Buy Land - Then what?

[steve863]

Map attached. The other 2 blue parcels are what we would own as well and park there. The red is a trail (paper road) that we are allowed to walk up to our property on.

 

 

Are there any houses on any of those small parcels around your 2 small parcels down near the road?  It almost looks like a string of properties that would have houses built on them.  What about those roads that seem to end in a circle near your 20 acre parcel?  Are there structures built there?

[moog5050]

Can you walk the 115?  If so, some scouting will provide answers as will some sits.  Logic suggests that the deer bed in the thick stuff and move to feed on acorns (as you stated), but there could be more in play.  You need to scout it to assess.  Good news is that you have plenty of time to figure this property out as the new owner.

[BizCT]

Are there any houses on any of those small parcels around your 2 small parcels down near the road? It almost looks like a string of properties that would have houses built on them. What about those roads that seem to end in a circle near your 20 acre parcel? Are there structures built there?

Only house is across the street from our small 2 blue parcels which we will use to pull off road to park.

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[BizCT]

Can you walk the 115? If so, some scouting will provide answers as will some sits. Logic suggests that the deer bed in the thick stuff and move to feed on acorns (as you stated), but there could be more in play. You need to scout it to assess. Good news is that you have plenty of time to figure this property out as the new owner.

The 115 is not posted where it border our 20, so when we try our best to post a line we will see what is down there. I did drive around on the main to the front of the 115, where it touches the main road and its heavily posted and looks swampy/overgrown leading to a mountain, which is where our land is on top of.

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[magnumhunt]

Biz- Congrats on the purchase!! I too purchased land this year and its pretty exciting I have to say. The closing took about a month even with no banks involved, not sure why and didnt push it. One thing I didnt do is get a title company involved. Why pay extra $1,500 I was being charged? Some peopel told me to do it some told me not too. As far as putting posted signs I havent done that yet. I will purchase from the website that was posted further back. I put up cameras right away to try and find a deer pattern. I think you should do the same and youll get a better idea and see whats on the property. Congrats and good luck!!

[BizCT]

Congrats!

How far apart do u guys post? Trying to get an idea of how many signs my dad needs to buy.

Rough dimensions of 4 sides are 300yds, 400yds, 475yds, 225yds

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[moog5050]

Depends on visibility and whether you need to make a statement, but every 30-40yds is generally good.  In the thick stuff and where I feel like trespassers are likely, closer.

[BizCT]

Depends on visibility and whether you need to make a statement, but every 30-40yds is generally good. In the thick stuff and where I feel like trespassers are likely, closer.

Cool, thx. Not super heavy pines or anything so we were thinking 30

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[Culvercreek hunt club]

Cool, thx. Not super heavy pines or anything so we were thinking 30

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one on each corner facing both directions too.

[jjb4900]

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/8371.html

these are the guidelines from the website.......

[moog5050]

"Signs shall be no more than 660 feet apart ..."  That minimum is 120yds.  Not real practical if you want to establish that a trespasser should have seen your signs.  But then again Biz, you would only need 10 signs to post your whole property.  lol

 

I would prefer to have the "eyesore" concern and no trespassers.

[BizCT]

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/8371.html

these are the guidelines from the website.......

Yup, read through all that.

Thx tho

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[BizCT]

"Signs shall be no more than 660 feet apart ..." That minimum is 120yds. Not real practical if you want to establish that a trespasser should have seen your signs. But then again Biz, you would only need 10 signs to post your whole property. lol

I would prefer to have the "eyesore" concern and no trespassers.

Yea I'm thinking 1400yds, so 50 signs or so going every 30 yards. Probably just have him buy 100 signs customized.

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[WNYBuckHunter]

Our rule of thumb is, if you cant see 3 of them from the other side of the line at all times, we need to add more. Along the road we space them out further.

[Water Rat]

You might want to consider vacant land insurance (umbrella policy) in addition to the posted signs.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

You might want to consider vacant land insurance (umbrella policy) in addition to the posted signs.

for what purpose?

[Water Rat]

You run the risk of being liable if someone gets hurt on your property , regardless of how many posted signs you put up. Posted signs only minimize the risks , not eliminate them.

[jrm]

You run the risk of being liable if someone gets hurt on your property , regardless of how many posted signs you put up. Posted signs only minimize the risks , not eliminate them.

Not to be contradictory, but everything I have read (including information on the DEC website) contradicts that. It says the NYS law protects the property owner, even if you allow people to hunt the land. They only time you would need insurance (and forego the mentioned protection) is if you charge money (commercial).

From the DEC site: http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/8371.html

Whether the property is posted or not, the General Obligations Law protects landowners from liability for non-paying recreationalists on their property.

If they aren't a "non-paying recreationalist" they are trespassers with criminal intent.

The only other area that would pose a problem is if you intentional created a hazard (i.e. put in a thin cable to prevent ATVs from using your trails).

Can you post a link to a NYS or legal site backing up the liability claim? I would be interested in knowing more. I'm not sure how posting can affect liability either way. Posting only increases your recourse with unwanted visitors (they can be fined).

Edited October 1, 2015 by jrm

[Water Rat]

Just look up " Vacant Land Insurance ".

[jrm]

Just look up " Vacant Land Insurance ".

I just did. Nothing listed for a New York company. Some agencies also suggest that vacant land liability may be covered under an existing homeowner's policy. None of the information was specific to NYS.

I have nothing against liability insurance - I'm loaded up with it. But I still believe that vacant land insurance in New York state is superfluous, given our liability laws. While I am sure an agent can find a vacant land policy to sell you in NY, that doesn't necessarily mean it provides any real benefit. DEC and NYS law seem to indicate it is unnecessary.

I'm not trying to argue, just trying to understand what you base your claim on. As a landowner, I would really like to know if such a policy has any value in NYS. I cannot find any factual information to support the purchase.

Also, there is nothing to suggest posting (or not) has any effect on liability. Posting (in NYS) only relates to trespass. I could not find anything to contradict this either.

Edited October 2, 2015 by jrm

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Just look up " Vacant Land Insurance ".

Or NY's General obligation law.

 

Nothing will stop you from being sued, even having insurance, but to pay for what the statue already provides is crazy in my mind.

 

https://www.americanwhitewater.org/resources/repository/New_York_Recreational_Use_Statute.htm

[moog5050]

JRM and Culver have it right.  The only thing I could see the insurance assisting with is defense costs if you were sued (even a suit without any real basis).  Homeowners and umbrella may cover those defense costs also.  I don't carry insurance specific to my vacant parcel.

[jjb4900]

the vacant land / posting issue aside, I would think that anyone who owns a home and has any assets would carry an umbrella policy....people can and will sue for anything these days, whether it's a friend who gets hurt on your boat, hurt in your car, falls out of your treestand on your property....you name it and it can happen.

[hunter]

You might want to look into that watershed property for hunting access, I know the reservoirs

give free permits but you have to apply. Then you're allowed to hunt and the posted signs don't apply because you have a permit. Just a shot. Congrats and happy hunting to you and your dad.

[jjb4900]

You might want to look into that watershed property for hunting access, I know the reservoirs

give free permits but you have to apply. Then you're allowed to hunt and the posted signs don't apply because you have a permit. Just a shot. Congrats and happy hunting to you and your dad.

not always........even with a permit some DEP land is off limits.