2011 DMP numbers up by 10%

[WNYBuckHunter]

NY: DMP numbers up by 10 percent statewide

Albany - DEC will boost Deer Management Permits by just over 10 percent this season, but the bulk of that jump is the product of increased antlerless tag allocations in much of central and western New York.

 

The statewide DMP target of 501,675 - which doesn't include units with no DMP targets - is up from the 2010 total of 451,400.

 

The 10 percent increase in DMPs comes on the heels of last year's reduction by a similar percentage. That occurred as biologists sought a leveling off of deer numbers in much of the Southern Tier due to stalled growth in the herd.

 

DEC wildlife biologist Jeremy Hurst cautioned, however, that the statewide jump in tags may not be reflected in some wildlife management units.

 

"Eastern and southeastern New York, for the most part, will have pretty stable DMP numbers or even a slight drop in permits," Hurst said. "As you'd expect, the targets vary unit by unit."

 

He added that much of central and western New York, except for a handful of WMUs through the Southern Zone counties of Chautauqua, Cattaraugus,  Allegany and Steuben, are seeing an increase in DMP numbers.

 

DMPs are generally the major tool used by the state to manage its whitetail numbers. DEC annually uses a number of gauges in setting permit allocations, grappling with factors such as the harvest by the state's bow and muzzleloader hunters as well as success rates on DMP tags, which vary from one unit to the next.

 

Hurst said hunter success rates on DMPs range from just under 10 percent to as high as 35 percent in some WMUs, but generally run just under 20  percent.

 

"When we set DMP targets, we start by evaluating trends in deer population and harvest to assess what level of antlerless harvest is appropriate in each WMU," he said. "Then we have to account for antlerless take by bow and muzzleloader hunters and on DMAP (Deer Management Assistance Program) tags, and factor in DMP success rates in each unit."

 

Once DEC sets a target allocation, the odds of selection - high, medium or low - are determined based on trends in the number of DMP applicants in each unit, he said.

 

New York residents generally have a better chance of drawing one and sometimes two tags, while nonresidents, in some cases, will have no shot at securing one DMP but, in some units, could actually score a pair of tags.

 

DEC officials always urge hunters to do their homework before purchasing their hunting license. Posters are generally set up at most license-buying locations to help hunters make their decision on what unit to seek DMPs.

 

The deadline for applying for a DMP is Oct. 1, but hunters will have the same odds no matter when they apply for the antlerless tags.

 

A unit-by-unit allocation chart appears on Page 21. DEC also offers a list of odds of selection for a DMP at its website: www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/30409.html

[bubba]

I am glad that they went up in some places.  My two areas 6a is landowner or disabled vet only and 6c is preference points required.  So, where I hunt, the chances of getting one went way down.  I can get one due to landowner in 6c,  but no one else who hunts with me will get one.  But with 2 weeks of muzzleloading and an antlerless and either sex tags, I do not need one.  Maybe I will save my 10 bucks, since I do not need that many deer.  I got two last year and still have some in the feeezer. 

[Dave]

DMP down in 4W last year there were 1900 and this year only 1000.

Dave

[MuzzyLoader]

  I got two last year and still have some in the feeezer.

I thought I read in the regs where it was illegal to have venison in your possession after August 1st.  Does anyone know if this is true?

[bubba]

not sure what this has to do with dmp numbers, but, you can posess it with a permit issued by a local dec officer.  I have said permit.  The reason for that is to catch poachers who have a freezer full all the time. 

[landtracdeerhunter]

Looking for some answers. I think the DMP program needs some fine tuning, in certain WMU units.  I don't think it's working, in those units, like the D.E.C. would like it to work.  I'm talking WMU's 9A,8A,9F, AND 8G.  The harvest success rate falls below the state average 0f 18 %. Examples; 9A-9.1%; 8a- 14.5%; 9F-14.2%; 8g- 15.3% (2010 harvest report).  Hunter harvest rates continue to run the same year after year, despite increases in DMP issued numbers.( I realize as  DMP numbers increase, so do harvest numbers to keep the % the same.) Nothing is said to much about DMP's in this 5 year plan, their currently studying. Will the DMP sucess rate rise, if they pull the either sex tag for bow?  Could someone also explain why DMP target numbers are  always different than the total numbers handed out?

[WNYBuckHunter]

  I got two last year and still have some in the feeezer.

I thought I read in the regs where it was illegal to have venison in your possession after August 1st.  Does anyone know if this is true?

That would be news to me, never heard of such a thing. I still have a little left from last year, and in the past have had it well into the next season. I keep all of my used tags in a drawer as long as I have the meat.

It wouldnt make sense, as you can still shoot deer all summer with DDPs. You dont have to dump the meat from those deer.

[bubba]

or you hit one with a car.  But it is the law.  Have I ever heard of anyone  getting ticketed umm no.  I guess if I had a freezer full yes.  I doubt the DEC will come and ask to look in my freezer to see what I have. 

[bubba]

I tis also the law that you have to have your tag number on every package and the date of kill.  I doubt very many people do that either.  If I did not have that info on a package, I would not be asking for a permit to keep it. 

[Dave]

Bubba's right it's the law. Surprised you didn't know that?

Dave

[gjs4]

I am done believing the produced numbers and scared $hitless of the dmus with 30-40000 DMPs to be doled out......and most my hunting is in one of them....

The only pros for killing every doe alive is should make a more defined rut and that a communicable disease may not kill every deer in wNY......but to think that 15 years ago 1 doe was the prize of 5 guys on a permit and now 5 doe tags per hunter is proof (to me) no one knows how many deer live or die in any area of NY

[WNYBuckHunter]

I am done believing the produced numbers and scared $hitless of the dmus with 30-40000 DMPs to be doled out......and most my hunting is in one of them....

The only pros for killing every doe alive is should make a more defined rut and that a communicable disease may not kill every deer in wNY......but to think that 15 years ago 1 doe was the prize of 5 guys on a permit and now 5 doe tags per hunter is proof (to me) no one knows how many deer live or die in any area of NY

Come on Garrett, you are smart enough to know why they hand that many DMPs out. Whats the success percentage for DMPs in NY again?

[13BVET]

Once again, the DMP's in 3G are pathetic. Baffles the mind, as there are actually tons of does in that area. I think they need to do real time scouting. They are way off base on their numbers.

[Doc]

Is there anybody who really believes in the DEC's ability to properly estimate the deer herd numbers in any area? Yeah, I know, their computer and statistical models have been audited by some experts from somewhere and found to be just wonderful. And yet there is evidence from past years that they do screw up and sometimes quite badly. I think they are just like the weathermen ...... their actual abilities are often lacking, but they are able to baffle everyone with fancy numerical footwork to get enough believers to make themselves look like experts.

Oh my ..... that's harsh! But really, sometimes I wonder.

[bubba]

I also like to think there are a lot of armchair quarterbacks too.  I see a few does around my property and think we should have permits.  Maybe 5 miles down the road in the same wmu there are very few.  We as the public see a very small area of the wmu and think we are experts.  I am willing to bet that the majority of people who keep complaining and saying their area is over run by flat heads are the same people who during last season were psoting there are no deer around and the population had been descimated.  No one has really put in the time and resources to study their entire area other than maybe seeing a few deer around driving to and from work and thinking there are tons.   

[WNYBuckHunter]

Looking for some answers. I think the DMP program needs some fine tuning, in certain WMU units.  I don't think it's working, in those units, like the D.E.C. would like it to work.  I'm talking WMU's 9A,8A,9F, AND 8G.  The harvest success rate falls below the state average 0f 18 %. Examples; 9A-9.1%; 8a- 14.5%; 9F-14.2%; 8g- 15.3% (2010 harvest report).  Hunter harvest rates continue to run the same year after year, despite increases in DMP issued numbers.( I realize as  DMP numbers increase, so do harvest numbers to keep the % the same.) Nothing is said to much about DMP's in this 5 year plan, their currently studying. Will the DMP sucess rate rise, if they pull the either sex tag for bow?  Could someone also explain why DMP target numbers are  always different than the total numbers handed out?

The number they hand out is based on the success rate. If the average success rate is say, 15% and they need 300 does taken, they hand out 2000 permits. Im not sure why they wouldnt up it for those areas unless they are fine with the number being taken.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I would really love to know exactly what information they use to come up with their numbers from year to year. It would at least make for an interesting read.

[Doc]

I also like to think there are a lot of armchair quarterbacks too.  I see a few does around my property and think we should have permits.  Maybe 5 miles down the road in the same wmu there are very few.  We as the public see a very small area of the wmu and think we are experts.  I am willing to bet that the majority of people who keep complaining and saying their area is over run by flat heads are the same people who during last season were psoting there are no deer around and the population had been descimated.  No one has really put in the time and resources to study their entire area other than maybe seeing a few deer around driving to and from work and thinking there are tons. 

There is one thing to be said of hunter opinions. They are the only ones that actually set foot on the ground. Whether they are interpreting what they see correctly or not is certainly up for question. But I do believe that for their little corner of the woods, nobody knows the population situation as well as those that actually walk the land and make real observations. That doesn't work too well for WMU conclusions, or even township-wide conclusions. But when you take a whole area of hunters all saying the same thing as they were back a few years ago, it sure seems like something has gone terribly wrong when those opinions run contrary to the DEC's official numbers. In fact the DMP quantities issued by the DEC back then showed that they were paying a bit of attention to all those hunters also as numbers all of sudden were revised to more accurately reflect what was going on out there.

[landtracdeerhunter]

Their are so many factors that play a key role in supporting deer numbers in any given area.  From 1954-2002, deer numbers have growned, state wide. ( according to DEC estimates)  The DEC would like to believe it's due to their efforts, and maybe part of this may be true.  Something is working, at least in some of the state. It would be nice to obtain deer numbers each year, by each WMU unit, to see where it has worked and where it has not.

[Doc]

I would really love to know exactly what information they use to come up with their numbers from year to year. It would at least make for an interesting read.

As I understand it, the whole system is based on harvest numbers. That much is easy to understand. But what they do with those harvest numbers is what would be interesting to read. Even though the harvest number reporting seems to be treated like a mere suggestion rather than the actual legal requirement that it is, this seems to be the major building block of the whole system. And from this, and the input from their CTF's they come up with some way of determining DMP numbers. Yes there sure has to be a lot of other necessary stuff between those couplke items that never gets explained, and that would be the stuff that would make interesting reading.

Frankly I would be interested in how habitat is factored in, and how habitat is actually assessed, measured and turned into a numerical factor. It would be interesting to see how winter-kill, disease and predation are measured and factored in. Most of all, it would be interesting as to how they handle the verification process (how do they measure success of their system?) . They certainly can't and don't do any physical counting, so what is it that they do to prove they are not getting statistical drift?

Ah, so many questions and so few answers 

[landtracdeerhunter]

Car-deer collisions have a big impact in our area.  I'm sure insurance companies also have a strong voice, that is heard in Albany.

[fasteddie]

Car-deer collisions have a big impact in our area.  I'm sure insurance companies also have a strong voice, that is heard in Albany.

I think that if the Insurance Companies had their way , they would eradicate the deer population !  ???

[SteveB]

Insurance companies actually care little. They write policies based on anticipated loss and adjust rates accordingly in areas of higher collisions. They don't lose money paying a claim - its all factored into the cost.