Archery Equipment

[rob1114]

Whats up with archery equipment these days? I got a new Bass Pro catalog in the mail the other day and I was flipping through it and amused by how much they charge for some of the "Top of the Line" stuff:    $279.99 Bow Sight  $129.99 Quiver  $109.99 Release  $259.99 Bow Case  $249.99 Target (aka plastic deer I'm going to poke holes in)  $79.99 for 3 Titanium broadheads    After you buy all this you still need a bow, arrows, treestand, clothes, etc...  Deer must be getting pretty smart if we are spending almost as much money to hunt them that the government spends to hunt the Taliban.  Do people really buy this stuff? Someone is getting rich off of few bow hunters.    Anyway, thanks for listening to me ramble. Good luck to all and if you don't get that big buck you must not have spent enough money in the off season

[WNYBuckHunter]

You want to see crazy? Go over to Archerytalk.com and see what some of those guys have into their rigs. I have to admit, that if I bought all of the stuff for mine new, Id have quite a bit of cash tied up in it. I usually just wait until someone over on AT gets something new and sells their almost new equipment for half price lol.

As far as targets go, you can get the Glen Del Buck for around $150 and the vitals area can be turned so that once you shoot up one side, there are another few waiting to be used. They also sell the replacements for them. I know guys that have had theirs for 4 - 6 years and they are still in great shape. If you divvy that up to price per year, its not bad at all. I got a cheap ($80) 3d deer a few years back and that one has just about had it. Ill be replacing it with the Glen Del.

[rob1114]

You bring up a good point. Sometimes the higher price items are well worth the money, and sometimes they are just higher price to seem better.

What are some products that you all were reluctant to buy but are extremely happy you did?

For me it would be my Bushnel Arch Range Finder. Thought it was a waste of money at first but now I bring it everytime I go in the woods

[WNYBuckHunter]

My range finder was tough for me as well, but I have been pretty happy with it.

[nyantler]

You want to see crazy? Go over to Archerytalk.com and see what some of those guys have into their rigs. I have to admit, that if I bought all of the stuff for mine new, Id have quite a bit of cash tied up in it. I usually just wait until someone over on AT gets something new and sells their almost new equipment for half price lol.

As far as targets go, you can get the Glen Del Buck for around $150 and the vitals area can be turned so that once you shoot up one side, there are another few waiting to be used. They also sell the replacements for them. I know guys that have had theirs for 4 - 6 years and they are still in great shape. If you divvy that up to price per year, its not bad at all. I got a cheap ($80) 3d deer a few years back and that one has just about had it. Ill be replacing it with the Glen Del.

Thats the problem is some guys are paying whatever and buying into the hype... back when the first Scentlok suits were made and they were just getting started... you could buy an entire suit... headgear and all for $99... today they are $300-600 depending on what you want... guys were willing to pay whatever to get one and Scentlok was smart enough to make them pay whatever... I have one of the first suits they ever made from when I did business with them in the 90's... I think it is a terrific product... but I refuse to pay what the suit cost today.. I think the cost of hunting "stuff" is getting out of hand. Maybe thats why I have gotten rid of all my fancy stuff and gone back to the old stuff. The worst of all is what people pay just because of the camo pattern... a deer doesn't know if you spent $10 or $1000... or if its Mossy Oak or Realtree... or just an old Hawaiian shirt you had laying around from your honeymoon

[sweet old bill]

the average cost has gone up about 30% per year for the last 5 years or so. It use to be a top of the line bow was in the 300 to 400 dollar range. Now it close to 1000 to 1200 and that bare bow, then add a sight 120, a 1uiver can be from 65 to 100, a drop a way rest from a low of 45 to over 100...then lets try arrow carbon from a sale [price of 50 dollar a doz to now it can be 150 dollar doz. They sure make it hard on the end customer. I also buy used fro archery talk, seems in Jan as the new bows come out you can get a left over from a shop for 65% of what they had it for and or a lightly used one for about half or less with sight and rest...

[Doc]

In my younger years, I went through the phase where I had to own every new gadget that came out on the market. I amassed huge quantities of "stuff". I currently have a wall full of old bows.

Eventually, it dawned on me that you can't buy accuracy and I simply stopped buying equipment unless something just plain broke. The last bow that I bought was a Mathews MQ-32 that fully equipped (including release) cost me $600. That was quite a while ago. At the time that was quite a bit of money and seemed to be the purchase that highlighted just how silly all my spending had become. Now, the pile of aluminum arrows that I have in a corner are kept alive with arrow-building equipment that I bought years ago. I buy a few vanes and nocks every now and then and a tube of fletch-tite and replace strings on the old bow occasionally when needed and that is the extent of my spending.

Since I stopped trying to be the test lab for every new archery gimmick, I have saved thousands of dollars. Nobody is getting rich off my attempts to keep up with the Joneses. Instead of trying to buy success, I simply put my emphasis on improving shooting and hunting skills.

So as far as I am concerned, let the prices do whatever they want.

[steve863]

I am not as avid a bowhunter as many others are, but the price of bows and archery equipment is downright ridiculous in my opinion.  The prices are shocking compared to when I bought my first bow 20+ years ago.  I could buy a perfectly good big game rifle and scope (and many to choose from) that will kill game at 200+ yards with no problem for well under $1000, while the bow companies want me to pay $1000 or more for a bare bow that has an honest killing range of 30 yards or less???  I say BS to that.  No way in hell are these bows worth that much money.  Plus, if you keep a gun long enough, you will probably be able to sell it for as much or MORE than you paid for it originally.  Try doing that with one of these $1000 bows.  They are pretty much worthless as soon as you bring them home from the shop.

[Doc]

But...... Just like any other industry, the asking price is as much as the market will bear. Who is really at fault ...... the guy selling the equipment or the group of people who are willing to pay that much and more for their stuff? Who really establishes the prices .... the retailers or the customers? Unless you are talking about something where the manufacturers have a monopoly (like gas companies), or a product that is an absolute necessity (like food), it is the consumer that sets the price. If archery prices appear to be ridiculous, archers have only themselves to blame.

[steve863]

But...... Just like any other industry, the asking price is as much as the market will bear. Who is really at fault ...... the guy selling the equipment or the group of people who are willing to pay that much and more for their stuff? Who really establishes the prices .... the retailers or the customers? Unless you are talking about something where the manufacturers have a monopoly (like gas companies), or a product that is an absolute necessity (like food), it is the consumer that sets the price. If archery prices appear to be ridiculous, archers have only themselves to blame.

Yeah, you are right, the archers ARE stupid to be paying these prices, but the manufacturers also typically have something called "manufacturers suggested prices".  In general you can get a product from a retailer for below this price, but it's not like if the suggested price is $700 that the manufacturers will be making this same product of the same quality for long if retailers are only selling them for $300.  If $300 is all they will be getting, you will sooner than later see crappier products being put out for this  same $300.  So in general I think the products out there right now are really good, but are they worth the money??  I would say no way.  The archers AND the manufacturers are equally guilty in my opinion.  When I can get a perfectly good gun for half the cost that will outlive me by several future generations with the littlest of care, why would archers OR the manufacturers think bows should cost more??  In my mind there is nothing that justifies this greater price.  If bows could at least retain some of their value, maybe I could see it.  But they are about as worthless as old shoes even after only a couple of years after purchase.

[Doc]

In my mind there is nothing that justifies this greater price. 

A product is worth whatever someone will pay for it ......

Sure there are other items of equal cost that have real useful value that is greater than a bow, but people want the bow more and will pay more for it. Manufacturers and retailers are no dummies. When you have something that people will pay a lot of cash for, you don't try to talk them into a lower price. Frankly, I don't really have a lot of sympathy for someone who feels they need a new bow every other year. I've been there and I have since found out that a lot of the bows that I shot 20 or 30 years ago killed deer just as dead. So when someone waves a $1000 bow under my nose, I have actually learned how to not buy it. Those guys had their crack at me for way too many years. There's none of them getting rich on me anymore. I suspect that if more people adopted even a small percentage of that attitude, archery product prices would slide more toward a reasonable level.

[nyantler]

In my younger years, I went through the phase where I had to own every new gadget that came out on the market. I amassed huge quantities of "stuff". I currently have a wall full of old bows.

Eventually, it dawned on me that you can't buy accuracy and I simply stopped buying equipment unless something just plain broke. The last bow that I bought was a Mathews MQ-32 that fully equipped (including release) cost me $600. That was quite a while ago. At the time that was quite a bit of money and seemed to be the purchase that highlighted just how silly all my spending had become. Now, the pile of aluminum arrows that I have in a corner are kept alive with arrow-building equipment that I bought years ago. I buy a few vanes and nocks every now and then and a tube of fletch-tite and replace strings on the old bow occasionally when needed and that is the extent of my spending.

Since I stopped trying to be the test lab for every new archery gimmick, I have saved thousands of dollars. Nobody is getting rich off my attempts to keep up with the Joneses. Instead of trying to buy success, I simply put my emphasis on improving shooting and hunting skills.

So as far as I am concerned, let the prices do whatever they want.

OMG that sounds like me Doc...

[Doc]

OMG that sounds like me Doc...

I've been on both sides of that issue, so I understand how that mania to buy and try everything can work. But I eventually got just as aggravated as anyone here at the constantly escalating prices and the feeling that I was being made a fool of by the archery industry. One thing that got me into the buying syndrome was early on when I got into tournament shooting. If we hunters think that we are suckers for everything that comes along, it ain't nothing compared to the tourney guys who are looking to squeeze out every last point..... lol. In fact that is what got me into a compound. I was a happy recurve shooter until I got the tournament bug.

Well, things are different now and I have a shop full of equipment that should last me a lifetime. Even if my bow blows up, I have a wall full of replacements  ;D  . So if those archery manufacturer's are looking to get rich off my back, they have a real disappointment in store for them. They had their time.

[Doewhacker]

I think that the advertising media is partly to blame for this high price of equipment. Some guys HAVE to HAVE what they see on tv and in magazines because they beleive it will help them get that big buck. Its basically rammed down their throats every where they turn to the point where it is beleived to be true. A prime example of that is Matthews Bows, sure they are a nice bow but if you go to the shop and pick up the catalog its as thick as a good book and has lots of pictures of hunters posing in front of thier trophys as proof of their effectiveness. And just what is the difference between a $1000 bow and $300 bow or an old bow? answer...not much, maybe a few tenths of a second faster at 20 yards, no lighter and possibly a better warranty? 

Its the same no matter the product too, we pay for marketing and not much more, guys just buy into it is all. I would like to thank those guys for keeping the economy going by the way. 

[biggamefish]

I agree I didn't buy the sentlok suit and people look at me crazly I don't really use the spray killer ether if you are carefull you don't need all the hype stuff. The new stuff is so it is easier and people have to do less to get ready. I think people are just getting lazier. Just my opinion though.

[Elmo]

I know it's not exactly the same topic but I think it relates if used as an example.

When I was learning photography, I was advised to use an old Nikon FM10.  This is a old style camera replicating cameras from the 70's.  Not a single bit of electronics in that camera.  To take pictures on it I had to adjust everything manually for every shot.  This forced me to used every bit of my skill to produce a quality picture since there was no technology to assist me.  Some of the best pictures I've taken was with that camera even compared to the ones I take now with equipment that cost thousands of dollars.  Moral is, you don't need fancy equipment to shoot well.  If you want to shoot better (camera, rifle, bow) you have to practice, practice, and practice.

[132 eight pointer]

I agree with most of what has been said so far.I have found many hunting items over the years at clearance prices.A person new to hunting does not have to spend a small fortune to bring game home and enjoy the sport.I wrote once before about a bowhunting video I bought aprox. 25 yrs ago that starred Chuck Adams.In it he showed how to camo the human face.clear an area for a treestand and how you could wear an open pattern flannel shirt or jacket to break up your outline.That was before the Outdoor shows and most of the hunting camo patterns were marketed with well known hunters as spokespersons.I enjoy some of these shows but I also know I don't need the latest -greatest weapon or gadget . Some hunting supplies have made great improvements due to the big business of the sport- climbing treestands come to mind.However a borrowed firearm,warm clothes,practice and a clean 5 gal. pail as a seat could still be enough to bring home some game.(And a license of course). Or a used bow since we were talking about archery.

[Doc]

Well, the tendency is to want to buy success. The theory being that if you throw enough money at a problem, it will solve itself. It does take a long time to get past that notion, but it can be done. As much as we never seem to think so, money is still in fairly easy supply compared to hard effort and long hours of learning and practice. There is always the thought that "if I just had the best of everything, I wouldn't have to work at this as hard". Of course it isn't true, but it takes some time to figure that all out. It took me decades and thousands of dollars to finally reach that conclusion.

[Doc]

25 yrs ago that starred Chuck Adams.In it he showed how to camo the human face.clear an area for a treestand and how you could wear an open pattern flannel shirt or jacket to break up your outline.

Yeah.....How exactly did Chuck Adams ever get anything with that checkered flannel shirt? That isn't even possible, is it? ..... 

[132 eight pointer]

Doc, the silver lining to all that money you invested in equipment was that you helped the economy and gave the manufacturers the incentive to stay fresh which I'm sure helped to evolve our favorite past time. Besides now when I wear my wool Carhart pants I can feel "retro".

[RPIBuckHunter]

I'm a frequent reader of Archerytalk as well...and I agree it is just crazy.  I'm not just a bowhunter, I belong to an archery league and shoot three times or more per week, all year.  You should see the look on guys faces when I outshoot their 'top-of-the-line' equipment with my little $285 Martin Saber.  It's not the bow, it is the person behind it!

[Doc]

I'm a frequent reader of Archerytalk as well...and I agree it is just crazy.  I'm not just a bowhunter, I belong to an archery league and shoot three times or more per week, all year.  You should see the look on guys faces when I outshoot their 'top-of-the-line' equipment with my little $285 Martin Saber.  It's not the bow, it is the person behind it!

My Brother-in-law used to do the same thing back in the early 80's. He would shoot against a whole line of guys that had all their fancy polished up bows with 36" stabilizers sticking out all over the place so they looked like some kind of space satellite, and their fancy arrow rests and killian sights with chrome and flash everywhere. He was shooting an old Bear whitetail hunter with the epoxy limbs, and an arrow rest that was nothing but a solid plexiglass block glued onto the bow shelf. That and his nasty old gamegetter arrows would quite often walk away the winner for the evening. It was really quite funny.

[RPIBuckHunter]

my good friend is one of the cheapest SOB's you'll ever find and he has only shot 3 deer with his rickety old bow in the last 20 years. Coincidence?

Probably.  I have yet to see any evidence that indicates that newer, more expensive bows kill deer deader.

In all seriousness, though, is he just not seeing any deer he would like to shoot, or does he honestly say, 'I would only take this shot with a newer, more expensive, faster bow.'?

[Santamour123]

It may be all hype.  But to be honest I will take every chance to stack all the odds in my favor I can

[RobC]

I personally just like having toys. What's more fun then opening up a new toy and getting it all configured and set up, and the more buttons and menus and attachments the better. Doesn't matter if its hunting tvs or whatever.