The Psychology Behind the Quest For Trophy Racks

[TreeGuy]

There it is...... repeated several times:
1. it takes more skill
2. it takes more knowledge
3. it takes more patience
4. its more challenging
5. All young deer are easy. Whats a young deer? Apparently 3 1/2 and younger

I have never poked at the guys shooting button bucks or have ever tried to say that my way is the right way.

Me personally, I'd love to see an antler restriction put in place. It may be a tough couple years for some but I have a suspicion that after a few years we would all be seeing more big racked mature bucks.

Not picking on you tree guy it's just that your quotes are a prime example of what has been a repeat theme in this thread.  As I said before....  types of put downs without realizing it... The thought that all 31/2 year olds were easy hunts for the ones that got them,  thus lesser deer then a 41/2 ..lol Assumptions that the "trophy" guys put more of everything into getting their deer. It's there in black and white several places in here...



So, we can agree I never said young deer, or any deer was easy to kill, so scratch #5 off your list and then take a moment to read your list back to yourself..... Other than luck, do you really think #1-4 aren't true ? Do you think it's an insult to anyone for me to say those things ?? To all those folks out there that took offense to me mentioning the fact that trying to take mature deer may be #1-4 and found that offensive or a stab to make myself look better or whatever grow thinks I'm trying to say, I dont apologize. We all know this thread was started to get everybody stirred up, and in true fashion we all play along. Thanks for picking on me grow... Best troll I've had in awhile

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[Four Season Whitetail's]

46 minutes ago, TreeGuy said:

Not picking on you tree guy it's just that your quotes are a prime example of what has been a repeat theme in this thread.  As I said before....  types of put downs without realizing it... The thought that all 31/2 year olds were easy hunts for the ones that got them,  thus lesser deer then a 41/2 ..lol Assumptions that the "trophy" guys put more of everything into getting their deer. It's there in black and white several places in here...



So, we can agree I never said young deer, or any deer was easy to kill, so scratch #5 off your list and then take a moment to read your list back to yourself..... Other than luck, do you really think #1-4 aren't true ? Do you think it's an insult to anyone for me to say those things ?? To all those folks out there that took offense to me mentioning the fact that trying to take mature deer may be #1-4 and found that offensive or a stab to make myself look better or whatever grow thinks I'm trying to say, I dont apologize. We all know this thread was started to get everybody stirred up, and in true fashion we all play along. Thanks for picking on me grow... Best troll I've had in awhile

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There is no doubt that list is 100% spot on. For those of us that find,scout,hunt and kill mature bucks no this. Yes we all get lucky at times but to pick a target mature buck and then go kill that buck?  Yeah i guess so.

[growalot]

So you still took it as some sort of attack and got nasty....It wasn't,I won't appologize for my opinion ,that wasn't trolling . Your responce didnt surprise me.

[Doc]

11 hours ago, Culvercreek hunt club said:

I've read the responses here Doc and I think I have a bit of a different take. I don't think it is as much the  psychology behind it as the millions of years of genetic encoding. I think as a species we have a desire and even a need to have our efforts acknowledged and admired. A hunter in those long ago times was granted stature based on how well they hunted. Females selected their mates on the basis of how well they provided. So I think the tendency is there in our very make up. Like anything else there are varying degrees of intensity. Why do we keep score in sporting events? To acknowledge the better players by saying they won. As a measure of a hunter I would think that a person that consistently takes the more mature animals would be viewed as the better hunter. Age and antler size are generally proportional. and the older and more experienced animals (prey) would have the greatest life experience and most survival knowledge.Therefore they would be the most difficult quarry to take.  . 

In general, I would say that I agree about age vs. challenge. However, I am reminded of all those hunts where it was a little snot of a fawn that blew the whistle on me while the more adult deer simply concentrated on filling their face. And then there are the mature bucks that make absolute asses of themselves during that special time of the year when they are staggering through the woods in search of some "action". If you want to hunt the epitome of wariness and intelligence, go after that old seasoned doe who has spent her entire life not only looking out for herself, but also her annual offspring. And almost always, she doesn't have a single antler point on her head. Sometimes the challenge is simply the quantity of eyes and ears that you are facing rather than any particular gender or antler features.

There is only one bona fide super challenge posed by that heavy-horned buck, and that is simply that they are more rare in numbers. That is what truly makes a older buck a trophy. There simply are not as many of them in the woods. and every body and their brother are trying to change that element of challenge. And so for many, "hunting prowess" is based not so much on the smartest, but more on the randomness of numbers. And, it has been shown time and again that such randomness is more a result of being in the right place at the right time, or another way of putting it ....... luck.

But this whole idea of earning peer respect via increased challenge is brought into question by the constant movement of hunting away from challenge. Just looking at the most popular changes in hunting indicates that most people work very hard at eliminating challenge. We grow special plots to attract deer. With very, very few exceptions, we seek out weapons that give us special advantages. We would bait if it were legal. We have taken primitive rifles and re-designed them such that they are no more of a challenge than any modern day rifle. We hunt places that are known to have more deer. And on and on. There is no special quest for "challenge". Quite the opposite....we are constantly moving hunting toward removing challenge.

So it all still leaves me wondering why antler size is our yardstick of success. To me the guys who bowhunt the deep woods of the Adirondacks with simple primitive equipment are the guys that really take on challenge in a very serious way, and there aren't really very many actually doing that.

[TreeGuy]

So you still took it as some sort of attack and got nasty....It wasn't,I won't appologize for my opinion ,that wasn't trolling . Your responce didnt surprise me.

Ditto

I find it funny how you bring up that I'm bashing someone without knowing it... Then you say " not to pick on you" yet you used my name. Seems your THAT kind of guy.

And if that's your definition of nasty I'd hate to see when your faced with conflict in real life situations.

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[growalot]

I used your name because I used your quotes, I never said anyone was bashing ,never used that word. I said insulting. I also said that the list was repeated through out the thread ,not just your post. You took what I said the way you took it done and over. BTW I'll never be that kind of GUY...lol

[Four Season Whitetail's]

2 hours ago, growalot said:

I used your name because I used your quotes, I never said anyone was bashing ,never used that word. I said insulting. I also said that the list was repeated through out the thread ,not just your post. You took what I said the way you took it done and over. BTW I'll never be that kind of GUY...lol

So you two dont know each other so well?   TreeGuy...Meet....GrowalotGirl.

[TreeGuy]

So you two dont know each other so well?   TreeGuy...Meet....GrowalotGirl.

I am aware of grows gender. I just have this habit of insulting without knowingly doing so.

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[NFA-ADK]

So its not a challenge unless you go with primitive gear in the ADK.  WT?  Then it would be you cheated because you used a call, or used cover scent, or had a new broad head and not a sharpened rock tip.  Or you did not track it down in snow so you just got lucky.  Or you just happened to be in the right place and got lucky.  The excuses on what is and is not acceptable is funny to me.  Not a challenge if you go up a tree, not a challenge if you use calls, not a challenge if you hunt a food plot, etc.  Sounds like some will always have an excuse why someone's deer is not valid because it was not a challenge.

The Benoits talk about always tracking and even stated at times this is the best way to hunt and for them the only way.  Fast forward a bunch of years where age caught up to them and snow was minimal and now they talk about hunting smarter NOT harder.  Now they use calls, rattle and SIT!  Personally for me I love the challenge of hunting but since the start I always wanted to learn how to do it smarter, does that mean I do not want a challenge?  No I just want to hunt different than the others who always used tracking as the main way to hunt.  To me reading sign and working off that sign is what gets me going, calling has been my other prime way of getting deer closer.  Cheating?  Some say yes just like tree stands, food plots, high population area etc. 

Simply put it is real easy to say that deer is not legit simply because (Insert excuse here).  I have heard the same thing from getting 3 ADK bucks, like I am cheating.  (He must bait or he is using calls that's cheating.)  Or the best one yet:  Even a blind squire finds a nut sometimes.  Next will be "Why did you shoot him from a tree?"  You used cover scent?  You used deer P?  You called them in and used a decoy?  ON A FARM!!!  Take him out back and shoot that cheater!

ok I think I am done with my babble for the day.

[Five Seasons]

On 6/25/2017 at 3:53 AM, Doc said:

I am curious as to what you all think is the motive behind "trophy-ism" in deer hunting. Does it have to do with the notion that the deer with the biggest racks represent the hardest challenge in deer hunting? 

i think for me it is this. And it's sort interesting that mother nature has always provided bigger racks, beards, weight with age to help demonstrate this.

The counter to this is that a nany doe can be 10x harder to kill than a ruted up buck thinking with his other head. And here is where i'll be honest and note that there is a part of me that loves taking the picture, loves sharing that picture with this board, family, friends and facebook. Some may call this bragging, but i dont see it as any different than most other pictures we choose to share on social media. I would bet 95% of us have worked our butts off to get that nice buck, and are damn proud of it and want to share for those reasons, and not for trying to one-up someone else. Note, none of this applies to the outfitter/fence hunt.

So yeah, the challenge is the main driver for me  to hunt horns, but I'd be a liar if I didn't enjoy the horns on the wall which always leads to a good conversations starter in the barn/garage/den when drinking beers.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

People talk smack about high fence deer, Yes there have been some pretty freaky deer bred in the deer world but for the most part if you look at most of the awesome bucks harvested in Kansas, Ohio and such they are bucks pushing 200 inches, Same as MOST deer are behind fence.Hunters have seen what can be taken if they have what it takes and commit on taking only one type of animal. The problem we have in Ny is that we are in the crappiest place to live and hunt what a real whitetail can look like. The hunters that chose to hunt only mature deer are truly hunting, Find,track and kill a single animal...Like hunting for Bin Laden. Mono de Mono.  Most places in todays hunting is pretty much shooting deer, we have a great number of animals and one does not have to "Hunt" to hard to kill any deer.

[airedale]

37 minutes ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

The hunters that chose to hunt only mature deer are truly hunting, Find,track and kill a single animal.

Geeze that means after all these years I have been mostly "pretend Deer hunting"! Bummer

Al

Edited June 30, 2017 by airedale

[Doc]

6 hours ago, NFA-ADK said:

So its not a challenge unless you go with primitive gear in the ADK.  WT? 

I don't think that I ever said that. Almost all hunts have some element of challenge in them even if it only amounts to marksmanship or simple patience and persistence and willingness to suffer the cold. What I DID say was that those that talk about challenge as being their primary reason for hunting, "walk the walk". But the realities are that almost all participants in hunting today are doing their absolute best to eliminate as much challenge as possible. That is a statement that darn few people can argue these days. The examples are everywhere throughout hunting today. I point to the establishment of bow season way back in the early days of bowhunting. Everyone who participated did so to handicap themselves severely with a weapon that was a real problem to succeed with and the deer take numbers reflected that. That was the whole reason for the creation of that season. Those people were obsessed with challenge. That really was their primary reason for hunting. That attitude is really very different today.

No, no one is saying that hunting does not have some challenge built into it, but nothing today makes that challenge look like a primary motive for hunting. Everything that I see today is an attempt at removing challenge. I'm not trying to say that that is good or bad. Just saying that motives for hunting seem to be something other than looking for ways to put the odds in the deer's favor.

[growalot]

Quote

I am aware of grows gender. I just have this habit of insulting without knowingly doing so.

OK perhaps this will put this to bed...read the last three post...If my point isn't seen, then It flew to high over your head. My opinion was not directed JUST at you. it was a statement of how things can be read when worded a certain way   "words perceived"

[wolc123]

31 minutes ago, Doc said:

I don't think that I ever said that. Almost all hunts have some element of challenge in them even if it only amounts to marksmanship or simple patience and persistence and willingness to suffer the cold. What I DID say was that those that talk about challenge as being their primary reason for hunting, "walk the walk". But the realities are that almost all participants in hunting today are doing their absolute best to eliminate as much challenge as possible. That is a statement that darn few people can argue these days. The examples are everywhere throughout hunting today. I point to the establishment of bow season way back in the early days of bowhunting. Everyone who participated did so to handicap themselves severely with a weapon that was a real problem to succeed with and the deer take numbers reflected that. That was the whole reason for the creation of that season. Those people were obsessed with challenge. That really was their primary reason for hunting. That attitude is really very different today.

No, no one is saying that hunting does not have some challenge built into it, but nothing today makes that challenge look like a primary motive for hunting. Everything that I see today is an attempt at removing challenge. I'm not trying to say that that is good or bad. Just saying that motives for hunting seem to be something other than looking for ways to put the odds in the deer's favor.

I don't have a problem with others who wish to challenge themselves by using primitive weapons, but I do have a problem with myself doing that.   I always seek to minimize the challenge, which I believe shows more respect for the deer.  I am not comfortable with using deer "for sport", the same as I am not comfortable with "catch and release" fishing.  I believe that God gave us all these creatures for food, not as toys to play with.  I find it a lot more fun and often cheaper, gathering meat from the wild, than it is to farm raise or get it from a store.  That makes me wonder why more folks don't take up hunting and fishing.  Could it be because they are looked down upon by "trophy hunters"  ?             

[Larry]

Here one more reason I took this off the state senate page for bill sb-4739

I am a 37 year old who has been hunting large tracts of private land since I was able to hunt. I have spent countless hours and ten of thousands of dollars over the years to provide quality nutrition and habitat for white tails. We imposed an eight point and outside the ears restriction on our property since purchase. It does make a significant difference in the quality of bucks. However the moment those deer you pass leave your property they are fair game and often get shot. From my standpoint I can't tell you how aggravating that cycle is. I fully support an antler restriction being put into law. And I think within a two year period most all who are against this would change their minds. Counting points has never been an issue with the harvest of 27 eight point or larger bucks I've been able to harvest over the years. And if you can't tell how big or the age of the animal is your attempting to harvest, you probably shouldn't be pulling the trigger in the first place. Let's put this into action !

this is there my deer attitude. because I paided for them.

Edited June 30, 2017 by Larry

[TreeGuy]

I am aware of grows gender. I just have this habit of insulting without knowingly doing so.

OK perhaps this will put this to bed...read the last three post...If my point isn't seen, then It flew to high over your head. My opinion was not directed JUST at you. it was a statement of how things can be read when worded a certain way   "words perceived"


Well that's weird, why would you you want to go to bed ? Are you posting while your extremely tired ? That's the way I "perceived" it....

But again I'll say, check your list. Other than the last statement.. . Are you telling me those are insults ? Are those valid statements ? Are these "common phrases" being tossed around incorrect ? Or is it that YOUR taking offense to them because YOU don't have the drive to hunt mature deer ???

Let me try and dumb it down to get some answers about YOUR hunting style... Let's say there is a fork horn, 1.5 yr old at 40 yrds broadside and a 140" 3.5 yr old 10pt facing away from you at 60 yards. Both are browsing and have no idea your there. It's gun season... Honestly, put yourself in the situation and tell me what you would do. Please feel free to unfold the story any way you want. GO

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[growalot]

I can answer that honestly but you'll call me a liar. So I'm wondering why I bother. It would depend on the 11/2 year olds rack shape. Though because it is a 10 pt and I've taken many many 8 pts and 9pts.  More then likely the 10, Now that desicion would also decide on the body size and rut and whether or not I have meat in the freezer. This said because  I will avoid ever shooting a nasty rutty buck ever again,the meat on the last one went to the dogs ,it was inedable.

See, you can go through my post and see where I have said these same things several times. The fact that I don't have racks mounted,their sitting in buckets or rafters. I hunt with personal goals in mind and clean shots. I've also mentioned having an 8 and a 10 come in during bow and the 8 was shot for it was the best shot. My first  archery deer as a 7 pt. How that hunt played out and you can check posts from years ago on this,was an absolute monster came in 20 yrds but wouldn't stop..went to gully and bedded. I tried everything to call him back when a 10 appeared coming toward me from the right when my 7 trotted in from the left and gave me a 17 or so shot with my recurve. I  shot  him. 

Another hunt up on Marrowback ,a friends property. Had a thick tall tined huge bodied 8 pt came in 30 yrds out. Coming right to me when a funky racked 7 pt showed up coming in as well Thin and with what I thought was an arrow sticking up between his shoulders. I shot him,turned out to be his rib and he was taken to the DEC for a replacement tag due the gangrene. He had survived a car hit..

I shoot deer on what ever decision circumstance at the time lead me to. Yes I set goals..certain doe and I will hunt them harder then a buck. Certain buck,split brows,dbl split brows, stickers,and yes pts. Now it doesnt make bit of difference to me how big those pts are or how old the deer is.  Do I take and show pics? Yes sir How many have you seen where I had to be in the picture? As far as "dumbing down" I knew answering this, I wouldn't be able to dumb it down enough for you to understand my " style " of hunting. That and the simple simple fact that how and what I hunt doesn't nor will it ever prove me a lesser or better hunter then you or anyone else. I know guys wear the term " I ate tag soup " waiting for that one buck as a badge of honor. Heres my one and only time saying this,because I have no need to insult them with my personal opinion. That statement is one of a glory hound  not a hunter. I laugh at the fact they talk about getting time off just at the right times of the rut,a time when buck are at their dumbest. They try to negate luck as a factor,Oh wait luck is only achieved through skill. Luck is luck, circumstance born out of randomness.

One more thing I do not use sights on my bow except the cross bow which came scoped, I do not use a rifle and I shoot a 20 ga with a single bead at the end of the barrel. Does that make me a better hunter than the guy with top of the line optics ,long range rifles on totally unsuspcting deer out of scent and sight range of the hunter? Not any more than the guy who goes after " mature " buck in the rut, I'm just a good enough hunter to know this.

[stubby68]

3 hours ago, TreeGuy said:

OK perhaps this will put this to bed...read the last three post...If my point isn't seen, then It flew to high over your head. My opinion was not directed JUST at you. it was a statement of how things can be read when worded a certain way   "words perceived"


Well that's weird, why would you you want to go to bed ? Are you posting while your extremely tired ? That's the way I "perceived" it....

But again I'll say, check your list. Other than the last statement.. . Are you telling me those are insults ? Are those valid statements ? Are these "common phrases" being tossed around incorrect ? Or is it that YOUR taking offense to them because YOU don't have the drive to hunt mature deer ???

Let me try and dumb it down to get some answers about YOUR hunting style... Let's say there is a fork horn, 1.5 yr old at 40 yrds broadside and a 140" 3.5 yr old 10pt facing away from you at 60 yards. Both are browsing and have no idea your there. It's gun season... Honestly, put yourself in the situation and tell me what you would do. Please feel free to unfold the story any way you want. GO

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    I know this isn't dire Ted at me but would like to give my answer. I been in similar situation. I will take the 1.5 everytime. For me it would come down to which one taste better. That would be the younger smaller one. If I shot the big one I would donate it and be out a tag and the meat in the freezer.

               Here's a question. A guy sets up a tree stand in a spot he knows there is lots of activity. Does not know what is i  the area just knows it has alot of activity. He has a week to hunt and plans on sitting this spot every day for that week or until he gets a buck. Sees no deer the first 2 days. On the third day a 140 inch 10 point walks by and he kills it. He had no clue that deer was using that area or was even in the woods for that matter.  Other side of this is. Same guy knows this buck is in the woods and knows he is active in that aera. This is the reason he put stand there. Still only has 1 week to hunt and plans t of sit that stand for that week or till he gets that buck. Sees no deer for first 2 days on third day the buck walks by and he kills it.

 

              Which shows luck and which skill? The only difference is that in one case the hunter knew the deer was there before putting up the stand. In the other he had no clue. Does knowing the buck was in that area mean it was skill that the hunter used to get the buck? Point is that even if you know a big buck is using an area you set up in it is still all just luck that he walks through while you are there and gives you a good shot.

     Skill would be knowing a big buck is in your woods and being able to state the time and place you were going to kill it before you went out.

             

[Doc]

10 hours ago, wolc123 said:

I don't have a problem with others who wish to challenge themselves by using primitive weapons, but I do have a problem with myself doing that.   I always seek to minimize the challenge, which I believe shows more respect for the deer.  I am not comfortable with using deer "for sport", the same as I am not comfortable with "catch and release" fishing.  I believe that God gave us all these creatures for food, not as toys to play with.  I find it a lot more fun and often cheaper, gathering meat from the wild, than it is to farm raise or get it from a store.  That makes me wonder why more folks don't take up hunting and fishing.  Could it be because they are looked down upon by "trophy hunters"  ?             

Ok, then challenge is not one of the motivating feature of hunting for you. I was not stating whether it should be or shouldn't be, just stating that in some cases, we seem to be moving toward a hunting culture that wants to remove challenge a motive. To me, I see hunting as a contest between me and the prey, and I do enjoy a worthy contest. If I was only interested in food, I would have been a farmer. Also, my resources have not dwindled to the point where I must forage for my food........yet. We do quite well at the super market and actually find it cheaper when all things are considered...... lol. I think that if you value your time as being worth anything, and when you look at the cost of equipment and supplies and maintenance, and transportation and special clothing, venison is one very expensive kind of meat.

Regarding the question of respect, I think I have as much respect for my prey as anyone, and when looked at as a worthy adversary, perhaps even more respect than many who have an attitude of "whatever it takes to get that walking chunk of venison is ok, fairness be damned". I still maintain the perspective that hunting/fishing is recreation, and whatever handicaps that I voluntarily place on myself only helps to further the principles of "fair chase".

[Four Season Whitetail's]

5 hours ago, stubby68 said:

    I know this isn't dire Ted at me but would like to give my answer. I been in similar situation. I will take the 1.5 everytime. For me it would come down to which one taste better. That would be the younger smaller one. If I shot the big one I would donate it and be out a tag and the meat in the freezer.

               Here's a question. A guy sets up a tree stand in a spot he knows there is lots of activity. Does not know what is i  the area just knows it has alot of activity. He has a week to hunt and plans on sitting this spot every day for that week or until he gets a buck. Sees no deer the first 2 days. On the third day a 140 inch 10 point walks by and he kills it. He had no clue that deer was using that area or was even in the woods for that matter.  Other side of this is. Same guy knows this buck is in the woods and knows he is active in that aera. This is the reason he put stand there. Still only has 1 week to hunt and plans t of sit that stand for that week or till he gets that buck. Sees no deer for first 2 days on third day the buck walks by and he kills it.

 

              Which shows luck and which skill? The only difference is that in one case the hunter knew the deer was there before putting up the stand. In the other he had no clue. Does knowing the buck was in that area mean it was skill that the hunter used to get the buck? Point is that even if you know a big buck is using an area you set up in it is still all just luck that he walks through while you are there and gives you a good shot.

     Skill would be knowing a big buck is in your woods and being able to state the time and place you were going to kill it before you went out.

             

Seriously?

[moog5050]

33 minutes ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

Seriously?

Sadly he is.  Lol

[wolc123]

9 hours ago, TreeGuy said:

Let me try and dumb it down to get some answers about YOUR hunting style... Let's say there is a fork horn, 1.5 yr old at 40 yrds broadside and a 140" 3.5 yr old 10pt facing away from you at 60 yards. Both are browsing and have no idea your there. It's gun season... Honestly, put yourself in the situation and tell me what you would do. Please feel free to unfold the story any way you want. GO

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I know what one I am going for (see Texas heart shot thread) if I have my scoped 30/06 and a good rest.  Placing a bullet within 1/8" of a pinpoint is a piece of cake for me with that in that situation.  Hit that spot and the deer dies instantly and all you loose is a neck roast (been there and done that).

I can't tell the  difference in meat quality between a 3-1/2 year old and a 1-1/2 year old.  The controlled aging time required before processing is about two weeks with a 3-1/2 but a week will do it on a 1-1/2.   The 3-1/2 will normally provide about 2X the meat so that is worth the wait and a much better use of my buck tag.

Edited July 1, 2017 by wolc123

[stubby68]

2 hours ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

Seriously?

To which part do you refer?  The part where someone would shoot a deer for eating rather then hanging on a wall? Or the part where no matter how much scouting and prep work you do or how much knowledge you have being in your stand at the exact time that big buck walks by and presents you with a good shot is just as much luck as not doing any work and knowing anything and still having that walk by. 

         Read some of the stories that go along with some of the record book bucks. Seems know matter how much time and effort the hunter put into that buck that they had been after for 3 years. They always say as luck would have it I was in that stand when he walked by that day and gave me a perfect shot.

            Like I said, saying you are going to kill a certain buck on a specific day at a specific time is skill. Everything else is just going to your stand and hoping you ar lucky enough to have that bucks walk by while you are there. 

            With everything available for to today's hunter how much skill is involved in hunting anymore? Years ago skill was a big part of hunting but not today.

[jman22]

8 hours ago, stubby68 said:

    Here's a question. A guy sets up a tree stand in a spot he knows there is lots of activity. Does not know what is i  the area just knows it has alot of activity. He has a week to hunt and plans on sitting this spot every day for that week or until he gets a buck. Sees no deer the first 2 days. On the third day a 140 inch 10 point walks by and he kills it. He had no clue that deer was using that area or was even in the woods for that matter.  Other side of this is. Same guy knows this buck is in the woods and knows he is active in that aera. This is the reason he put stand there. Still only has 1 week to hunt and plans t of sit that stand for that week or till he gets that buck. Sees no deer for first 2 days on third day the buck walks by and he kills it.

 

              Which shows luck and which skill? The only difference is that in one case the hunter knew the deer was there before putting up the stand. In the other he had no clue. Does knowing the buck was in that area mean it was skill that the hunter used to get the buck? Point is that even if you know a big buck is using an area you set up in it is still all just luck that he walks through while you are there and gives you a good shot.

     Skill would be knowing a big buck is in your woods and being able to state the time and place you were going to kill it before you went out.

             

Here is my opinion on that question. Strictly an opinion that I don't expect all to agree with. Both hunters utilized some sort of skill to shoot that buck and both had some luck on their side.  But I still have to say the unknowing hunter had more luck on his side. If he hunted that same stand every day he probably wasn't paying attention to wind , bedding, his scent trail, entry and exit routes etc... He unknowingly aligned many specific factors to allow that buck to cross within his range without being had. 

The guy that was targeting the buck was probably paying attention to all these factors. He most likely had multiple setups, knew where this buck was bedding, and had a entry and exit that allowed him to get close. He probably wasnt hunting every day if the conditions didnt favor it. From experience if your hunting the same stand day in and day out (when conditions don't always favor it), many deer, especially the older does and bucks that frequent that area with figure you out after day 1. Again, I'm talking aBout a lot of specifics here and I know I did stray off path a bit from stubby68 question. 

Either way the hunter shot a buck that he should be extremely proud of, no matter what the circumstances!