Browning BAR .308 Accuracy issues

[ApexerER]

Well it is suppose to be fixed. They are shipping it back to me today.....we will see how it goes when I receive it.................

 

[Pygmy]

 

Well it is suppose to be fixed. They are shipping it back to me today.....we will see how it goes when I receive it.................

 

As a "gun nut" I am waiting with bated breath...GOOD LUCK..

[ApexerER]

Well I got my Rifle back on Friday. Went to the range Saturday afternoon with a buddy of mine. Tried two different kinds of Ammo @ 50 yds. Remington 150 Grain Grouped about two inches off the bench with my Cauldwell sled. Fusion 165 Grain tightened up a hair but not much. I am very discouraged that Browning had the rifle all this time and felt these groups were acceptable enough to send the rifle back to me. Although it is better as far as I am concerned it isn't good enough. The real kick in the paints was I took a few shots with my buddies Ruger American 30-06 off the same bench and sled and was able to cloverleaf a single hole. Nothing like having a cheap $300 dollar gun outshoot your thousand dollar gun. Cabela's told me they would exchange the rifle when they got one in but at this point I am wondering with the customer service and Browning letting this Subpar rifle go back out if I want to stick with another Browning. Any recommendations on a different Rifle in the $1000 dollar range? I really want a semi auto. (figure I need to get it now before they come up with some new law that outlaws them as well) Anyone shoot the Benelli?

 

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

If you weren't so decided on the semi aspect I would think the answer for a possible next purchase was actually in your post...lol.

 

Did they even say they shot your gun? what conversations took place? I have shot BAR's in 308 and they preformed much better than that. what do you have for rings and mounts on that?

Edited April 7, 2014 by Culvercreek hunt club

[ApexerER]

If you weren't so decided on the semi aspect I would think the answer for a possible next purchase was actually in your post...lol.

 

Did they even say they shot your gun? what conversations took place? I have shot BAR's in 308 and they preformed much better than that. what do you have for rings and mounts on that?

All of the conversations I had were with Cabela's not Browning. Most of my conversations were that Browning was behind and they had not looked at it yet. When they did finally tell me they looked at it they said the gunsmith checked all the tolerances etc and sent it to the shooting range. They were not happy with the results and it went back to the gunsmith. The next conversation was the gun is done and they are shipping it back. I asked what they did and Cabela's didn't know. I didn't receive any test targets or info from Browning or Cabela's when I received the rifle back. I called Cabela's and inquired about that and they said Browning should have sent test targets but they didn't. That is all I know. As for the rings and bases I don't know what brand they are. They are what the gunshop put on when I purchased the scope and had it mounted by the shop. This whole ordeal has been very disappointing. That BAR is a rifle I have wanted for a long time...now I wish I never made the purchase.

[thphm]

I feel your pain, I had the same problem with a Remy. 742 years ago.Wound up being a machining problem for the threads in the receiver for the bbl.And the holes for the iron sights were drilled and tapped, not inline.Been bolt action ever since,Except for my Ruger ranch rifle that will shoot inside a 25 cent piece at 100 yds..

[gastrodoc]

Did you try retorquing the barrel nut.  Mine went from 3in groups at 100yds to MOA simply by playing with the torque on the forend screw.  If it is torqued too much it will effect the harmonics of the barrel. 

[ApexerER]

Did you try retorquing the barrel nut.  Mine went from 3in groups at 100yds to MOA simply by playing with the torque on the forend screw.  If it is torqued too much it will effect the harmonics of the barrel. 

No I haven't touched anything on it. Is there a spec it should be at?

[Hardcore]

Sorry to hear APex...honestly I think you got a lemon out of the bunch. Browning is much more quality than what you received. To have it come back shooting sub par groups is shocking and disappointing. I think may already have done this, but speak to Browning direct go through the issues and history and they should make something happen.

It doesn't sound like Cabelas did much, I am sure they made attempt to take care of it but they are just the middle man. Good luck again and keep us posted as usual.

[gastrodoc]

I believe the torque is 65in/lbs but would google online.  This made all the difference in the world for my gun.  You certainly have nothing to lose to try different tensions on the screw. 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Sorry to hear APex...honestly I think you got a lemon out of the bunch. Browning is much more quality than what you received. To have it come back shooting sub par groups is shocking and disappointing. I think may already have done this, but speak to Browning direct go through the issues and history and they should make something happen.

It doesn't sound like Cabelas did much, I am sure they made attempt to take care of it but they are just the middle man. Good luck again and keep us posted as usual.

I was wondering is Cabelas took care of all the shipping back and forth as well. I just can't see this from Browning. Wonder what the odds are that Browning never even saw the gun.

[Hardcore]

I was wondering is Cabelas took care of all the shipping back and forth as well. I just can't see this from Browning. Wonder what the odds are that Browning never even saw the gun.

My guess is that Cabelas had a gunsmith take care of it and don't think it went to Browning. I have always had excellent experiences with Cabelas and for returns and exchanges. I never bought a gun from them either but with legality of gun transfers, maybe an in house smith looked @ it.

[Pygmy]

Apex....Sorry to hear that your rifle doesn't group as good as you would like.

I personally have no hands on experience with semi auto hunting rifles. My only semi auto centerfire is a Garand M1.

Perhaps you haven't found it's preferred bullet weight or load yet.. Of course, with today's ammo prices, it could get kind of expensive trying half a dozen different factory loads, with no guarantee that any of them will group as well as you'd like

[ApexerER]

Well Cabela's has a new rifle on order for me. We will see how long this takes this time. At least they are taking care of things for me. (although nowhere near as fast as I would like) To the person that asked, Yes, they took care of shipping too and from.  Hopefully this is resolved by Deer season.

[Short Track Hunter]

My BAR is not that accurate. 3" groups at 100 yards if I'm lucky. I don't know where to start??? I pulled a bore snake through it 10 times. I have a very expensive scope, so that's not it. I tried various ammo....

Is there a quality gun smith in NY that does accuracy issues ?

[ApexerER]

My BAR is not that accurate. 3" groups at 100 yards if I'm lucky. I don't know where to start??? I pulled a bore snake through it 10 times. I have a very expensive scope, so that's not it. I tried various ammo....

Is there a quality gun smith in NY that does accuracy issues ?

I can't answer your question sorry. As for an update....I am still waiting on having my BAR replaced. Cabela's has had one on order for ever. I guess I won't be taking shots this deer season much longer than what I can shoot with my bow.......As I look at my old posts, I can't believe this situation isn't resolved for me yet....

[the blur]

Did you ever get a new BAR ?

[MACHINIST]

Wow just reread this entire post,man I feel terrible for you.What a kick in the azz!!

[ApexerER]

Did you ever get a new BAR ?

No, not yet if you can believe that. My last correspondence with them was they would have one in January. I did kill another deer with it this season but just a doe. About a 40 yd shot. I had a beautiful buck in my crosshairs at about 90 yds and followed it out to 150+ before I lost sight of it. I just couldn't bring myself to pull the trigger with this rifle. The last thing I want to do is wound an animal. I wanted to chuck it in the creek when that buck walked out of site.....I am well passed being fed up.....Hopefully in the next few weeks I will get a new one and put all this behind me.....

[pwally]

Finally!  Someone else experiencing the same problem I have been fighting for a year.  BAR .308 semi auto has serious grouping / pattern issues. I, like apexerER, finally received this beautiful gun with high hopes only to be let down because of its lack of accuracy.  I have not returned it to Browning as you did but sounds like they cannot correct the problem 100% either. 

Starting out, 165 grain fusion.  1st 3,maybe 4 shoot in 2-3 inch pattern; not good.  depending on, 4th or 5th is bad flyer.  I mean off the target bad.  Tried various manufacturers, various grains of ammo only to get the same results...all over the place. I have decided that it likes Fusion just not 100% on the best grain it wants to be fed.  I am now using 165's but will experiment more with 180's.

To take it a few steps further,I removed the forearm to find that the barrel was not free floated, which I corrected / free floated.

Back to the range, some better, that 4th is always going to fly!  Determined, I found the scope rings to be loosening some so I went to a 1 piece DNZ mount.  Still not grouping like I expect;  very inconsistent but we're gaining ground.

Reluctantly, I went another step and sent back a Zeiss Conquest 3x9x50 ( got to love that lifetime from Zeiss) that I was using on the BAR just to eliminate the scope or rings being the problem.  To this day, I still have the gun but have very low confidence in its consistency.  Right now the groupings @ 100, using Fusion 165 grain are less than an inch for the majority, BUT, you never really know when that flyer is going to come into play.  I guess I can call it satisfactory at this time but I do expect better for 1000 dollars and from a manufacture such as Browning.

I continue to mess around with it but it was immediately put on the bench for a Browning A-bolt SS 30.06 which is definitely a tack driver!

Glad I found your post and glad I was able to share and let you know you are not the only one out there fighting the bar 308.

 

Regards

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Finally!  Someone else experiencing the same problem I have been fighting for a year.  BAR .308 semi auto has serious grouping / pattern issues. I, like apexerER, finally received this beautiful gun with high hopes only to be let down because of its lack of accuracy.  I have not returned it to Browning as you did but sounds like they cannot correct the problem 100% either. 

Starting out, 165 grain fusion.  1st 3,maybe 4 shoot in 2-3 inch pattern; not good.  depending on, 4th or 5th is bad flyer.  I mean off the target bad.  Tried various manufacturers, various grains of ammo only to get the same results...all over the place. I have decided that it likes Fusion just not 100% on the best grain it wants to be fed.  I am now using 165's but will experiment more with 180's.

To take it a few steps further,I removed the forearm to find that the barrel was not free floated, which I corrected / free floated.

Back to the range, some better, that 4th is always going to fly!  Determined, I found the scope rings to be loosening some so I went to a 1 piece DNZ mount.  Still not grouping like I expect;  very inconsistent but we're gaining ground.

Reluctantly, I went another step and sent back a Zeiss Conquest 3x9x50 ( got to love that lifetime from Zeiss) that I was using on the BAR just to eliminate the scope or rings being the problem.  To this day, I still have the gun but have very low confidence in its consistency.  Right now the groupings @ 100, using Fusion 165 grain are less than an inch for the majority, BUT, you never really know when that flyer is going to come into play.  I guess I can call it satisfactory at this time but I do expect better for 1000 dollars and from a manufacture such as Browning.

I continue to mess around with it but it was immediately put on the bench for a Browning A-bolt SS 30.06 which is definitely a tack driver!

Glad I found your post and glad I was able to share and let you know you are not the only one out there fighting the bar 308.

 

Regards

Not just a Browning issue. I had a Remington 7400 in '06 that did the same. after two years I gave up and bought a 700 BDL. Now the only semi auto hunting rifles I own are 22

[steve863]

 

Starting out, 165 grain fusion.  1st 3,maybe 4 shoot in 2-3 inch pattern; not good.  depending on, 4th or 5th is bad flyer.  I mean off the target bad.

 

 

 

 

This seems very bizarre to me.  To have one fly completely off the target, while the rest are within a 2-3 inch group seems highly unusual.  What could be launching this flyer into a different direction at random like that?

 

I know most of you guys suffering thru these accuracy problems don't want to hear this, but my solution to accuracy problems with a semi-auto is to get a bolt-action.  These days you don't get very many that don't have at least minute of deer accuracy and in most cases a whole lot more.  Not very many bad ones out there, even the inexpensive ones.  Some of those can be just as accurate as the high-end ones, so what more does one need to know?  If you want a gun that will shoot from the get go, get a bolt-action.

[Pipecrew]

I have killed 2 deer with my BAR Mark II in 30-06, but they were shots of 75 yards or less. (Mine sat in the safe for many, many years because the area I hunt was shot gun only for years.)
The only negative I can find with mine is the weight, it's heavy. I have a 4x12x40 Nikon Monarch on mine and shoot 180 grain Remington Core Loks.

 

I see the BARs are selling for around $1100 now days. I paid $300 brand new for mine from a co worker when I was working as a NYS Corrections Officer. The guy won it in a gun raffle and said his dad had a bunch of guns so he didn't need it. He named the price, I didn't argue! LOL This was about 18 years or so ago, I thought they were selling for around $850-900 back then. I had 2 different guys approach me in less than a week wanting to buy it from me. I told them thanks but no thanks. This was my once in a lifetime chance to own a gun I never could bring myself to spend that kind on $$$ on.

 

I hope you get things worked out with your BAR.

Edited January 30, 2015 by Pipecrew

[jjb4900]

I have one rifle that shoots very well the first 3 shots or so.....after that it starts to "walk" off the paper.........I'm fairly confident this is due to the thin barrel heating up, there is a possibility that any rifle having these accuracy issues is do to the shooter putting too many rounds through without letting it cool down....just a thought.

[Pygmy]

There is a reason that benchrest shooters, precision long range shooters and others that want tiny little groups don't shoot semi autos, pumps or lever guns.

 

For most situations in fairly close cover, a rifle that groups 2" to 4" at 100 yards is MORE than accurate enough, and offers the advantage of quick repeat shots.

 

If you want to do precision shooting at ranges beyond 150-200 yards, get a bolt action.

 

Passing up a decent shot at 40 yards because your 100 yard groups are only 4"...

 

WHY...????..