Managing your own farm

[WhitetailAddict11]

So me and my buddy had a little disagreement the other night. It started out by me saying that with all these hunting shows of guys shooting big deer on their own personal farms in the Midwest, I would bet there's a large majority of guys who would love to see someone grow and shoot big deer in the northeast, such as NY. I argued that if I owned at least 200 acres of quality tillable and timbered property, that it would be possible to shoot deer in the 150+ class after 4-5 years of strict deer management, possible cooperation with bordering landowners, and optimum land management. Im not saying on a yearly basis I could shoot big giants. But I'd say that it would not be out of the question. He firmly disagreed with me. What do you guys say? I believe ny has great big buck potential!!

[Doc]

Certainly. Anyone who wants to seriously get involved in growing their own trophies can do it here in NYS as easily as anywhere else. But you do have a few additional laws and such to get around when doing that sort of thing here in NY. For example the deer feeding laws definitely would get in your way here. Food supplements and mineral feeding are things that some of those Midwest states have legalized. Unless you want to get whatever permissions that come along with a commercial deer farm, you are definitely starting at a disadvantage.

[growalot]

It's being done now and with smaller pieces and no co-operation with neighbors...I've seen deer like that taken out of Castile...Hemlock...Naples..Wayland...Bloomfield..ect...ect

Those were on non "managed" farm lands...

[WhitetailAddict11]

No deer farming for me Doc, just farming my land and managing it through such things as timber improvement and controlled burns for the ultimate deer haven! I don't need those supplements. Saves me money haha! As for you Grow, I also agree, half the reason I'm so confident in this approach is because I see good deer get killed around here year after year, off unmanaged property that gets pounded by gun hunters. Im not saying ill ever have the money to do it, but it's fun to think about.

[Doc]

Ok ..... I got thrown off by the title of the thread.

 

I don't doubt that you can improve habitat to the point where you see some improvement in deer size and quality. As you noted, we have the genetics here that show the potential of NYS trophies.

[G-Man]

I've done it here with deer to the130-40's and are not strict on sise limitations. Deer just need age more than anything. We have increased weight sby15lbs across the board as well. A strict program would do better I'm sure if the goal was huge bucks, were out to have fun more than anything and enjoy hunting other games as much. The biggest help is a sanctuary area that is thick and not hunted or pressured year round. Ours is 30 acres, And another 10 acres piece. Food is of a secondary thought when trying to get deer to maturity.

[landtracdeerhunter]

I's being done across the state every year. Just pick up a copy of the New York Big Buck Club book and be amazed inside. Those are only the recorded ones too, still more not recorded.

[Cabin Fever]

It's absolutely possible. Just have to train them not to venture off your property AND to watch for traffic when crossing roads!

[WhitetailAddict11]

Good thinking Cabin haha

[WhitetailAddict11]

Im glad to see that you all agree with me. There's too many misconceptions that big deer only live in the heartland. If anyone of us owned property on a scale as large as the kisky's, lakosky's, drury's, etc. we could grow deer every bit as big as those bruisers they shoot.

[thphm]

Listening to a few fellows who have hunted in the mid. and western states on some of the places like that.This was on Long Island, NY. out east around the farms.Two of the fellows harvested 8 pointers that morning.There comment was that we went all the way out there spent all that money and got better looking deer ( antlers size ) right here at home.This was during archery season.There was one 10 pointer that was seen and on trail camera pictures that was very close if not over 300 pounds.And I have seen pictures of deer over 200 pounds also taken on L.I. and Schoharie county, N.Y..

[G-Man]

its not the land but hunter densities in the mid west, average rec property here 30 acres or so, 50 if your lucky. there small farms are 440 acres. large can be thousands. put the 2-4 guys at average camp in nys on 30 acres, and 2-4 on 440..big difference... deer can get old not from trigger control but just cause they are not hunted...the growing of there deer isn't them growing them its a 1 buck limit and hundreds to choose from. so wait for a good one. here some people never even see a buck...

 

 

[landtracdeerhunter]

Im glad to see that you all agree with me. There's too many misconceptions that big deer only live in the heartland. If anyone of us owned property on a scale as large as the kisky's, lakosky's, drury's, etc. we could grow deer every bit as big as those bruisers they shoot.

 

Actually with the amount of habitat NY. has, % wise, NY does an excellent job at big buck harvest representation. We don't want the word to get out, to many of them "out of stater's"  would be flocking in here like they do in Ohio, LOL.

 

[WhitetailAddict11]

Poor Ohio haha. Im posting the entire NY stage border

[gjs4]

I doubt most peopel even know the caliber of bucks on their ground let alone what could be there.

 

Been doing the management deal since 99- can be a big burden and your neighbors will profit and screw you BUT it is so worth it.....dont drive/push and just hunt the fringe (whether 5 or 5000 acres) and you'll never look back

[phade]

The right small piece of ground is better than the big not nearly as right piece of ground. Not all acreage is equal.

Lots comes into play into this question. I just think the most lacking thing is hunter skill. So many people spend the time and money "managing" land and never really taking the time to learn how to kill those bucks that take advantage of the management. Managing can only take you so far...it doesn't pull the trigger for you though.

[Nomad]

I hunt a 3000 acre farm. We manage it as do some of the neighbors .one year a 170 ,160 ,and 150 class bucks were taken .

Trail cam. Pics from this year look promising .....

And no we don't post them lol.

Edited August 16, 2013 by Larry302

[BizCT]

I hunt a 3000 acre farm. We manage it as do some of the neighbors .one year a 170 ,160 ,and 150 class bucks were taken .

Trail cam. Pics from this year look promising .....

And no we don't post them lol.

Any pics of those 3 kills?

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[WhitetailAddict11]

Pics of some deer harvested gjs4?? I completely agree with you as well Phade, managing your farm to its greatest potential means nothing if you hunt poor winds, have crappy entrance and exit routes, and do not scout your property year after year to find new stand locations and potentially better your best stands. Oh did I mention that practicing good scent control techniques i.e. showering, dressing in field, spraying down; and avoiding hunting your best timber stands until the rut is also important??

[phade]

gjs4 has some good deer on the wall for the battles he's had to fight with neighbors. I don't know how the man stays sane with the crap he's had to put up with from those people.

 

I've always tossed around the idea that I'd rather own several smaller properties spread out over a geographical area rather than one singular parcel. To me, it's like a risk mitigation practice. 200 acres is good size here in NY, but it's not big enough to the point that the neighbors won't have a major impact on what you do, or keeps several mature bucks holed up on your ground permanently.

 

My only caveat would be along the lines of being in a co-op area or backing up to a large noon-hunting parcel such as a park or business, or some other such set-up. In those situations, you can really make some gains.

 

Otherwise, I almost think I'd prefer to have several 25-75 acre tracts mixed in and around the area with varying degrees of characteristics...bedding, transition, late season bedding/food sources, etc. That way something is always in play. I know its a bit different than others think, but I look at things differently because of my career background.

Edited August 16, 2013 by phade

[Nomad]

Any pics of those 3 kills?

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Ya they are on the wall in the shop, one was in the D&C ( Roch. Newspaper)

Do,I have digital ones? No, could take a shot of the wall sometime.

But the thing is its kept on the down low,this years trail cam pics I had to visit the farmer to see them as they don't send them. Once you send to one guy then he sends it to 2 more and the next thing you know it's on a hunting forum ,which is NOT what we want.

When a local stops me at the road or such and he asked how'd you make out? My answer is always the same. couple of does.....

Last thing I'd do,is show him pics. Or tell him what's around.

Edited August 17, 2013 by Larry302

[WesternNY]

There are a ton of factors and you could type forever and not touch them all.

 

Age is the biggest factor, simple.  NY state takes great bucks and will continue to do so.  Some parts of the state are better than others.

 

Mid West states have 3 things going for them, some have 4. 

 

Great Habitat

Great Soils

Lots of deer, (and the Habitat to support them) the 4th being lower pressure in terms of hunters per sq mile

 

We have lots of deer as well, but most of our habitat in NY State as a whole is pretty marginal at best.  I feel most of us, not ALL ....have too many deer for the habitat to support.

 

Look at a soil map and look at B&C entries.  Pretty simple.   Better soil allows everything that a deer consumes to transfer the nutrients the plant was able to take from the soil to the deer.  NY has drastic soil differences just with in the state, but compared to Midwest it is black and white.  That doesn't mean we can't have great bucks, we already do.    Anyone who has land, the time, willingness to put in the labor, and the strength to hold off on the trigger can greatly improve their hunting and chances at better quality bucks. 

[BizCT]

Ya they are on the wall in the shop, one was in the D&C ( Roch. Newspaper)

Do,I have digital ones? No, could take a shot of the wall sometime.

But the thing is its kept on the down low,this years trail cam pics I had to visit the farmer to see them as they don't send them. Once you send to one guy then he sends it to 2 more and the next thing you know it's on a hunting forum ,which is NOT what we want.

When a local stops me at the road or such and he asked how'd you make out? My answer is always the same. couple of does.....

Last thing I'd do,is show him pics. Or tell him what's around.

A 150, 160, and 170 all in the same season on same farm is pretty crazy.

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[Four Season Whitetail's]

It would never happen in Ny untill some laws were changed. If you notice alot of the better buck states only allow shotgun hunting. They also do not allow guns during the rut. Add a one buck per season on top of all that then you would be on your way to a great state to hunt in.  Trying to get most Ny hunters to agree with any of those laws would be tough at best!

[Hunting3m]

so what would your guys ideal property be? if you were to manage a farm, in any state, what state would you prefer? When i grow up i wish to live in New York but not with the laws they have now, somethings gotta change.