Age old debate 243 for whites'

[RangerClay]

I bought a .243 BLR for my daughter.  Naturally I had to make sure it was fit for her.  So I've shot 2 does with it at less than 50 yards with Hornady 95 gr. SST bullets.  Neither deer ran more than 20 yards.

[HuntOrBeHunted]

http://youtu.be/Rzvl_Tgg9Uo

 

 

Check that out 400 yard shot on mule deer made by a kid. Thats how its done !!!

[tibio]

My buddy uses one. He swears by it.

[Mr VJP]

That's be a foolish shot.  No deer (or ANY) animal is worth that.

 

Your ethics are questionable.......

 

If I was using a .243, yeah.

[G-Man]

i always like how everyone says wait for a perfect shot, perfect bullet placement... its a rare thing when actually hunting. heck .22lr kills polar bears.. but i prefer a margine for error built in... will a .243 work yes, i've seen it drop many deer, i have also seen deer hit with a marginal shot leave no blood trail and lost with many calibers,but more with a .243 than others..small hole, and if hits bone its bad news. i have also seen it not penetrate to the body cavity on a good size bear just thru fat and hide and hit rib..done. was it the wrong bullet maybe shot was 20 yards.. just with bear more common i think something a little bigger with more penetration would be prudent. As for ethics i wouldnt try a shot on a bear with one or anything but a broadside shot at a big deer. i am not impressed with entry/ exit holes i have seen. and ethical shot at a 1/4 deer is done all the time. like i said earlier most hunters do not shoot anywhere near enough

[eagle rider]

Gman getting through bone has little to do with bullet size. It's more about retained energy and construction. 240 Wby with 100 gr bullet will shatter a 6 yo bucks shoulder and prob still exit provided it's built heavy. So why wouldn't a stoutly constructed 243 do the same? We'd all think a 30/30 will blast through and break bone. Yet it's got less energy than a 243 and are mostly VIP and core constructed bullets.

[bubba]

If I was using a .243, yeah.

 

 

If you were using anything. Another fine example of your anti side showing again. Trying to drag people into that discussion.  No ethical hunter would take that shot regardless of the gun they were carrying.  

[Fantail]

100gr Sierra game king aprox 150 yards.

 

So I guess we'll see the ?.243, ?20ga, ?30-30 clowns about the same time - next year?

 

Edited August 11, 2014 by Fantail

[Mr VJP]

I disagree Bubba.  There is no reason a practiced rifleman, with a rifle he has confidence in, can't make that shot.  It has happened many times in the field, on deer as well as Elk, with success.  Maybe you need more practice with your rifle, or more time in the field shooting at game.

 

As far as the .243 debate goes, it will obviously kill deer.  But the fact that this question keeps coming up, just proves there is a lot of doubt about it's effectiveness, and for good reason.

 

[steve863]

The .223 or .22-250 will kill deer too, should we start recommending them also?  I don't think many knowledgable hunters will recommend them knowing the many variables one is confronted with in the field.  In my opinion the .243 is where deer calibers start, and I prefer NOT to pick the smallest adequate caliber for my deer hunting.  I want something bigger and a little more potent.  You don't need magnums but there are plenty of other calibers out there to choose from that will give you MORE than the .243 will.

 

.243 are also often recommended for the young or novice hunter.  I think it's one of the worst you could give to a beginner.  It's more of a caliber for the experienced shooter.  Giving it to a beginner who might not make a perfect shot is asking a little too much of the shooter and the caliber.  Just because the gun has lighter recoil, doesn't mean that a novice hunter won't get unglued at the moment of truth.   Again, having something more potent at such a moment will give you a little added security in my opinion.

 

 

 

 

 

[eagle rider]

The .223 or .22-250 will kill deer too, should we start recommending them also?  I don't think many knowledgable hunters will recommend them knowing the many variables one is confronted with in the field.  In my opinion the .243 is where deer calibers start, and I prefer NOT to pick the smallest adequate caliber for my deer hunting.  I want something bigger and a little more potent.  You don't need magnums but there are plenty of other calibers out there to choose from that will give you MORE than the .243 will.

 

.243 are also often recommended for the young or novice hunter.  I think it's one of the worst you could give to a beginner.  It's more of a caliber for the experienced shooter.  Giving it to a beginner who might not make a perfect shot is asking a little too much of the shooter and the caliber.  Just because the gun has lighter recoil, doesn't mean that a novice hunter won't get unglued at the moment of truth.   Again, having something more potent at such a moment will give you a little added security in my opinion.

So its better to give a kid or a newbie shooter something bigger to shoot????  I think that this will cause the recoil shy to anticipate a shot, flinch and now all you get is either a miss (not so bad) or a wounded animal to track.  The what ifs' start from there.  Give the same hunter a 243 and they will have one less thing to worry about.  As far as too small, look at Fantails caped out pics above.  

[Elmo]

The 243 is a book that is often judge by it's cover because the obvious stat everyone sees right away is the number 243.  But if you look at it's ballistic energy, the 243 packs a lot down range energy than the 30-30 which so many people claim to have taken more deer than any other caliber in existence and has no problems recommending it to new hunters. Sure. the 30-30 will cause a bigger wound channel but the 243 will rip the insides up a lot better.

 

So the real question is what do you think is more effective at taking down animals?  A large wound channel or hydrostatic shock?

[eagle rider]

DRT, is all about HS Shock and disruption of organs.  Running and bleeding is the wound channel.  I'll take HS Shock any day.  

[steve863]

Eagle Rider, if you have all the answers about the .243, then why did you even start this thread and ask for peoples opinions about it??  I guess your only motive was to stir things up.  

 

I will stick to my guns, and give the novice hunter a 7mm-08, .308, or .270 as their first deer hunting rifle.  With the very effective recoil pads made these days, the recoil on any of these calibers could be handled by most anyone.  If one is too wimpy to handle them, then they probably shouldn't be hunting to begin with.  It's like the hunters who say they throw up when they have to gut a deer.  Well, if they can't stomach things like that, maybe hunting isn't for them?? Lots of other hobbies out there that one can pursue instead.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[stubby68]

heck lets just go with .338 lapua or.465 H & H or maybe a .50 bmg. Outta be able to make good hamburg out of a deer with those. I have a .243 and a .308 .243 kills just as well as .308. If you aim you do not need a big gun to kill a deer. Those are for the ones who do not aim and want to make sure tht no matter where the round hits they will have a dead deer.

[eagle rider]

Eagle Rider, if you have all the answers about the .243, then why did you even start this thread and ask for peoples opinions about it??  I guess your only motive was to stir things up.  

 

I will stick to my guns, and give the novice hunter a 7mm-08, .308, or .270 as their first deer hunting rifle.  With the very effective recoil pads made these days, the recoil on any of these calibers could be handled by most anyone.  If one is too wimpy to handle them, then they probably shouldn't be hunting to begin with.  It's like the hunters who say they throw up when they have to gut a deer.  Well, if they can't stomach things like that, maybe hunting isn't for them?? Lots of other hobbies out there that one can pursue instead.  

Not a question of stirring things up and I do respect others opinions, IMO some of the responses on the thread just don't make sense, logically speaking.  Its a discussion forum, and that's what we do, discuss things.  For instance I think a 100 pound kid, 16 years old and boney, might flinch on a 308's or a 270 recoil, where as with the 243, 6mm, or 25-06 others wrote about there is pretty much just a make bang sound and don't have any real recoil energy at all.  In my estimation there would be less of a chance of wounding an animal that might need a finisher or even worse have a long tracking job that can require a finisher near a house or a church or a school.  

[thphm]

The kid in the video mad a good shot, look where he is hunting,wide open long distance, I bet that is the typical style of shooting there and that is what they are adjusted too.

I my neck of the Woods there are very few places to even get a 200 yard. shot Safely.

The woods are just too thick.That is why I said I will only shoo my .243 with 85 grain bullets inside of 75 yards.Heck back on Long Island they poached deer every week with 22's, just for the racks that they were selling. And they did the job.To answer the Question they will kill a deer with good shot placement at that distance.And as with anything else practice makes perfect. Its not a shot for the once a year week end or 1 week deer hunter who only picks up there rifle the weekend before hunting season an goes to sight it in..

 

[Mr VJP]

Quote:  "heck lets just go with .338 lapua or.465 H & H or maybe a .50 bmg. Outta be able to make good hamburg out of a deer with those. I have a .243 and a .308 .243 kills just as well as .308. If you aim you do not need a big gun to kill a deer. Those are for the ones who do not aim and want to make sure tht no matter where the round hits they will have a dead deer."

 

And the .243 is for boys who can't handle a man's rifle.  LOL!  

 

 

Edited August 11, 2014 by Mr VJP

[Elmo]

Never realized hunting and/or the sport of shooting was a pissing contest or an arm wrestling match.

[ants]

How about this…..Every one use what ever works best for them. From .222 up to the biggest magnum loads, there are guys who will say "that round sucks for deer." Thats based on their own experience and opinion. Not yours.

[Lawdwaz]

i always like how everyone says wait for a perfect shot, perfect bullet placement... its a rare thing when actually hunting. heck .22lr kills polar bears.. but i prefer a margine for error built in... will a .243 work yes, i've seen it drop many deer, i have also seen deer hit with a marginal shot leave no blood trail and lost with many calibers,but more with a .243 than others..small hole, and if hits bone its bad news. i have also seen it not penetrate to the body cavity on a good size bear just thru fat and hide and hit rib..done. was it the wrong bullet maybe shot was 20 yards.. just with bear more common i think something a little bigger with more penetration would be prudent. As for ethics i wouldnt try a shot on a bear with one or anything but a broadside shot at a big deer. i am not impressed with entry/ exit holes i have seen. and ethical shot at a 1/4 deer is done all the time. like i said earlier most hunters do not shoot anywhere near enough

 

How much lead did your bear absorb out of your 45-70 before croaking and what was the distance involved?

[ants]

i always like how everyone says wait for a perfect shot, perfect bullet placement... its a rare thing when actually hunting. heck .22lr kills polar bears.. but i prefer a margine for error built in... will a .243 work yes, i've seen it drop many deer, i have also seen deer hit with a marginal shot leave no blood trail and lost with many calibers,but more with a .243 than others..small hole, and if hits bone its bad news. i have also seen it not penetrate to the body cavity on a good size bear just thru fat and hide and hit rib..done. was it the wrong bullet maybe shot was 20 yards.. just with bear more common i think something a little bigger with more penetration would be prudent. As for ethics i wouldnt try a shot on a bear with one or anything but a broadside shot at a big deer. i am not impressed with entry/ exit holes i have seen. and ethical shot at a 1/4 deer is done all the time. like i said earlier most hunters do not shoot anywhere near enough

"Perfect" bullet placement might be a rare thing, while hunting, but GOOD bullet placement is whats needed. If you don't have that then don't take the shot.

[Mr VJP]

I wonder why most professional Guides recommend a minimum caliber and cartridge for their big game hunts.  Maybe they know more than the typical nimrod they work for.

 

[G-Man]

I don't know where or in type if terrain you hunt but a good bullet placement can turn bad with a goldenrod stem.. all I am saying is for 200 yards and under there are better calibers available than a .243 For those that have used them for years and swear by them i can show you guys that swear by a .223 Or even 22lr the caliber doesnt matter as much as experience.. most guys do not shoot target or practice much before opening day, let alone practice at game. I larger caliber for a new/novice hunter is more ethical in my opinion. As experaince and confidence allows you to take shots some would deem unethical to them.. what's an ethical shot 20yards open field? Ethics are a personal choice. But you can't kill them if you don't pull the trigger..... tracking skills a a vital part of any hunting.. a larger wound from a bigger caliber on a good shot gone bad is much more ethical than a pin hole from a good shot that was off just a little... that said if you want to hunt with one fine but be proficient with whatever cal you choose.. and if your really that great of a shot give up the Shotgun and bird shot and use a .243 For birds......!

[Lawdwaz]

I wonder why most professional Guides recommend a minimum caliber and cartridge for their big game hunts.  Maybe they know more than the typical nimrod they work for.

 

Keep in mind we are talking the mighty whitetail deer here, not a grizzly or big bull elk.

 

BUT............ 

 

I think MOST guides would much rather you brought a gun chambered in a cartridge you are COMFORTABLE shooting as apposed to a magnum.  In fact, I guarantee it.