Not the usual crotch horn

[cwhite]

If I see him, he's dead. If I had nothing but money, I would get him mounted. I'm pretty certain he is 3. I have a photo of him from last year. I'm filtering through my pics of him then.

[Dom]

He is nice i think i would take him if had the chance but only with Bow if it was gun season i would let him walk

[NY Trophy Hunter]

Young deer in my opinion.

[nyantler]

He is nice i think i would take him if had the chance but only with Bow if it was gun season i would let him walk

Just curious why he's ok for bow, but not for gun?

[nyantler]

Young deer in my opinion.

likewise

[cwhite]

I know for certain that this deer is at least a 3 year old. I saw him last year as what I thought to be a young 2 year old and let him go. I have his pic and he was a large 4 point then as well. I thought he could turn into something better with another year. Now he is a three year old and still has a clean 4 point rack. For the area, his body and antler size isn't up to par with the majority of deer his age, but if I see him again, I'll proudly put my tag on him.

[G-Man]

We had a 4 point like him around for 4 years could never get a shot, just always out of range. the neighbors boys took him finially and his forks had shrunk although he had 4 in bases... was glad to see him leave the gene pool.

[nyantler]

I know for certain that this deer is at least a 3 year old. I saw him last year as what I thought to be a young 2 year old and let him go. I have his pic and he was a large 4 point then as well. I thought he could turn into something better with another year. Now he is a three year old and still has a clean 4 point rack. For the area, his body and antler size isn't up to par with the majority of deer his age, but if I see him again, I'll proudly put my tag on him.

So he could have been a 1 1/2 old last year? What made you think he was 2 years old last year? . I'm still betting he's 2 1/2... unless you saw him 2 seasons ago...

Edited October 4, 2011 by nyantler

[cwhite]

See Joe, I don't normally post, especially photos, because I don't feel like listening to people who are way smarter than I am. But I will give it a shot.

Last season I had a small herd of yearling bucks around and this buck was significantly larger and more dominant. He was also dominant to a couple 8 pointers. His body was more developed than his younger buddies. He had a larger and wider head than the younger deer too. I don't put too much into antler development but last year he was about 13-14" wide with 6"+ tines. (if he was a yearling it would be the largest set of wild antlers I have ever seen for the age) His demeanor was different from the young bucks as well. Much more moody and spooky. But what really convinced me that he was a 2 year old last year was the fact that I've studied deer since I was about 6 years old and I know a god damned two year old buck from a yearling when I see one.

Oh yeah, most likely saw him in the 2009 season and didn't find him unique enough to remember at the time.

[nyantler]

I'll grant you that antler development is not always a good determining factor when aging a buck, and although I may not be smarter than you... i've studied and killed enough 3 1/2 year olds and better to know what the body of a 3 1/2 year old or better looks like.... and he just doesn't have it. It's entirely possible that he is just a bigger bodied 2 year old and unless you saw him for sure 2 seasons ago your guess is just as good as mine.. but it is nothing more than a guess. I've seen 2 year old 12-pointers and 5 year old 6-pointers and take away the rack and the 2 year old still looks 2 years old and the 5 year old still looks 5... He looks healthy to me with no ribs showing and a lot of muscle tone...which tells me he is getting enough to eat... meaning he should be showing the body signs of a 3 1/2 year old buck.. but he is not.. so unless you are sure you saw him 2 seasons ago... my opinion is still my opinion.

To be fare... is it possible he 3 1/2?... well, anything is possible... but, i still don't think so. But i'd like to see the cam pics of him last season.

Edited October 5, 2011 by nyantler

[fasteddie]

CWhite ----- I don't care how old he is ...... that's a nice looking buck . Thanks for posting the pics !

[nyantler]

I agree.. still a nice healthy looking buck! And good pics as well.

[burmjohn]

What do you have planted there?

[dave6x6]

Nice photos and hope you get what you want come bow season. Do have to agree with Joe though.. Just a 2.5er..

[noahmstone]

I would like to see him show up on my cam. I would really like him to show up in front of my stand.

[dave6x6]

See Joe, I don't normally post, especially photos, because I don't feel like listening to people who are way smarter than I am. But I will give it a shot.

Last season I had a small herd of yearling bucks around and this buck was significantly larger and more dominant. He was also dominant to a couple 8 pointers. His body was more developed than his younger buddies. He had a larger and wider head than the younger deer too. I don't put too much into antler development but last year he was about 13-14" wide with 6"+ tines. (if he was a yearling it would be the largest set of wild antlers I have ever seen for the age) His demeanor was different from the young bucks as well. Much more moody and spooky. But what really convinced me that he was a 2 year old last year was the fact that I've studied deer since I was about 6 years old and I know a god damned two year old buck from a yearling when I see one.

Oh yeah, most likely saw him in the 2009 season and didn't find him unique enough to remember at the time.

Maybe we are talking the same age of this deer but were using different terms. I say that because it's really not that unusual to see a 1.5 yr. old with 6 inch tines and yet you say that would be the biggest you've ever seen. That can't be possible so are you saying you have a yearling(like the first deer season he goes through), then he turns 2 and then becomes 3yrs old? If so then in my terms that would make him a 2.5 yr old. In other words 2.5yr. old deer are experiencing their third hunting season. Does that make any sence? I think this deer is going into his third hunting season..(2.5yrs old)

[cwhite]

OK, so there is no confusion. I call a deer a 3 year old when he is actually 3.5 years old during hunting season. I've seen this deer in the flesh on multiple occasions. He is a young 3 year old. (3.5 years old) Not a 2 year old. I believe he was an August fawn in 2008. Remember 2008/2009 winter was extremely mild. Regardless he should have better body size and headgear for his age.

Joe, don't be fooled by the "newbie hunter" above my login name. I've been around the whitetail world for nearly 30 years. I have a good grasp on body characteristics. Only thing I can think is that the camera angle is concealing his age. The camera is set at 6' so it is looking down and out considerably.

Burm, I have winter rye planted in that plot. I planted it on 9/15. It is a long narrow plot that covers about 1.25 acres. I plant the rye for feed during winter thaws and early spring. Unfortunately it doesn't usually do well because it is mowed by November.

Dave, unless you are hunting behind a high fence somewhere you don't run into too many deer whose first set of antlers spread over a foot with 6" tines coming off the beams. I've killed plenty of baby bucks and none have come close to those dimensions.

Regardless, here he is from last year.

[erussell]

Well ya'll must be smarter than me, I for one can't tell any 4 points apart from the others. I would be hard pressed to say for sure that a four point I saw this yr was the same one I saw last yr. I would also be hard pressed to say the deer in the 1st pic was 2.5. as skinny necked as he is. If it is for sure the same deer as last yr and he is 3.5 yrs old youve got some serious problems with genetics or nutrition on your hunting grounds. I hunt in the overhunted and poor nutrition county of Broome and most of the 2.5 deer Ive shot there were between 130 and 150 lbs. He looks to barely tip the scales at 100. Shoot him and put him in the freezer.

[adk3006]

Shoot him, have him aged and we will all know for sure how old he is!!!

[First-light]

He actually looks older in the B/W picture. Yea pictures can be deceiving. The only thing I would add is I have seen so many 1.5 year old bucks with the same type of horns. You know there is a bear thread on the site that tells you the DEC aged the bear at 8.5 years old. It was only 200 lbs and looks real small in the picts. What more proof do you need, the DEC aged it.

Anything is possible-thanks for posting.

[nyantler]

Well ya'll must be smarter than me, I for one can't tell any 4 points apart from the others. I would be hard pressed to say for sure that a four point I saw this yr was the same one I saw last yr. I would also be hard pressed to say the deer in the 1st pic was 2.5. as skinny necked as he is. If it is for sure the same deer as last yr and he is 3.5 yrs old youve got some serious problems with genetics or nutrition on your hunting grounds. I hunt in the overhunted and poor nutrition county of Broome and most of the 2.5 deer Ive shot there were between 130 and 150 lbs. He looks to barely tip the scales at 100. Shoot him and put him in the freezer.

Actually that might even be more true.. its isn't even the same buck. I have seen groups of 4 pointers together and they all looked the same... be really hard telling a crotch horn from on year to the next.

He actually looks older in the B/W picture. Yea pictures can be deceiving. The only thing I would add is I have seen so many 1.5 year old bucks with the same type of horns. You know there is a bear thread on the site that tells you the DEC aged the bear at 8.5 years old. It was only 200 lbs and looks real small in the picts. What more proof do you need, the DEC aged it.

Anything is possible-thanks for posting.

The DEC also aged a buck for Tom Wheeler and told him his 160 class buck was 2.5 years old and when it was aged by tooth dissection it was 6.5... that is the only reliable aging tool... my new opinion is that the four pointer is not only NOT 3.5.. it isn't even the same buck.

[nyantler]

I think that buck has been snooping around my neck of the woods

[Steve7]

Here is my take for what it's worth. Below is a 4 pointer I shot in 09 and was aged at 3 1/2 by the DEC. I saw this deer the year before and he was still a 4 but smaller. I didn't want this deer breeding so he became table fare. In my opinion..that deer is 3 years old and will be good eating. You see him..drop him.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Here is my take for what it's worth. Below is a 4 pointer I shot in 09 and was aged at 3 1/2 by the DEC. I saw this deer the year before and he was still a 4 but smaller. I didn't want this deer breeding so he became table fare. In my opinion..that deer is 3 years old and will be good eating. You see him..drop him.

If that deer was a 3 1/2, he had already gone through 2 active breeding seasons. Dont fool yourself, you will NEVER be able to control genetics in the herd that roams your hunting area. Well, unless you are hunting inside a 10 foot fence.

Cool deer BTW.

I also think that the deer in the original post is a 2 1/2. Just my opinion though.

[cwhite]

I will concede that this could be a different buck, and if it is a different deer I would age him at 2 based off the picture as well. Reason I say he is he is the same one and a 3 year old is because I watched the deer in the second picture on several occasions and very close a couple times. I remember the unique rack he had. Now I am seeing a deer a year later with the same face, antlers (only a size or two larger) and about 30 pounds of body weight added. The pictures were captured in the same field, just different camera placement. Regardless, first chance I get we will have him up close and personal to judge. I will send the bottom jaw to a wildlife biologist for aging and post the age. I'll get adk3006 to verify it for all you skeptics.