Lower the legal shooting distance for bow????

[Red]

Doc, many towns/villages have their own no discharge of firearms..and by state defintion this includes bows, i cant tell you the number of people i see practicing in a village that has a no discharge of firearm law, shooting their bow illegal but ignored by local law enforcement . several caome to mind... lancaster, depew, west seneca, cheektowaga off the top of my head right around buffalo... if this was truly so dangerous wouldn't local pd stop them? there is no reason not to reduce this for bow it seems that the bow got lumped back in with firearms at the statelevel when the 500' rule was enacted, its time to remedy this error...

me and my buddys all shoot in my yard in buffalo te police have drove by and seen us a few times and never stopped. most people who see us shooting stop to watch and say how much fun it looks like.

[Doc]

Doc, many towns/villages have their own no discharge of firearms..and by state defintion this includes bows, i cant tell you the number of people i see practicing in a village that has a no discharge of firearm law, shooting their bow illegal but ignored by local law enforcement . several caome to mind... lancaster, depew, west seneca, cheektowaga off the top of my head right around buffalo... if this was truly so dangerous wouldn't local pd stop them? there is no reason not to reduce this for bow it seems that the bow got lumped back in with firearms at the statelevel when the 500' rule was enacted, its time to remedy this error...

I just think that hunting 50 yards from someone's house is a bit tacky and unnecessary. In terms of the safety aspect, I believe it is more than just a function of distance. There is always the question of adequate back-stops, and the direction of the shot. I don't want anyone standing 50 yards from my house and shooting straight in my direction. I can't imagine anyone liking that idea. And yet we talk about legalizing such a practice. There might be something a bit un-nerving looking over toward your neighbor's place and seeing someone getting ready to loose and arrow in your direction at 50 yards.

We do some target shooting at 50 yards and beyond, and we have a standing rule that regardless of shot distance, everyone is behind the shooter ..... always! ....... even at 50 yards and even farther. So why would I expect that my neighbor's house can act as my backstop for my 50 yard shots? Would you like to have to call your neighbor and ask if he was going to be shooting before you or your family felt safe using your backyard? The 50 yard rule would allow exactly that to happen.....legally.

[SteveB]

I've said it before:

No shooting in any residential area considered unless the target is placed against the shooters own house.

[wooffer]

The DEC is thinking about it, page 54 says

DEC recommends that the setback distance for discharge of bowhunting equipment (longbows and crossbows) be reduced from 500 feet to 150 feet.

They are also proposing deer hunting in Nassau county.

deerplan2012.pdf

[liberty]

I just think that hunting 50 yards from someone's house is a bit tacky and unnecessary. In terms of the safety aspect, I believe it is more than just a function of distance. There is always the question of adequate back-stops, and the direction of the shot. I don't want anyone standing 50 yards from my house and shooting straight in my direction. I can't imagine anyone liking that idea. And yet we talk about legalizing such a practice. There might be something a bit un-nerving looking over toward your neighbor's place and seeing someone getting ready to loose and arrow in your direction at 50 yards.

We do some target shooting at 50 yards and beyond, and we have a standing rule that regardless of shot distance, everyone is behind the shooter ..... always! ....... even at 50 yards and even farther. So why would I expect that my neighbor's house can act as my backstop for my 50 yard shots? Would you like to have to call your neighbor and ask if he was going to be shooting before you or your family felt safe using your backyard? The 50 yard rule would allow exactly that to happen.....legally.

As i said before. The problem I have with the law is not necessarly being 500 from the house but the BS shed would prevent someone from hunting at 700 feet from a dwelling. That is just wrong.

[nyantler]

joe , while i agree you should have other places to hunt, some of the best hunting is in surburbia, large estate type lots lend themselfs to overpopulation of game in a small area, instead of the tax payers having to pay "sharp shooters " or worse yet police officers on overtime.. to kull the deer population wouldn't it be better to allow legal hunting in those areas using bow? in order to do this without upsetting a lot of "upscale home owners if you will" the legal distance for bow needs to be reduced..166 yards is a long long way for bow, 100 yrds or 75 or some other number should be allowed. Fact is people are practiceing illegally in these neighborhoods with out realising they are illegal. this would allow someone to protect their shrubs even though their neighbor 300' away feeds the deer(illegal as well) and doesn't want to see bambi hurt.The law should be changed not for a single case of i want but for the betterment of the communities where this is a problem... it may not be a problem where you live but these problems do exist in a lot of communities...

Sure I am all for doing what may be sensible in isolated areas.. I'm just not in favor off changing the overall law to accomodate individual situations... my guess is the reason they don't allow bow hunters to take care of these suburban problems... is because they would have an overflow of hunters that would start hunting there.. creating a whole new problem...

[Red]

Sure I am all for doing what may be sensible in isolated areas.. I'm just not in favor off changing the overall law to accomodate individual situations... my guess is the reason they don't allow bow hunters to take care of these suburban problems... is because they would have an overflow of hunters that would start hunting there.. creating a whole new problem...

i think they would be able to do something like a lottery to bow hunt some of the suburban areas and maybe have a meeting for everyone who one the lottery to go over the rules and take a few shots with their bows to show that they can actually shoot.

[SteveB]

Funny how all those wanting to hunt backyards NEVER talk about the very real issue of recovery rights.

If surrounded by anti's, how do you legally recover?

Or do they just go get the deer, sneak back at night, leave them or ?.

[Red]

meeting for every one who "won" the lottery sorry i just read my post and had to correct my spelling lol

[Doc]

As i said before. The problem I have with the law is not necessarly being 500 from the house but the BS shed would prevent someone from hunting at 700 feet from a dwelling. That is just wrong.

I understand that, but the subject here is reducing the shooting proximity for bows. And I am just pointing out that without adding some clause about not shooting at a structure, 50 yards is way too close. As I pointed out above .... just put yourself in the position of a neighbor stepping out his door and seeing someone at full draw 50 yards away with the arrow pointed at his chest. I suspect that even if the arrow was only roughly pointed in the direction of your property, you would understandably probably flip out on the guy.

As far as what kinds of structures should be included, that's another subject. My take on all this is that any residential situation that has outbuildings (including sheds), is that all buildings should be treated like dwellings since there is no real practical way to define the frequency of use.

[liberty]

Funny how all those wanting to hunt backyards NEVER talk about the A shed placeOr do they just go get the deer, sneak back at night, leave them or ?.

Recovery rights have never been an issue on my 5 acres.Every deer that I have shot goes in the direction of my good neighbor. My experience tells me that a deer seems to run in the direction it is facing after shot. My backyard abutts a creek and then a 300 acre farm. Basically I am 700 feet in the middle of no where. A shed placed in the woods 700 feet from someones dwelling should not be classified as structure for shooting purpose's, when clearly it is place there for one purpose only. Like i stated earlier. we as hunters better look to expand hunting opportunities not limit them. There are alot more hunters by number in suburbia than in rural ares of NY (DEC FACT). If we go away beacuse of oppositin by people like you then your idea of a safe hunting distance may change in the future. A7878 was introduced to increase trhe distance to 1000 ft. What is next ???? Hunters in numbers means strength. . I wonder if those that oppose this are trying to protect something (selffish) This is NYS. Stick together, we have alot of opposition!!!

[G-Man]

recovery issues have never arisen behind my familys property. but i am looking at a larger picture. this would allow a lot more areas to be open to hunting and for those of you that do hunt in a residential area, i have so has my family, and friends. You wait for a good shot. deer do not go far on a good shot. rarely beyond 50 yards. Yes there are exceptions. But, i have a friend whose family farm became surrounded by development, the edges of his property are brush(old hedge rows) the deer are there and lots of them. A 2 lane state road borders one side and a 4 lane state road the other traffic is constant. A 3rd side has a church set way back off the road. there are about 3 trees that fall outside of the 500' existing rule in a hedge row in the middle of the property. these are used for hunting. Hundred s of deer have been passed up as they are silowetted by road,houses,buildings. we've hunted there with gun and bow. 166 yards is an aweful long way to be and forces us to shoot outward(to be legal)from the center of a circle. a reduction in distance for bow would let the shooters back be facing the e road/houses/church. resulting is safer shooting and most likely a larger harvest of game during the season resulting in less ddmp needing to be issued to curb the growing population of deer. This is one example ..and i am sure it is repeated again an again in some form across the state. i do not recommend hunting in a yard that is 65x150 but for those with larger lots and 1 amicable neighbor as joe has 150 x1800 x 2 would be a 12 acre piece to hunt even if having a house close on one side that wouldnot allow you to shoot now 50 yards away with your back to their house/structure you have a huntable and legal property. and more than likely you will take a good shot and the game will never leave that property.

[Doc]

I keep reading about these unique parcels of property where in one fashion or another hunting is impaired by the 500' rule, but I have yet to read any reply to my comments of legalizing someone taking shots in the direction of a neighbor's house from a mere 50 yards. Is that really something that you support? Has anybody really visualized just how close 50 yards is? My gosh that is a commonly used target practice distance. Would you feel comfortable sending the kids out in the back yard while someone is 50 yards away shooting in their direction? How do you feel about your house being used as an archery backstop? That's the reality of the changes you people are in favor of. Am I the only one that understands that?

[fasteddie]

Hey Doc ..... have the kids wear Blaze orange jackets !

[bubba]

aahhhh I love the silence

[liberty]

I keep reading about these unique parcels of property where in one fashion or another hunting is impaired by the 500' rule, but I have yet to read any reply to my comments of legalizing someone taking shots in the direction of a neighbor's house from a mere 50 yards. Is that really something that you support? Has anybody really visualized just how close 50 yards is? My gosh that is a commonly used target practice distance. Would you feel comfortable sending the kids out in the back yard while someone is 50 yards away shooting in their direction? How do you feel about your house being used as an archery backstop? That's the reality of the changes you people are in favor of. Am I the only one that understands that?

I agree. Do away with a distance requirement and make it a directional requirement. kind of like hunting waterfowl.

[Red]

no matter what the law is 25 50 100 yards just because its a law doesnt mean its right for your situation and people should use their better judgement and hunt and shoot in a safe direction. if the law allows you to hunt with in 50 yards of your house or a place that you have permission to hunt and your able to hunt that spot safelly go for it if not go further into the woods. set yourself up so that your not shooting in the direction of the house and be smart dont hunt close to house were kids live or kids play in that yard. myself personally i like to take that long walk early in the morning to my stand and hunt deep in the woods but i do beleive that they need to open up some sort of bow hunting or something in some of these suburban neighborhoods and thing out the populations some.

[liberty]

So true about using common sense. Even with 500 ft. If you shoot your rifle in the wrong direction, no distance is going to stop that. You cannot legislate stupidity

[Doc]

no matter what the law is 25 50 100 yards just because its a law doesnt mean its right for your situation and people should use their better judgement and hunt and shoot in a safe direction. if the law allows you to hunt with in 50 yards of your house or a place that you have permission to hunt and your able to hunt that spot safelly go for it if not go further into the woods. set yourself up so that your not shooting in the direction of the house and be smart dont hunt close to house were kids live or kids play in that yard. myself personally i like to take that long walk early in the morning to my stand and hunt deep in the woods but i do beleive that they need to open up some sort of bow hunting or something in some of these suburban neighborhoods and thing out the populations some.

I think everyone knows what is "good judgement", and "right" in that situation. And we all understand common sense. And we also know what the smart thing would be in those situations. But if everyone did the "right" thing and always applied common sense, good judgement, and always did the "smart" thing, we wouldn't need any law. However, this thread is about changing the law. And the change in law that we are talking about here could and would be used as a defense to the exact scenario that I described above.

[Doc]

I agree. Do away with a distance requirement and make it a directional requirement. kind of like hunting waterfowl.

I suggested that on another similar thread, and there were objections to adding a directional requirement to that law. Remember that in suburbia, there is always some house or yard that you are shooting at that is within 50 yards. I think a combination of the two (distance and direction) would be the best law. But that is not likely to happen. I do not credit our legislators with that kind of intelligence to understand direction of a shot is more important in satisfying the safety requirement than distance. So, I fully expect that they will shorten up the distance for bows to 50 yards and there will be all kinds of neighbor disputes with people actually shooting legally but irresponsibly at their neighbors house or yard.

[nyantler]

Recovery rights have never been an issue on my 5 acres.Every deer that I have shot goes in the direction of my good neighbor. My experience tells me that a deer seems to run in the direction it is facing after shot. My backyard abutts a creek and then a 300 acre farm. Basically I am 700 feet in the middle of no where. A shed placed in the woods 700 feet from someones dwelling should not be classified as structure for shooting purpose's, when clearly it is place there for one purpose only. Like i stated earlier. we as hunters better look to expand hunting opportunities not limit them. There are alot more hunters by number in suburbia than in rural ares of NY (DEC FACT). If we go away beacuse of oppositin by people like you then your idea of a safe hunting distance may change in the future. A7878 was introduced to increase trhe distance to 1000 ft. What is next ???? Hunters in numbers means strength. . I wonder if those that oppose this are trying to protect something (selffish) This is NYS. Stick together, we have alot of opposition!!!

With all due respect liberty.. you are basing your opinion on your own personal situation... and there are more hunters that LIVE in suburbia... but most hunt outside of suburbia... and suburbia is a very loose term... my neighborhood is considered the suburb and I have over 1000 acres of woods behind my home and another 1000 across the street... as for opposition.. I'm not opposed to lessoning the distance... I just really don't care... it will never be an issue for me, because I won't let it be.. there is no hunting law anywhere that I let interfere with my hunting experience... too many guys get caught up in what they can't do.. instead of what they can do... honestly.. a lot of the hunting laws are just created for those hunters that seem to need to hunt close to the rules instead of beyond them... if everyone just hunted at 1000 ft there would have been no reason to have a 500 ft law... it was created for the guy that thought it was ok to hunt 50 ft from his neighbors home.

[liberty]

I think people that are opposed to shortening the distance feel that this is going to create all kinds of incidents. Kind of like states that lessened restrictions on concealed carry permits. The opposition claimed it would become the wild west. Truth is it has become the exact opposite. We are so accustomed to the gov't controlling everything in our lives that when restrictions are put in place we just roll over and accept them. Lets wait and see what happens. i think we beat this to death. Thanks for the lively debate.

[G-Man]

Doc do you really think everyone will be shooting at a house? heck that happens now with gun.hundreds of home shot every year right? if the property is that crowded i doubt they would be hunting there. go in a woods 50 yards an arrow will most likely not go thru the brush/trees without deflection. I feel the amout of bad people that will abuse this will far be outnumber by those that will benifit. its time the "good guys" stop being restrained by the legislation meant to regulate the few.. if you don't believe this you can turn in your guns cause they might be used in a crime....

[nyantler]

I think people that are opposed to shortening the distance feel that this is going to create all kinds of incidents. Kind of like states that lessened restrictions on concealed carry permits. The opposition claimed it would become the wild west. Truth is it has become the exact opposite. We are so accustomed to the gov't controlling everything in our lives that when restrictions are put in place we just roll over and accept them. Lets wait and see what happens. i think we beat this to death. Thanks for the lively debate.

Thats kind of stretching it a bit...

[nyantler]

Doc do you really think everyone will be shooting at a house? heck that happens now with gun.hundreds of home shot every year right? if the property is that crowded i doubt they would be hunting there. go in a woods 50 yards an arrow will most likely not go thru the brush/trees without deflection. I feel the amout of bad people that will abuse this will far be outnumber by those that will benifit. its time the "good guys" stop being restrained by the legislation meant to regulate the few.. if you don't believe this you can turn in your guns cause they might be used in a crime....

I agree with you on over regulation, but this issue isn't just about hunters... it's about making people who don't hunt feel safe in their own home and on their own property... it's about being responsible and considerate to the non-hunting community... and it gives your neighbor (hunter or not) the ability to decide whether or not he wants you hunting closer than 500 ft from his personal property. A "good guy" just doesn't need to be hunting that close to someones home... It might be far more productive to get the definition of an occupied structure changed than to change the distance.