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My big point is- how do they know 55% are unreported, 45% of bucks were 2.5 yo or older - biologists/eco did not age or check most of the deer taken- so where exactly do these stats come from?

95% of bucks in NY will grow a larger rack the following year. Age is the lacking factor in trophy potential and the herd structure. I used to be an avid AR supporter...now I would back them just so guys on deer drives should verify their target before ripping 5 off. Think there are much better solutions to increase the age average of bucks in NY. Think we have way too many does in many portions of western and central NY. The biggest factor in bumping the age of bucks alive and harvested- is having a clue. A lot of hunters do not want to believe they have an effect and the state does not have accurate numbers to provide any statistics of value. Sad deal boys....

I report my kills..and those i know do the same...for the ismple reason you cannot complain if you dont partake in the process. Explain to me how they know it if 55%..and not 15 or 80. Statistics are based on tangible numbers- not guesses that constitute the vast majority of something Science...wheres that in this mix? Find another department of resources in the US with a whitetail season that doesnt know how many deer it even has. Not starting a fight but not giving into more hot air on top of the breeze the state just issued with that report

I came on here just to post this giant POS document. Okay guys- how many of you reportred or can age a deer from the mandatory reporting system? And this is the states number one means of aging a deer? WTF???????? I call BS!!! Next- if they assume 45% are reported- how did they arrive at that number? Second and more importantly, how can someone justify anything even resembling accuracy with inflation by guessing for 2/3rds of the total? Yes, they make up 65% of the statistic!!!!!! 45% of the bucks harvest were 2.5 or better.....my arse. Again- not many aged by biologists which is all the more reason that stat could be utilized for fertilizer. Been to the taxidermists, the meat markets and unless there was some honey hole- the majority (read as almost every one, not one in two as the DEC describes) were 1.5yo or fawns. Love and hate whatever hunting issues you'd like....but......it is all worthless.....we need to band together to have the state do their job. They do not know populations (just call your region and ask how many deer are in your WMU or county....lol...you may get some babble on track surveys..) and then just threw out a turd on paper (which dictates so much) hoping people were too stupid to question it yet again. Just a shame....we need change, or at least to get what we pay for.

Immobility is key The open broke up stuff destroys your sillohette (Predator, asat, skyline, MM, Kuiu, etc)...the rest is to sell hunters on. Good camo breaks up youroutline from 5 yards to 500- try that with the vast vast majority out there and you'll get it quick as you look like a black blob in a tree from 75 yards....

why the hell do we need rifles anywhere in Wyoming (ro any upstate) county? I live in Wyoming county and bowhunt my chunk just to limit hazards. My neighbors are gun hunters- who have met the DEC on a couple of occassions for shooting too close to my house.....nice to know they can use an SKS/AR, 300 win mag, etc... or better yet the legal 17 cal centerfire..... This state is nothing short of stupid when it comes to deer management and hunting

NY hunters greatly underestimate the amount of pressure we put on the herd and how the deer that dont adapt are called dumb/dinner and those that do something different are smart/elusive. We (with this writer included) give way too much credit to whitetails for our own lack of adaptation

great job

Always wondered why gunshots in November come in groups of 5

The additional two weeks would benefit the guys who scout over the summer a ton!

I read that article and found it to be a turd from a whiner. Any man who writes about his experiences with outfitters and then slams qdm.....beyond hypocrite....thats ignorant. And if you are in the woods trying to feed your family, or moreso on here trying to defend it....your issue lies with time management and basic economics (as choices) not with being oppressed. It is your legal right to shoot what you want (though the state suggests passing yearlings and practicing qdm) but save the BS excuses.

It should be 10, but 12 is better than 14

I grew up shooting miscellaneous bows my grandfather got me from garage sales but never thought of huntinn (despite shooting them well). Then in HS (lates 80s early 90s) it was the cool thing to do in my rural school. Never took it seriously as I was basically a self taught deer hunter who only knew how to gun hunt and was proficient with it. Gave it up for a few years. Matured as a hunter a bunch, and to top it off got bit by the mature buck bug, and tried it again and WOW!!!! A bow is a fine weapon which I love to use. No interest in the envitable crossbow deal we have encroaching....but really it is much more about what is seen/experienced afield this time of year. Told many a gun hunter theyre being robbed by not being into bowhunting. Just my experience and this is a very brief summarization how I truly feel, and love bowhunting

Some of the coolest pics I have ever seen!!!! Great job my friend

Don't forget moving the gun season out of the rut....that would help protect bucks when they are most vulnerable. Interestingly, however, each of these can be disputed. Ohio does not have AR, but they obviously have big bucks. IL has a 2 buck rule and no AR, yet they have big bucks. TX has a really long gun season, but they have big bucks. Simple factors to answer these: Hunter Density Agricultural Presence/Soil Quality DNR organization that knows its deer numbers and herds (thats the big one imo)

Can they answer why we need crossbows or rifles then? Or better yet..heres an advanced one.....what is the approximate deer population and take for any given wildlife unit? Its all about license sales gentlemen

Agreed NYantler. WHY do we need anything more to control kill numbers? This forum compounds how many spoiled kids are rasied by an inferior wildlife organization. I want a crossbow, baitpiles, blah blah....... Learn to hunt. If you cannot kill deer in the SZ of NY you do not put the effort forth to deserve the reward.

So if there were not slot limits for fish, you'd keep frey if your family enjoyed the taste?

maybe we can cut up this dead horse and feed it to those of you in need of meat that hang out saying its your right to shoot what you want on an internet forum....... :

Baiting is placing a subtance that is immediately attracting game Food plots, Oak Trees, Funnels, Corn fields are not baiting. Estrus urine is. Just my thoughts. Typically this topic comes up, especially on here, when someone is whining about not being able to legally use the deercane, greens-n-rage, etc, crap that they bought from Gander or Dicks (which why the F are they selling that here???)....... Laziness and a lack of drive and skill with no motivation to change that. -Sorry for the vent-

This winter has to have been hard on the herd in areas My primary ground was caught in that 42" in 30 hrs storm in late Nov-Per observation and camera surveys it appears alot of the bucks "vanished" by mid Dec..think the possibility of dropping early due to that winter stress is a consideration of mine...

without a doubt...and even more true with binocs Vortex, sightron, nikon, leupold (higher lines) are the way to go. BDCs mean nothing- practice is key

Strength in numbers....yes....death by dumbasses- even moreso. How many "good gun owners" have been in the news in 2011? Everyone knows the d-bag kids from AZ though Desperation is to hang on to our weak- sorry boys I rather fight for small numbers but have the safety....and it wouldnt be elitist if it was just hardwork

I totally disagree with your idea and statemnt on foodplots. My contribution is a tad different Most writers say feeders train deer and do not provide as much of a harvest opportunity. Also in an area of high browse (and ag) like w NY- they would only be money makers when the herd was stressed/starving Biggest issue- why say more deer need to go if no one knows the population? Not a good move to kill more or even do what we're doing now

yup. either side of the argument, when open minded and having an unbias perspective will easily see the lack of education NY hunters have and that is matriculating from the lack of understanding our DEC has