So do you think NYS will expand the crossbow season

[Vince1]

Lots of people walked barefoot uphill in the snow each day to school. Deer back then were rare - deer now are relatively speaking, plentiful. And it's still not easy. Going off on an old man "in the old days" diatribe about technology might feel good, but really at the end of the day, I don't really look at someone's harvest and go "that's not as big of an accomplishment as Doc's yearling that he shot in his loin cloth after whittling his arrow, knapping his stone broadhead, chewing his sinew string into a usable form, and crafting an osage bow by basic hand implement."

Have only been shooting for 3 outa the 35 years i been on this earth and u are the first person i ever heard say they dont give a head nod of respect to trad shooters.

One day at my indoor range i was stackin arrows within 3 inches. Doesnt hapen all the time but i was doin good for a few sets keepin pace with compund shooters with no sight wnd got a few compliments and questions.

I took up the recurve and shootin off instinct for the challenge. I picked up the xbow and the compound because it doubles my 20 and under range.

In my opinion any trad kill is a great achievement because of the time. One MUST invest to stay sharp with the skill. Sorry but i just have to put yhat out there on that one.

As far as the technology being out there and using it im with u on that point.

But like all things we should learn and respect our history. And it was my old walk to school barefoot grandmother who made me understand that

[phade]

Have only been shooting for 3 outa the 35 years i been on this earth and u are the first person i ever heard say they dont give a head nod of respect to trad shooters.

One day at my indoor range i was stackin arrows within 3 inches. Doesnt hapen all the time but i was doin good for a few sets keepin pace with compund shooters with no sight wnd got a few compliments and questions.

I took up the recurve and shootin off instinct for the challenge. I picked up the xbow and the compound because it doubles my 20 and under range.

In my opinion any trad kill is a great achievement because of the time. One MUST invest to stay sharp with the skill. Sorry but i just have to put yhat out there on that one.

As far as the technology being out there and using it im with u on that point.

But like all things we should learn and respect our history. And it was my old walk to school barefoot grandmother who made me understand that

 

A nod of respect is a completely different topic. I give respect because that person accepts the challenge, not because one is perceived as harder...there is no social order in my book. That trad bowhunter puts on his pants the same way. Time is irrelevant to me - because time is not apples to apples for each person.

 

Me trying to compare hunting traditional with me hunting with a cam bow is different and one doesn't rank above or below the other. I simply adapt to the challenge or operating environment. 

Edited April 1, 2015 by phade

[Slaynbux]

what happened bela pick up his marbles and go home

[Vince1]

there is no social order in my book. That trad bowhunter puts on his pants the same way. Time is irrelevant to me - because time is not apples to apples for each person.

Me trying to compare hunting traditional with me hunting with a cam bow is different and one doesn't rank above or below the other. I simply adapt to the challenge or operating environment.

I agree here. I dont see any social order and i dont look at it like that myself. I just go by my experience with all three instruments in how long it took me. I just see it as a which was harder for me and that is rrcurve and crossbow easiest to group good with.

I dont think i ever said or implied one was better rank wise. If i did my bad. But ive heard guys puttin xbow guys down for huntin with it and think thats bs. Not everyone can put in the time to shoot a 200 pound longbow.

There all tools use what u like and what time alows u to perfect enough to make a quick kill

[phade]

I will say i value how a hunter approaches each challenge and if that hunter can meet the goals they set for themselves. My buddy is set on hunting traditional for first time, if he gets a doe, i would be ecstatic. Even if he went home empty, i know he learned.

[wolc123]

Congratulations on that shot Wooly.  How far was she?   What is the speed and poundage of your Horton?    Did your bolt pass thru and what type of broadhead did you use?   I was ok with my shot location on that young buck that your getting sick of seeing, but not so much with the bolt penetration of only 7-1/2".    I wont be taking another shot over 50 yards with that rig if I can help it.  When and if NY gives us a little more time in the fall I will probably upgrade to a 330 fps or so model which should give a clean pass thru at 60 yards.    Killing does was one of the biggest reasons I got a crossbow but unfortunately, none came into range for me last season.   

 

p.s. you are dead on in your assessment, I am a goofball and I would rather be lucky than good.   The more I pray and read the good book, the luckier I get.

Happy hunting and I am glad to see you have joined the crossbow fraternity.            

[The_Real_TCIII]

A nod of respect is a completely different topic. I give respect because that person accepts the challenge, not because one is perceived as harder...there is no social order in my book. That trad bowhunter puts on his pants the same way.

Yes but they are buckskin pants.

[Doc]

I started out traditional. I wasn't allowed down from the treestand in the yard the first day I ever touched a bow until I hit 3 of 5 arrows into a 2 liter soda bottle filled w/water at 10 yds. That stupid quiver on a string went up and down that ladder to refill more times than I care to admit. I didn't even handle a bow with a cam on it until after my second season well after learning how to shoot consistently trad. I am aware of the challenge that comes with it. It still doesn't change my mind.

 

Lots of people walked barefoot uphill in the snow each day to school. Deer back then were rare - deer now are relatively speaking, plentiful. And it's still not easy. Going off on an old man "in the old days" diatribe about technology might feel good, but really at the end of the day, I don't really look at someone's harvest and go "that's not as big of an accomplishment as Doc's yearling that he shot in his loin cloth after whittling his arrow, knapping his stone broadhead, chewing his sinew string into a usable form, and crafting an osage bow by basic hand implement."

 

There is alot to learn about history and from the tales of others, including the wisdom, no doubt. Eventually though, people grow wary of the constant "in my day reminders," once there is not as much to learn. Technology is here, here to stay, always has been, and always will be. You (in general, not you Doc) can complain about it, or try to say one method is higher than the other, but at the end of the day, it really doesn't freaking matter.

Perhaps it was just a little too long ago for you to really remember very clearly just how difficult it was to shoot recurves and straight bows consistently compared to modern compounds, but it does sound a bit disingenuous to be trying to tell people that the compound was not a step toward removing some of the challenge from bowhunting. I'm not sure exactly who you think you are talking to here, but I'm sure that there are a whole lot of people here who have shot both that simply are not going swallow that. Don't you sometimes wonder exactly why just about everyone shoots a compound now? ...... lol. And if you weren't so busy trying to spin away from my original point, you would understand that the truth about the evolution of archery equipment does matter relative to the point I was making about the natural tendency for people to remove challenge from a modern-day hunting activity that was born out of the desire of a minority of hunters to add challenge into their hunting.

 

Oh, and by the way just to get the story straight, my first hunting bow was a hand made longbow made from a hickory stave cut off our farm back when I was about 11 years old. And it did figure in to the demise of about a dozen pigeons up in the barn.....Ha-ha-ha.

[phade]

Perhaps it was just a little too long ago for you to really remember very clearly just how difficult it was to shoot recurves and straight bows consistently compared to modern compounds, but it does sound a bit disingenuous to be trying to tell people that the compound was not a step toward removing some of the challenge from bowhunting. I'm not sure exactly who you think you are talking to here, but I'm sure that there are a whole lot of people here who have shot both that simply are not going swallow that. Don't you sometimes wonder exactly why just about everyone shoots a compound now? ...... lol. And if you weren't so busy trying to spin away from my original point, you would understand that the truth about the evolution of archery equipment does matter relative to the point I was making about the natural tendency for people to remove challenge from a modern-day hunting activity that was born out of the desire of a minority of hunters to add challenge into their hunting.

Oh, and by the way just to get the story straight, my first hunting bow was a hand made longbow made from a hickory stave cut off our farm back when I was about 11 years old. And it did figure in to the demise of about a dozen pigeons up in the barn.....Ha-ha-ha.

This post is exaclty what i was talking about. "who do you think you are...."

Diatribe.

You keep trying to push some sort of heirarchy or social order on a hunter based on a perceived challenge. That is hogwash. I adapt to whatever challenge I have to overcome based on a variety of factors and do not worry about any hierarchy or perception or social standing. If I pick up a stick bow, I do not once think about "woof, this is going to be harder than my cammed bow, better go make sure everyone knows I am in it for more of the challenge or I better get more respect because what I do is harder."

I simply get to shooting.

Edited April 2, 2015 by phade

[Doc]

I agree here. I dont see any social order and i dont look at it like that myself. I just go by my experience with all three instruments in how long it took me. I just see it as a which was harder for me and that is rrcurve and crossbow easiest to group good with.

I dont think i ever said or implied one was better rank wise. If i did my bad. But ive heard guys puttin xbow guys down for huntin with it and think thats bs. Not everyone can put in the time to shoot a 200 pound longbow.

There all tools use what u like and what time alows u to perfect enough to make a quick kill

Yeah, I don't have a clue where this "ranking" thing came from. That is not anything that I think about when it comes to hunting. My competition in hunting is not with other hunters, but rather with the animal I am hunting. But there are people who like to handicap themselves with equipment to "up" the challenge level for themselves. In fact that is what was behind the original establishment of bow season. And ever since the establishment of that season, people have been diligently trying to remove that element of challenge. I'm not sure why that would be that much of a controversial statement, but some will find controversy even where there is none. .....lol.

 

But anyway, this idea of "ranking" has absolutely nothing to do with anything I was talking about. I leave that kind of thinking to other people to deal with.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Yeah, I don't have a clue where this "ranking" thing came from. That is not anything that I think about when it comes to hunting. My competition in hunting is not with other hunters, but rather with the animal I am hunting. But there are people who like to handicap themselves with equipment to "up" the challenge level for themselves. In fact that is what was behind the original establishment of bow season. And ever since the establishment of that season, people have been diligently trying to remove that element of challenge. I'm not sure why that would be that much of a controversial statement, but some will find controversy even where there is none. .....lol.

 

But anyway, this idea of "ranking" has absolutely nothing to do with anything I was talking about. I leave that kind of thinking to other people to deal with.

I think thats where some call themselves hunters...Pick out a deer and hunt it until success or failure, Others called shooters..Pick out the first deer they see and shoot it. Some say just killing a deer is not hunting no matter where they stand but i would think in some low deer numbered areas that just finding any deer to shoot would be called hunting.

[phade]

I think thats where some call themselves hunters...Pick out a deer and hunt it until success or failure, Others called shooters..Pick out the first deer they see and shoot it. Some say just killing a deer is not hunting no matter where they stand but i would think in some low deer numbered areas that just finding any deer to shoot would be called hunting.

 

I think you are onto it. 

 

The degree of challenge is never really a topic that enters my mind. Some people view the weapon type as more than it is for others. I look at a bow or a gun as a tool. Whatever that tool is, I have to learn how to use it correctly, so the "challenge" aspect of it never really enters my thinking. It is a means to an end.

 

I really enjoy bowhunting, I really enjoy shooting my bow. There is nothing like that 15-30 minutes where I step into the backyard on a nice summer day and just shoot a few arrows after work. Nothing beats that first arrow meeting its mark.

 

BUT, if I didn't hunt, I likely would not shoot a bow regularly, and I probably wouldn't own one. Guns, I might own one or two because I feel like less of an American without them, but I certainly wouldn't have the kind of numbers I have now.

Edited April 2, 2015 by phade

[MACHINIST]

I understand what you are saying and agree with you to a point.The weapon is also a tool to me.I also love shooting my bow and do through the winter inside,3D spring summer and fall and hunt with my bow,but I also want the "spice" of trying new things.I feel that the crossbow is as capable/a touch more capable as a good archer with a compound.I don't take crazy long shots with my bow,I like to have them 25 give or take at the longest.There are to many factors in the woods working against the shooter to ensure that a great shot is performed.Small twigs that you cant see from your stand,buck fever,wind gust or a million other things can mess up a great day hunting if you wound a animal.Not that I am saying anything under 25 is a chip shot because when it comes to hunting any animal there is no such thing as a chip shot,but I feel the odds are better in my favor for getting the arrow where I want it to be.Gun hunting is no different,I don't like shooting very far either without a good rest and my composure as much as a hunter can have composure when buck fever starts your heart pounding.My longest shot on a deer was 220 yards(IIRC).I hit the deer low in the heart,still a very fatal shot but could have just wounded and not recovered him.I don't take those shots anymore because I know I'm not the right guy for it.Now at the range I can punch paper out to 400 no problem but that's paper and not a animal

[Doc]

I think that for me, the whole idea of challenge is the reason that I hunt. Otherwise I would simply go to the supermarket and get some nice choice cuts of beef. And there has to be some element of challenge that makes me enjoy bowhunting more than gun hunting. It is a limiting of hunting implement that causes the challenge level to go up. I know that it was the idea of taking on a more challenging way of hunting that got me into bowhunting.

[sweet old bill]

I do not think it will be expanded in to the archery season.

[The_Real_TCIII]

It's already got two weeks of it, and no need to take the archery course

[MACHINIST]

EDEITED FOR WRONG INFO

 

 

Each year you must complete the writen for in the regulations guide by the looks of it.

 

 

 

Required Crossbow Hunting Qualification & Safety Training

There are 3 options to choose from in order to complete the required crossbow qualification & safety training. All must accompany a NYS hunting license and in some cases a muzzleloading privilege:

• Option 1: Review the DEC online crossbow qualification training and complete the Crossbow Certificate of Qualification*.
• Option 2: Review the DEC crossbow qualification training and complete the Crossbow Certificate of Qualification* found in the2014-15 Hunting & Trapping Regulations Guide.
• Option 3: Complete a Hunter Education or Combination Education course to receive a Hunter Education Certificate of Qualification. Certificates must be dated on or after April 1, 2014 to meet crossbow qualification and safety training.
  *Note: The Crossbow Certificate of Qualification from 2012-2013 is no longer valid.

Edited April 4, 2015 by MACHINIST

[Four Season Whitetail's]

I think that for me, the whole idea of challenge is the reason that I hunt. Otherwise I would simply go to the supermarket and get some nice choice cuts of beef. And there has to be some element of challenge that makes me enjoy bowhunting more than gun hunting. It is a limiting of hunting implement that causes the challenge level to go up. I know that it was the idea of taking on a more challenging way of hunting that got me into bowhunting.

And for me at my stage of hunting life it is more the animal. I cant just sit in a tree and wait for something to walk by, shoot it and call it hunting any longer. I now need to find an animal or two to kill and then go.. Hunt Them..until i win or its a bust. Will i shoot a mature buck that fits the bill for me that i didnt know was there, you bet ya but to just go sit and wait without having a quarry or two just does not do it for me any longer.

Like i said before, I am sure in some areas just finding a deer, any deer, would be like the same as having a single buck or two picked out.

[deerpassion]

I agree with Grampy if included in archery then a certification should be a requirement.

Agreed, if your gonna play in bow season no reason not to have a bow hunters cert.. I would also like to see the cert. for those who only hunt gun season and are going to use it...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bowshotmuzzleloader]

Everybody has different goals every year one of mine is to take a deer with my bow , buck or doe... Second is to take one with my gun, same as bow buck or doe mature or not .. Sometimes they are mature , sometimes they are not.. Some of my fondest memories are not the size of the rack or doe but the experience or adventure or company I was with.. The Crossbow is a great tool, I have a lot of spots where I hunt that are very difficult to bow hunt, that the crossbow makes a great tool... I will always use the bow until I can't physically use it , but like being able to use the crossbow now when it's alowed.. If it's becomes all game with the crossbow so be it, I just really believe people think these weapons are a small gun for some reason... JHMO

[Doc]

And for me at my stage of hunting life it is more the animal. I cant just sit in a tree and wait for something to walk by, shoot it and call it hunting any longer. I now need to find an animal or two to kill and then go.. Hunt Them..until i win or its a bust. Will i shoot a mature buck that fits the bill for me that i didnt know was there, you bet ya but to just go sit and wait without having a quarry or two just does not do it for me any longer.

Like i said before, I am sure in some areas just finding a deer, any deer, would be like the same as having a single buck or two picked out.

Sure, we all have our own ways of providing that challenge, but I suspect that for most hunters, they have some level of expected challenge that drives them to pit their skills and wit against the critters. And like you, everybody probably has that ever-changing set of challenges, usually getting more and more restrictive as time goes on.

[Doc]

Some of my fondest memories are not the size of the rack or doe but the experience or adventure or company I was with.

Ain't that the truth. The most prized antler mount that I own is that devil-deer spike that was my first bow killed deer. Looks a bit silly along-side the other mounts and has brought a lot of jokes and snide remarks until I explain the significance of that deer. So many years ago, and yet I can remember every minute and detail of that kill. Stands way out above every kill since.

[dbHunterNY]

Congratulations on that shot Wooly.  How far was she?   What is the speed and poundage of your Horton?    Did your bolt pass thru and what type of broadhead did you use?   I was ok with my shot location on that young buck that your getting sick of seeing, but not so much with the bolt penetration of only 7-1/2".    I wont be taking another shot over 50 yards with that rig if I can help it.  When and if NY gives us a little more time in the fall I will probably upgrade to a 330 fps or so model which should give a clean pass thru at 60 yards.    Killing does was one of the biggest reasons I got a crossbow but unfortunately, none came into range for me last season.   

 

p.s. you are dead on in your assessment, I am a goofball and I would rather be lucky than good.   The more I pray and read the good book, the luckier I get.

Happy hunting and I am glad to see you have joined the crossbow fraternity.            

 

a lot can happen in 60 yards.  anyway look into heavier bolts and if you're using an expandable, switch to a smaller diameter cut on contact head or close to it head.  otherwise the added 30-50 fps will do you limited good and only make a louder smack sound when it hits.  KE stats for a bow and penetration a setup gets are two different things.  A lot like having luck on their side but it's not often there, which is why it's called hunting.  Best of luck with the crossbow and getting more under your belt.

[dbHunterNY]

And for me at my stage of hunting life it is more the animal. I cant just sit in a tree and wait for something to walk by, shoot it and call it hunting any longer. I now need to find an animal or two to kill and then go.. Hunt Them..until i win or its a bust. Will i shoot a mature buck that fits the bill for me that i didnt know was there, you bet ya but to just go sit and wait without having a quarry or two just does not do it for me any longer.

Like i said before, I am sure in some areas just finding a deer, any deer, would be like the same as having a single buck or two picked out.

 

my greatest bowhunting success was going to a public land swamp up north.  I shot a younger buck and thought about passing it because it was young.  However, I'd never hunted or been there before.  Scouted my way in, picked a spot based on recent sign left, wind, and figuring in a nearby private land food source I checked from the truck driving the adjacent roads.  I shot the buck at 12 yards, a few miles in.  No idea what might have been there but I figured that buck would be and was an accomplishment, reason for taking the shot.  it made for some great stories that night with the recovery among my cousins and brother that were also hunting there for the first time; some getting lost, some falling in waist deep creeks, and figuring out how to get the buck out.

[Borngeechee]

Is it just me or weren't crossbows around way before guns were even thought of and around barely less than bows? People are acting if crossbows are some new magical death dart from the Gods. It's a tool and that's all it is. Can you take a deer with a .270? Yep. Do is the guy with the 300 win mag wrong to kill a deer with an obviously more powerful weapon? Nope. Hunting is hunting. Use what you enjoy using within the law. Hell if someone wanted to use a Barret 50 and I didn't have to worry about it still going for a mile after it hit the deer, I wouldn't care.