How dumb can people be?

[Splitear]

56 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Now that I realize how young you are, I can see why you think the way you do.

Providing an option is fine, but not at the expense of others.  Your real world is headed for a fall, because that type of thinking doesn't work.  It has never worked in any society in the history of the world.  If you believe it did, tell me when and where.

I feel entitled to what I have worked hard for my whole life and feel outrage when the govt takes it from me at my expense.

I feel sorry for people in a hard spot, but I can also see how they wound up there.  One can work hard all their lives and still wind up in a bind.  That's because there is a difference between working hard, and working smart.  

The path one chooses in life is their choice, and any consequences that result from it are theirs, and only theirs to bear.  Nobody is entitled to the profits of anyone' else's labor.  That's theft,  plain and simple.

Necessities are NOT rights!  Individual responsibility is what drives success.

People take risks trying to better their lives and wind up bankrupt.  They pick themselves up and start over with the skill sets they have to work with.  They take responsibility for their situation.  They don't ask the government to take from others to help them out. And if anyone does, they are supporting a corrupt political establishment. Bankruptcy from medical bills is not the end of the world.  People live on afterwards and do well.  But the smart thing to do is never allow yourself to be in a position to go bankrupt because of medical bills.

Besides. the entire medical situation is what it is because the govt has been fugging it up for decades.  Biden has been a part of that destruction his entire political career.  He's going to push all sorts of income redistribution on the productive taxpaying citizens in America and the people who don't deserve it will continue to vote for leftists to keep the theft going.

By the time you're my age, you will come to realize, all of your hard work is being taxed to buy the votes of fools who keep leftists in power.  It's at that time, you will become a Conservative.

 

You’re right, one of these days when I’m old, I’ll look back and think “I could’ve gotten so much more from my life if my parents and poor people like them would have just made “smart choices” like I did. My sunset years could be so much more fulfilling if only people who worked hard, but were not as smart as me just paid the price for their stupid decisions.”

I stand by my assessment that you are out of touch with the real world, even though you are old enough to know better. 

Edited November 26, 2020 by Splitear

[Grouse]

You have not lived long enough to have experienced what can happen to you when you allow the government to take away your freedoms and liberties.  You still have the youthful ideals that seem great when you're young, and stupid when you gain wisdom. No doubt your education was designed to indoctrinate you into this way of thinking.

Society must allow freedom and make individuals accept responsibility for it to thrive.  Not all taxes are oppressive.  I'll pay for the things I use.  Taxing me to pay for the things I don't use so others can use them, is Socialism.  BTW, many of the publicly supported items you mentioned do not benefit anyone other than the people subsidized, and that buys their votes.  Do you want to pay to grow more corn for ethanol in your gas, which makes corn more expensive for everyone and only serves to lower your gas mileage, putting out the same amount of pollution per mile as non ethanol gas?  It's perfect example of expensive government stupidity.

Leftists believe in Collectivism, where what is good for all, can be bad for some.  That is tyranny against the individual.  

Choose to be part of the herd if you wish, but someday you will wish you were a free individual.

 

[phantom]

9 minutes ago, Splitear said:

You’re not even having the same conversation, so I don’t even have a response for you. 

what happens is if healthcare was  all free  the quality of healthcare would be way down it would be free shit healthcare not free good healthcare for all  hope you  know .  They have free healthcare in Mexico and they are all running here to get away from it  you want to go backwards  

Edited November 26, 2020 by phantom

[Grouse]

Plus, the elites will always be able to move to the front of the line while the rest of us wait for months, or don't get the treatment we need because of rationing.  It is only then the people who swallowed the promises will realize they were lied to.

P.S.  There will be fewer Doctors as well.  Most will not work in any sort of government controlled healthcare environment.  The ACA caused many doctors to retire.

 

Edited November 26, 2020 by Grouse

[Splitear]

2 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Plus, the elites will always be able to move to the front of the line while the rest of us wait for months, or don't get the treatment we need because of rationing.  It is only then the people who swallowed the promises will realize they were lied to.

Wait, so I’m confused. When you get old, are the stupid poor people the cause of your problems, or do blame your problems on the government? Wait, maybe it’s the elites who have made smart decisions so that they can afford all of this stuff... There are just so many people to blame! Really though, this is really helpful stuff, I’m sure it will come in handy after I’ve lived long enough. 

Edited November 26, 2020 by Splitear

[Grouse]

6 minutes ago, Splitear said:

Wait, so I’m confused. When you get old, are the stupid poor people the cause of your problems, or do blame your problems on the government? Wait, maybe it’s the elites who have made smart decisions so that they can afford all of this stuff... There are just so many people to blame! Really though, this is really helpful stuff, I’m sure it will come in handy after I’ve lived long enough. 

You won't need to get old to have it happen to you.  The people in positions of power, and those with enough money to bribe them, will always be taken care of at the expense of everyone else.  The elite's have made "smart" decisions based on the corruption they have propagated.  When government controls all healthcare, the corruption in healthcare will increase exponentially. 

Laugh while you can.

P.S. Study any country with government run healthcare and see if I'm wrong.

Edited November 26, 2020 by Grouse

[Splitear]

13 minutes ago, Grouse said:

No doubt your education was designed to indoctrinate you into this way of thinking  

I’m sure all of those liberal elites teaching High School in deep red Edwards County, Illinois were dead set on brainwashing me into a socialist. Or maybe it was the Professors of Agriculture at SIU trying to indoctrinate me. Maybe I need a steady stream of Fox, OANN, or NewsMax to cleanse me of my leftist idealism. Maybe when I get old I’ll have time to watch cable news more. 

[cachemoney]

13 minutes ago, phantom said:

what happens is if healthcare was  all free  the quality of healthcare would be way down it would be free shit healthcare not free good healthcare for all  hope you  know .  They have free healthcare in Mexico and they are all running here to get away from it  you want to go backwards  

I am curious if you have ever lived anywhere that has socialized medicine ?

In my limited experience while living in Germany, it was very good. Very clean facilities and very good care that wasn't followed with a bill charging me 15 bucks for a bandaid. 

 

[Grouse]

1 minute ago, Splitear said:

I’m sure all of those liberal elites teaching High School in deep red Edwards County, Illinois were dead set on brainwashing me into a socialist. Or maybe it was the Professors of Agriculture at SIU trying to indoctrinate me. Maybe I need a steady stream of Fox, OANN, or NewsMax to cleanse me of my leftist idealism. Maybe when I get old I’ll have time to watch cable news more. 

All teachers unions in America are majority leftist and support Democrats, because they bargain with them for higher pay and kick back high donations when they get raises.  They spew all sorts of Democrat talking points to their students all the time, hoping they will vote for Democrats when they come of age.  only the parents can correct that issue when they become aware of it, and often it is not possible because it's too late.  That's the reason for the vast increase in home schooling in the US today, not to mention the huge desire for charter schools and private schools.  Did your professors ever talk about politics at SIU?  if they did, they shouldn't have been.  It only serves to teach students what to think, and not how to think.

As far as TV goes.  I stopped watching cable TV years ago and network TV soon after.  I prefer to search info from expert sources online, and there are many credible one's to choose from.

You will come to understand what I'm saying soon enough, if Biden takes over.

BTW, how do you feel about having the student loans of others transferred to you with a huge increase in the national debt that will raise you taxes and increase inflation in the next few years?  Isn't it wonderful those colleges gave students idiotic degrees in weird areas that have no job opportunities in the real world?  Biden thinks it is.

[phantom]

32 minutes ago, Splitear said:

You’re right, one of these days when I’m old, I’ll look back and think “I could’ve gotten so much more from my life of my parents and poor people like them would have just made “smart choices” like I did. My sunset years could be so much more fulfilling if only people who worked hard, but were not as smart as me just paid the price for their stupid decisions.”

I stand by my assessment that you are out of touch with the real world, even though you are old enough to know better. 

The TRUTH About Universal Healthcare! (from a Canadian) - YouTube

[phantom]

8 minutes ago, cachemoney said:

I am curious if you have ever lived anywhere that has socialized medicine ?

In my limited experience while living in Germany, it was very good. Very clean facilities and very good care that wasn't followed with a bill charging me 15 bucks for a bandaid. 

 

The TRUTH About Universal Healthcare! (from a Canadian) - YouTube 

yea I have it sucks 

[Grouse]

6 minutes ago, cachemoney said:

I am curious if you have ever lived anywhere that has socialized medicine ?

In my limited experience while living in Germany, it was very good. Very clean facilities and very good care that wasn't followed with a bill charging me 15 bucks for a bandaid. 

And what tax rate do they force upon people from the beginning of their working lives until death?  I'll bet if all the years they paid for the "free" healthcare were added up, that band aid would be pretty expensive.  And how many people are not able to get the healthcare they need, like cancer treatment or a kidney transplant, because it's rationed or just denied by the government to people it doesn't think will benefit as much as others will?  When government controls healthcare, it controls the people.  that's a basic Marxist demand from one of Karl Marx's first books.

[The_Real_TCIII]

I do. I  finished reading “Promise Me Dad” and it made me like and respect him that much more. I’m just now reading another book about him “The Book of Joe” by Jeff Wilser, and again, I like him more the more I learn about his life and career. 
I’m not looking to change your mind, since I’m assuming you don’t like him, but saying “No one likes Biden” is an inaccurate generalization. 

One guy likes Biden.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Grouse]

How does anyone vote for a candidate without finding out what they plan to do to you when they are elected?

I don't mean what they promise to do for you, which they won't.  I mean what they plan to do TO you, which you won't like.  Did anyone question Biden about anything he plans to do to us?

Then again. Biden actually volunteered to take guns away, give illegals citizenship with welfare and food stamps and raise taxes, and people still voted for him.

 

Edited November 26, 2020 by Grouse

[phantom]

just want to add   people get suckerd  because in some of these   country's they have long lifespans but that is because of genetics   diet and lifestyle not because of a free healthcare  system . you go talk to those older people in those places  and you will find they never spent a day in a hospital in their  life's , you really  get sick over there they let you go, pass away  , don't kid  yourself. 

Edited November 26, 2020 by phantom

[Grouse]

[9jNYstarkOH]

As we can all see these socialist programs  do helped some people. But also hurt some people including my family. So the question is how can we help the people in need with out gutting the middle class which is what socialism leads to (in my opinion) and the direction we are headed (also in my opinion). I have known multiple people that grew up in communist Russia and they all say the same thing they did not strive for anything as they had nothing to strive for and they pretended to work as the government pretended to pay them. This is not the direction I would like to see America going and to raise my children in. But we do have to find some middle ground we will not get anywhere with out having difficult conversations  (like having a conversation with @Splitearthat even though the ACA has helped his family in a time of need it has screwed over my parents by them losing private insurance while allowing his parents to afford insurance) Now will this change his mind mostly likely not but all I can do is explain why biden was not the political for me and how these socialist policies have hurt me and my family and in all honesty will continue to. 

Edited November 26, 2020 by 9jNYstarkOH

[Grouse]

Biden's plans will make such stories very, very rare in the future.

Edited November 26, 2020 by Grouse

[Grouse]

[Grouse]

[Grouse]

[Grouse]

Biden wants to give unemployment benefits to illegals, put a $200 tax on every semi auto and large cap magazine you already own and allow lawsuits against gun makers that would find them liable for the criminal misuse of one of their guns, effectively putting them out of business with legal fees.

I ask again, how dumb can people be?

[left field]

Little messed up quoting Cain considering he died of covid.

I always thought this was interesting.

After Pushing Lies, Former Cigna Executive Praises Canada's Health Care System

Quote

MARTIN: So let's talk about your role in this. In one of your tweets, you say, "here's the truth. Our industry PR and lobbying group, AHIP, supplied my colleagues and me with cherry-picked data and anecdotes to make people think Canadians wait endlessly for their care. It's a lie. And I'll always regret the disservice I did to folks on both sides of the border," unquote. Did you know at the time these things were lies? Or is this something you subsequently learned?

POTTER: I was becoming concerned, as it was necessary for me to spread this misinformation, and it really began in 2006. And that was sort of when my crisis of conscience began, and it pertained to the premiere of Michael Moore's movie "Sicko." And part of our campaign to push back against that movie was to spread misinformation about Canada or use cherry-picked data and anecdotes. For example, AHIP sent me and my counterparts at other insurance companies a binder just as that movie was premiering with bullet points of things that we should say in our conversations with reporters and others about the Canadian system or the British or French system for that matter but, particularly, the Canadian system. These really were cherry-picked data points and was not in any way painting an accurate portrayal of the Canadian health care system.

MARTIN: What was that aha moment for you? Do you remember it?

POTTER: Oh, I sure do remember it. There were two or three. But the real aha moment for me came when I went back home to visit my family in east Tennessee, where I grew up. I just happened to read about something that was called a health care expedition that was being held at a county fairground close to where I grew up. And I'd never heard of it because I lived away from there for many years and just happened to be there that weekend. And it said people would be driving from hundreds of miles away to get care that was being provided at this county fairground over three days, and it was free. And it said people typically would spend two or three nights in their cars waiting to get in to get treated.

I went there out of curiosity. And when I got there, I just was absolutely stunned at what I saw. I just couldn't imagine that I was still in the United States. When I walked through the fairground gates, I saw people who were lined up by the hundreds waiting to get care, and it was truly an epiphany. I also realized that what I was doing for a living - I had to take some responsibility for that because I was perpetuating myths about the Canadian health care system, myths about this health care system in this country, spreading this information to protect profits for my company and for the industry. And I was a journalist in my first career, a newspaper reporter. And I realized, also, that what I was doing for a living was in many ways the exact opposite of what I tried to do as a reporter, which was to be accurate.

And I just for various reasons felt, gosh, I - what happened to me? I looked in the mirror at one point. I said, what happened to you? How did this happen? And I made a decision soon after that that I would have to find some other way to earn a living. And it wasn't too long after that that I did leave.

 

[Daveboone]

18 hours ago, cachemoney said:

I am curious if you have ever lived anywhere that has socialized medicine ?

In my limited experience while living in Germany, it was very good. Very clean facilities and very good care that wasn't followed with a bill charging me 15 bucks for a bandaid. 

 

Working in health care myself, I have had quite a bit of opportunity to talk with Germans about their system and Canadians about ours. No system is perfect, but especially the German model was created new from scratch post WW2, as was their entire economy and political system. it works, people like it. The Canadian system is a blend of the old (ours) and new, and is also a great improvement. The standard flat tax rate on all goods and services pays for it ,and no one goes without any thing, and you are free to have your own private insurance and go to private providers if you choose. Chronic care meds (ex.....insulin, DM care supplies, which cost us about 6500. a year) are absolutely free. The problem with our system is it dates back as old as our free enterprise system. It is like Microsoft ....patch job on patch job on patch job. 

 

[phantom]

4 hours ago, Daveboone said:

Working in health care myself, I have had quite a bit of opportunity to talk with Germans about their system and Canadians about ours. No system is perfect, but especially the German model was created new from scratch post WW2, as was their entire economy and political system. it works, people like it. The Canadian system is a blend of the old (ours) and new, and is also a great improvement. The standard flat tax rate on all goods and services pays for it ,and no one goes without any thing, and you are free to have your own private insurance and go to private providers if you choose. Chronic care meds (ex.....insulin, DM care supplies, which cost us about 6500. a year) are absolutely free. The problem with our system is it dates back as old as our free enterprise system. It is like Microsoft ....patch job on patch job on patch job. 

 

If that's all they know they like it you mean   if all  they know is shit  obviously   they  will like it until someone shows them   a better system ours anyway you cant  compare those smaller country's to this one  to begin  with .  They move here bud American's  don't move there  why do you think that is ?

same with Mexico  Public healthcare delivery. The state governments of Mexico also provide health services independently of those that are provided by the federal government programs. In most states, the state government has established free or subsidized healthcare to all of its citizens. The Secretariat of Health is the largest public healthcare institution,...

 don't kill the goose that laid the golden egg.

Edited November 27, 2020 by phantom