed off in memories with the kids, friends and family every year.

 

 

[Doc]

Yes, obviously, I have bought my own land and enjoy being a landowner. But I will not be offering up the Pollyanna view saying that it is nothing but positives. All I can say is look at all sides of land-ownership, and do pay attention to all those that have a few words of warning to add to your decision. You already know all the "positives". You have been concentrating on those while you have been considering buying. But to make a proper decision, understand that there are some concerns that should be factored into your decision.

 

 

[First-light]

I read the original post and nothing in between. I bought in the Finger lakes 8 years ago. Had a place built by a local builder/Amish. Never looked back after that. Place has so many memories attached, priceless. Made the place big enough to have friends and family stay over. Back the I paid $1,100 an acre. Things you want or nice to have when purchasing your land:

Mineral rights

Wind rights

My property has a field that is leased to a local farmer. I'm in the AG program and it cuts the taxes in half.

A neighbor that lives close by full time. Get to know him and he will watch the place when you are gone.

You will retire there. Make sure you buy it for that and not just for hunting. My property has some really great views. Front porch is a great place to hang out and watch the world go by……Good luck.