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Honestly, I don't know whether it is some kind of macho thing when people imagine that they can routinely pull off those kinds of super long shots or whether it is just some total disregard for the prey that they hunt that makes them not care that they are taking irresponsible shots. But, when people start relying on luck with their shooting, to make up for their lack of hunting skills to get close enough to do the job right, it does kind of rub me the wrong way. I will not say that 100 yard kills on deer cannot be made. It all is relative to how many wounded losses you are willing to accept, or how little a messed up shot on a live deer bothers you. If you don't care about such things, start flinging arrows until something finally drops. But don't be coming on here and trying to make like those are average shots that people should be taking, here or anywhere else. You simply will be called out every time. You are doing the sport of bowhunting a terrible injustice, and hopefully newcomers to bowhunting will recognize BS when they read it. And it serves no one to simply let this kind of irresponsible talk stand without challenge. The reasons why those shots should be passed has been well documented in this thread. Those that choose to ignore all that just to satisfy some kind of machismo I guess probably will do that regardless of what is said. Irresponsibility is simply a given in any form of hunting and no amount of arguing on a forum is ever going to change that. But damn us if we don't try.

Maybe I missed it, but I don't recall anyone being called any names .... that's for starters. Secondly, yes, I am for putting limits on bowhunters.....self imposed limits of logic and conscience. The thought of people out there with no limits on shot selection is a frightening one regardless of weapon used. And yes, those kinds of attitudes left unchallenged do usually result in a huge disservice to the sport of bowhunting. Third, I believe that those who don't speak out when they feel advice is crossing the line, are just as bad as those that peddle that misleading nonsense in forums or anywhere else. If you are a person of principle, you cannot let irresponsibility and irresponsible statements stand unchallenged. Fourth, it has to be acknowledged that we do have young or inexperienced beginning bowhunters who really don't need to be misled by wild statements of expectation. Here again, to just sit back and let mis-information pass on to beginners is as bad as the person making such bogus statements. Fifth, your theoretical formula for setting your limits based on what you can do on an archery range with static and controlled conditions that in no way represent real hunting situations, completely ignores all the potential uncontrollable variables that have been pointed out no fewer than a half dozen times each on this thread alone. Ignoring those may be convenient, but gives a very misleading picture of real capabilities.

Biz said 75-100 yard shots were fine. Do you agree? That is what the lit my fire on this. Do you think a guy who has NEVER shot a deer in his life with archery equipment should be making statements like that and not be called out? So, do you condone 75-100 yard shot on game? I don't and I have enough years experience to say it, confidently too.

Geeze, carbon, are you on steroids ? I figure you MUST be in order to draw that big bad bow and carry around that big CHIP on your shoulder.

All these factors that Doc puts out are in my mind when I hunt. I feel like sometimes I can take a deer out to 70 yards. Then the reality of bow hunting whitetails slaps me awake. All these factors are in my bow practice but some factors I can not control. 1) My breathing: When I get a buck in my sight and the decision is made to take a shot, well lets just say buck fever is something I have had to learn to control. Plain and simple this is impossible to duplicate. Money shots are close and I usually do not loose but still do not compare to the reality of a buck that has my attention. 2)Wind, branches and leaves can adversely affect an arrows trajectory especially at long distances. 3)String jump and deer reaction. Even at 25 yards with a 300fps bow Drury Outdoors missed due to string jump as was proven in video. Plain and simple even the fastest bows are not faster than an alert deer within range. Conclusion: While I can shoot out to 70 yards at targets, live deer are basically limited to under 40 yards 50 yards on un-alert deer. If my shoulders are hurting like last year I will limit to 40 max. That sting jump is always in my mind and usually reigns me in from the 50 yard range trying for 35 yards or closer. So many other factors of the day the could limit my ability to shoot far. Rain, fog and high winds all reduce my ability by 10-20 yards making my effective range 20-30 yards max. I use to think shooting long distance was no big deal, and in reality with the new bows it is not a big deal at all but taking a deer at those distances is. All you can do is advise and as many have pointed out it is ill advised to take low percentage shots. The more I read the more I reign in my enthusiasm for long distance shots so at least you can say this post helped one individual. Thanks Doc!

that is the same view I get to see every day.

Red just described my actual situation, except that it is 180 acres in Catt County: Log cabin, abandoned apple orchards, a few open fields, large pond and lots of brush. I'm not even rich, it just happened.

Scoped Rifle .. 30-06 is great , So many different rounds. I like the 270. for all the gun hunting I do in NY.

Just waiting for the wny outdoors one at the fairgrounds

I butterflied mine and stuffed it with venison sausage stuffing, tied it up, and roasted it. Was excellent.

Just dump a bag of skittles in the toilet and flush , instant nascar race .

Without being too far fetched I would love a piece of property that is 100+ acres, has a log cabin, nothing fancy but has running water and electric. Bass pond near cabin, and property has a trout stream or river. Property is a mix of hardwoods and some open fields for food plots. I would love for it to be in NY within 30 minutes of Rochester. That's my paradise.

Here is the response I got........... Thank you for submitting a comment on the Draft Management Plan for Mute Swans in NY State. We are reviewing all of the input received and we will post a response on the DEC website, after the comment period closes, to each of the key issues identified.

Amen. For those of you who can justify long shots,what do you tell yourself when something goes wrong that is outside your control? Do you just say "oh well, the deer moved. Not my fault the arrow is now sticking out of his backside". Then take another long shot on the next one? How do you go on doing what your doing? Bowhunting is a close range sport. If you can't accept that, maybe its not for you. Or maybe you need to question what is important to you. Sorry to. Continue with abrasive talk. But this is a sore topic that I camt simply disagree with someone on. Could you imagine having to help someone track a wounded animal that they shot at 70 yds with a bow? Talk about a lousy position to be in.

Montana, so I could hunt Mulies, Whitetail, and Elk...to dream the impossible dream...

What it comes down to is that most experienced bow hunters knows that a 75-100 yard bow shot, on a live target, is a disaster waiting to happen. Practice all you want but the longer the shot (past real world bow ranges) the bigger the margin of error is.

For some reason when I read your post's I am reminded of that feminin hygene product.

That's funny, when I started thinking about how long I have been bowhunting in the last reply, I also started thinking about the mindset of bowhunters back then. You know the whole reason that I got into bowhunting back then was the challenge of having to get close to the deer. Actually, everyone that I knew was kind of into that same thing. The whole deal was having the hunting skill to get within 20 yards or less of a deer, drawing back the bow without getting spotted, and then making the shot. The emphasis was on woodslore and stealth. That's where the challenge came from and that's where the satisfaction came from. That's what separated the bow season from the gun season. Somehow over the years the whole mentality of bowhunting has shifted away from the "hunting" part of it, and has become a reliance on what technology some guy in an office can invent to get the deer for us. When did we decide that the idea of bowhunting was to see how far away we can shoot a deer? With that kind of mentality, I can't figure out why people don't go all the way with that thinking and simply stay with the gun. What is all this screwing around with bows and crossbows if you are going to maintain the gun shooting mentality and try to turn these weapons of challenge into just another long distance machine? Doesn't anybody take any pride in up-close and personal hunting skills anymore?

Send it through heart and the lungs, Bigger target to aim for and more room for error.

Order it from a guy called Carlos from Eds gun shop in north Carolina. He can waive the hazmat fee, you can't by it any cheaper anyplace .