Holiday season

[Four Seasons]

44 minutes ago, First-light said:

I tried my hand in food plots this year. Now I have areas I mow that are in the woods and the deer love it. Nothing invested just mowing. This year we  planted. I enjoyed doing for a number of reasons. First to see how good it would turn out, always wanted to be a farmer. Draw in the Does and hopefully a buck will follow. Give them some food for the winter. It's not much but will help a few. Honestly my plots are small and really a waste of time and money but I enjoyed it. Mowing the area keeping the grasses green and does the same. It never once crossed my mind, especially in my area which is heavy in Ag, that I would keep them on my land. These deer cruise everywhere and there is so much food around it wouldn't make a difference. As for trail cameras I love the picts they take but they have never helped me shoot a deer. Trying to remember back when it was spoken word of a big buck in the area, those days are gone. Everything changes. The young guys at my camp are into the plots and high end cameras. That will keep on evolving and drones will soon be the norm. Yes a lot has changed. 

Exactly!  Unless someone is only hunting deep in the Adirondacks they are hunting animals that lives revolve around the fruits of man’s labor. To scratch out a 50ft area in the center of the woods and toss out a little Throw and Grow being watched by a camera is far from management. Very few have the land, equipment or means to really do any kind of real management. But again just giving your deer a sanctuary on your property is a small form of management. 

[landtracdeerhunter]

Well now, I throw this one out.

The whitetail deer are managing themselves quite well here, all on their own. The state throws in a monkey wrench, and a little WD 40 now and again. May or May not stop the squeak.  It does create more governmental employment, which blue states love to do.

One has to remember, a change in one aspect, ultimately affects another.  Step on enough grasshoppers, the turkey wont gobble anymore.

. 

[Doc]

This thread kind of makes one wonder how it is that any deer ever survived before trail cams, food plots, and supplemental winter feeding and careful counting and record keeping and micro management. Deer hunting is now mandated to be an agricultural project. It is not hunting anymore, it is animal husbandry. It is amazing how even back when we had a lot of very eager and active hunters, almost behind every tree, the deer herd still survived without all the assistance from our "expert" private game managers. Thank heavens we have all these "expert" people today that try to shame all hunters into all these deer management schemes. How would the herd ever survive without these people who try to tell others what deer they should shoot and which not to shoot? Of course all of this "expert" arguing and cajoling is probably a big part of the reason that hunting is slowly fading from existence as the common activity it used to be. We need all these self-proclaimed experts.......Don't we?

[virgil]

5 minutes ago, Doc said:

This thread kind of makes one wonder how it is that any deer ever survived before trail cams, food plots, and supplemental winter feeding and careful counting and record keeping and micro management. Deer hunting is now mandated to be an agricultural project. It is not hunting anymore, it is animal husbandry. It is amazing how even back when we had a lot of very eager and active hunters, almost behind every tree, the deer herd still survived without all the assistance from our "expert" private game managers. Thank heavens we have all these "expert" people today that try to shame all hunters into all these deer management schemes. How would the herd ever survive without these people who try to tell others what deer they should shoot and which not to shoot? Of course all of this "expert" arguing and cajoling is probably a big part of the reason that hunting is slowly fading from existence as the common activity it used to be. We need all these self-proclaimed experts.......Don't we?

Also probably a prime reason why so many members left this site- the same guy constantly picking fights, throwing insults, calling names, anointing himself the superior hunter, and declaring everyone jealous of his prowess.  It gets a bit tedious after a while.

[First-light]

My brother has a great attitude towards hunting. He has his name on the biggest deer taken on my property but he never lets that get in the way of a good hunt and kill.  Doe , small buck or yearling. To him it's the hunt. Opening day he has his 14 year old Grandson with him. They have this half rack 6 pt come walking down 15 yards from the stand. My brother says for him to shoot, the kids says no I want a 10 pt. My brother looks at him and says this aint TV, that is your first deer now take it. We both had to remind the kid back at the buck pole what hunting is all about. He got it but it's unfortunate what was in his mind. 

[Four Seasons]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

This thread kind of makes one wonder how it is that any deer ever survived before trail cams, food plots, and supplemental winter feeding and careful counting and record keeping and micro management. Deer hunting is now mandated to be an agricultural project. It is not hunting anymore, it is animal husbandry. It is amazing how even back when we had a lot of very eager and active hunters, almost behind every tree, the deer herd still survived without all the assistance from our "expert" private game managers. Thank heavens we have all these "expert" people today that try to shame all hunters into all these deer management schemes. How would the herd ever survive without these people who try to tell others what deer they should shoot and which not to shoot? Of course all of this "expert" arguing and cajoling is probably a big part of the reason that hunting is slowly fading from existence as the common activity it used to be. We need all these self-proclaimed experts.......Don't we?

lol. The 60’s and 70’s are long gone. Never to return. You see people still have choices. Nobody is telling anyone to manage their properties, nobody is telling them what to shoot. You see some hunters want the best the species they are hunting and others want the best of the species but are not in the position to reach that goal. Be it no or to small of property, equipment or even money to fulfill their desire. One Quick Look at any hunting site on Facebook or any other social media site will show you page after page of great top end bucks takin in this state and across the country and I would guess most of them are on farmlands feeding the deer too end feed yearly.  Hunters harvesting top end deer has absolutely nothing to do with the lack of new hunters because of a woke generation but it most definitely helps those that do decide to take up the sport. Like it or not, less hunters means more game for those out there. And some of those out there do have the means and do have the numbers of animals to do great things with their herds. And that my friend is fulfilling every Hunter dream that wakes up every morning and that is to kill a great mature animal. And 99.9% of the time those animals carry the biggest set of bone on their heads. 

[Four Seasons]

1 hour ago, First-light said:

My brother has a great attitude towards hunting. He has his name on the biggest deer taken on my property but he never lets that get in the way of a good hunt and kill.  Doe , small buck or yearling. To him it's the hunt. Opening day he has his 14 year old Grandson with him. They have this half rack 6 pt come walking down 15 yards from the stand. My brother says for him to shoot, the kids says no I want a 10 pt. My brother looks at him and says this aint TV, that is your first deer now take it. We both had to remind the kid back at the buck pole what hunting is all about. He got it but it's unfortunate what was in his mind. 

That’s all fine and well. But I sure hope you, your brother or anyone else in that camp did not show this new Hunter what this property had to offer in size of animals. Showing trail cam pictures and such.  And every other camp member talking about passing this buck or that buck waiting for a bigger one. His tag, his choice. But he sure would have know that if he passes this buck he very well may have to eat that tag. If he was ok with that then I would have told him to take some pictures and enjoy the show the young buck puts on. 

[luberhill]

2 hours ago, virgil said:

Also probably a prime reason why so many members left this site- the same guy constantly picking fights, throwing insults, calling names, anointing himself the superior hunter, and declaring everyone jealous of his prowess.  It gets a bit tedious after a while.

Agree 100 percent !

[First-light]

1 hour ago, Four Seasons said:

That’s all fine and well. But I sure hope you, your brother or anyone else in that camp did not show this new Hunter what this property had to offer in size of animals. Showing trail cam pictures and such.  And every other camp member talking about passing this buck or that buck waiting for a bigger one. His tag, his choice. But he sure would have know that if he passes this buck he very well may have to eat that tag. If he was ok with that then I would have told him to take some pictures and enjoy the show the young buck puts on. 

Yes we are guilty of sharing some of the trail cam picts with him. I get that but he has to learn about eating a tag. I'm glad he took the deer now next year let him decide how he wants to hunt. 

[wolc123]

My buddy just dropped off the liver from the button buck that he killed on New Years evening, one hour before sunset.  Wild game don’t get any better than that.   It definitely makes this past Holiday season a success in my book, even if I wasn’t able to harvest one myself, during that week.  
 

2024 was the first year, in the last (5), that I wasn’t able to kill a button buck myself.  Not sure if that was a step forward or backward for me.  I’ll decide after liver and onion lunch on Saturday.  

[luberhill]

28 minutes ago, wolc123 said:

My buddy just dropped off the liver from the button buck that he killed on New Years evening, one hour before sunset.  Wild game don’t get any better than that.   It definitely makes this past Holiday season a success in my book, even if I wasn’t able to harvest one myself, during that week.  
 

2024 was the first year, in the last (5), that I wasn’t able to kill a button buck myself.  Not sure if that was a step forward or backward for me.  I’ll decide after liver and onion lunch on Saturday.  

I usually give the liver to my dog as my wife nor I like liver .

  But she pickled 3 deer hearts 

[Four Seasons]

Can just imagine how something like this will blow the minds of those that have a problem with the new world of Whitetails. Talk about management!

[Doc]

6 hours ago, Four Seasons said:

Can just imagine how something like this will blow the minds of those that have a problem with the new world of Whitetails. Talk about management!

Ha-ha-ha.......Yes, a deer at any cost. This is the kind of mentality that seems to dominate today's hunting. No limits. Anything goes. Fair chase be damned. I blame the TV "hero" programs for this attitude of "All is fair in deer hunting". We do find ourselves letting technology do more of the hunting for us, don't we? And then we can brag about what mighty hunters we have become. It's been an interesting evolution, this thing called hunting. I see no end to it. It is starting to remind me of that deal where somebody had a rifle and camera combo set up so you could do your hunting of live animals on your computer. Yeah, we got rid of that notion, but probably only temporarily.

[Four Seasons]

56 minutes ago, Doc said:

Ha-ha-ha.......Yes, a deer at any cost. This is the kind of mentality that seems to dominate today's hunting. No limits. Anything goes. Fair chase be damned. I blame the TV "hero" programs for this attitude of "All is fair in deer hunting". We do find ourselves letting technology do more of the hunting for us, don't we? And then we can brag about what mighty hunters we have become. It's been an interesting evolution, this thing called hunting. I see no end to it. It is starting to remind me of that deal where somebody had a rifle and camera combo set up so you could do your hunting of live animals on your computer. Yeah, we got rid of that notion, but probably only temporarily.

You’re spot on. And ya know the real funny part that gets me?  It’s the guys that say that they are just meat hunters. Not all but most of these same guys do some kind of food plots or work on the lands they hunt, they spend near $1000 on a Gun, Bow and Muzzleloader. They wear $5-600 or more camo outfits on their backs. Run a good number of $150 trail cameras,with $5000 gators or wheelers to haul that meat out of the $10’s of $1000’s of dollars they spent on land or yearly leases. Bullsh!t!  This game all starts with the biggest bone in the woods and goes down from there. Most just settle for less before it’s over. Does not take more then an old weapon, wool jacket and a pair of boots to fill tags. On hunting land that does not cost them a nickel at that. 

Edited Thursday at 11:31 AM by Four Seasons

[First-light]

Cheapest venison I ever paid for was on a camping/hunting trip on State land in the Catskills. Eat, sleep and hunt. Drag your deer out if you are lucky! Can't put a price on those memories. 

[landtracdeerhunter]

19 hours ago, virgil said:

Also probably a prime reason why so many members left this site- the same guy constantly picking fights, throwing insults, calling names, anointing himself the superior hunter, and declaring everyone jealous of his prowess.  It gets a bit tedious after a while.

I don't believe those members that don't log in any longer have truly left this site. 

[nyantler]

On 1/7/2025 at 6:40 PM, Four Seasons said:

 I don’t need to look anywhere. Have only been doing it for over 25 years as a business and pleasure. With 100% success rate on both. You were the one all talk and now your showing everyone in this site just what we all have known. Tell us all about how much land you own and manage. Tell us all about what you do on a yearly basis, crops planted, fruit and nut trees planted and by all means show us your hero success shots of the animals you have harvested as a return on all your hard work.  This is a learning hunting site after all. We all will appreciate listening and learning from all your knowledge!

You still arent getting that what you are doing isn't deer management... its buck management and they're two different things. You have to go back a long way to research my roll in introducing Quality Deer Management here in NY. You were probably just a kid. Like I said... you aren't looking in the right places. You shouldn't look at this as a contest between you and I, but rather a learning experience for you. I regret every day that I spent introducing QDM to NY... worse thing that's ever happened to deer hunting. Best thing that has ever happened to those that have capitalized on the sale of hunting products. 

[Four Seasons]

58 minutes ago, nyantler said:

You still arent getting that what you are doing isn't deer management... its buck management and they're two different things. You have to go back a long way to research my roll in introducing Quality Deer Management here in NY. You were probably just a kid. Like I said... you aren't looking in the right places. You shouldn't look at this as a contest between you and I, but rather a learning experience for you. I regret every day that I spent introducing QDM to NY... worse thing that's ever happened to deer hunting. Best thing that has ever happened to those that have capitalized on the sale of hunting products. 

Do you honestly think you can have big mature bucks on a pice of property and keep them there without having an all around great management plan?   You don’t think our farm and forest  management, planting year around crops both for harvest and yearly wildlife food is not total management? You don’t think having sanctuaries off limits to humans is not part of total deer management? You don’t think keeping and taking the right amount of animals off a piece of property is not part of total management?  I guess a person can call it what you want but I can promise you that you won’t have bucks like this as the norm walking around on a piece of property on a yearly basis without having a total management plan. In both food, safety and numbers of animals. An all around healthy herd of Whitetails both buck and doe will not be on unmanaged property.  You might have a few deer here and there but they mostly will never see maturity. 

Edited Friday at 01:59 PM by Four Seasons

[nyantler]

On 1/10/2025 at 8:51 AM, Four Seasons said:

Do you honestly think you can have big mature bucks on a pice of property and keep them there without having an all around great management plan?   You don’t think our farm and forest  management, planting year around crops both for harvest and yearly wildlife food is not total management? You don’t think having sanctuaries off limits to humans is not part of total deer management? You don’t think keeping and taking the right amount of animals off a piece of property is not part of total management?  I guess a person can call it what you want but I can promise you that you won’t have bucks like this as the norm walking around on a piece of property on a yearly basis without having a total management plan. In both food, safety and numbers of animals. An all around healthy herd of Whitetails both buck and doe will not be on unmanaged property.  You might have a few deer here and there but they mostly will never see maturity. 

Yes.. It's a perfect example of trophy buck management... good job! 

[Four Seasons]

3 hours ago, nyantler said:

Yes.. It's a perfect example of trophy buck management... good job! 

We all knew that was coming. Now show us your management plan. I’m 61 and I will guess that most on here are close to the same. Show us all the differences.  Another simple google search shows Deer Management, QDM. TDM is not even in this discussion  Every aspect of my hunting practices fall under. Deer Management. Again! 

Edited yesterday at 05:28 PM by Four Seasons

[wolc123]

I see there nothing in there about not shooting button bucks (something by the way that I did not do thru all of 2024).  I’m just a little disappointed, that I didn’t get to enjoy any of that “milk fed” liver lately, especially after my buddy told me that he got one for me on New Year’s Day with his ML.
 

 That turned out to be a 1.5 yr old 1.5” “dmp mini-spike”.  The liver was still pretty good though and twice as big as the usual bb liver.  Just not quite as tender.  I did age it in the fridge for (9) days prior to frying though, and that helped with the tenderness. 

I had the first serving for dinner last night, and I will probably have the rest for lunch tomorrow. Certainly it put a very fine capstone on that last Holiday ML season for me, even if I wasn’t able to harvest a deer myself during it.  

My buddy also now has plenty of grind to make the sausage that he had been craving, something that wouldn’t have happened, without that awesome new season. 

 

[nyantler]

19 hours ago, Four Seasons said:

We all knew that was coming. Now show us your management plan. I’m 61 and I will guess that most on here are close to the same. Show us all the differences.  Another simple google search shows Deer Management, QDM. TDM is not even in this discussion  Every aspect of my hunting practices fall under. Deer Management. Again! 

You are really good at cut and paste... good for you.

[nyantler]

On 1/8/2025 at 10:53 PM, Four Seasons said:

Can just imagine how something like this will blow the minds of those that have a problem with the new world of Whitetails. Talk about management!

None of this is about TDM you say, yet you quote from a trophy buck farmer on deer management. I think we're done here.

[Four Seasons]

10 minutes ago, nyantler said:

You are really good at cut and paste... good for you.

So here you are ducking and running once again. You run your mouth about other people’s actions and yet have been asked 5 times to put up all your great work and ideas. Typical!   I sure wish you would put something up here for these guys on here. I mean I sure would hate to think that they can have great habitat, a balanced healthy herd with multiple 120-130 inch bucks walking around on their properties yearly and harvest a couple mature 120in plus every year like I do with my practices.                       I mean this is a hunting site and you offer nothing but pic ‘s of other people Harvest’s so help these guys out. 

[Four Seasons]

17 minutes ago, nyantler said:

None of this is about TDM you say, yet you quote from a trophy buck farmer on deer management. I think we're done here.

  Your done here because your full of Sh!t and have been proven just that. I threw up just qdm,TDM and the so call deer management to show the subtle differences I throw up 100% proven facts and you throw up absolutely nothing. You say you did all this and all that and show absolutely nothing. Except pictures of bucks I harvest on my properties that have nothing but 100% total herd management that makes great healthy animals of both sexes and great mature bucks for great deer hunting right along for the Benefits of all wildlife and the land itself.                                                               

Edited 11 hours ago by Four Seasons