wolc123

I would say the Ruffed Grouse, but I will admit that my own personal experience is quite limited on the other two. Wild pheasants pretty much disappeared from our town in Western NY a few years prior to my getting old enough to hunt. They used to be the top game species in the 50's and 60's, far more popular than deer were then. I only ever shot at one, when I was 14 with my dad's old Browning sweet 16 and I missed it, never to flush another. My shots at Woodcock were also just one, but that was a hit and kill as the bird flushed straight up and sort of hovered for an easy shot with my grandpa's old side by side Stevens 16 ga. I cut my teeth on Grouse, or "partridge" as we always called them. On my first hunt at 14 years old, with my uncle and cousin, I fired 14 times at 10 birds with my Ithaca 37 16 ga, modified choke and didn't hit one. It seemed that they were always holed up in the thickest, nastiest cover and that they were just designed to get away from hunters with their erratic flight and explosive flushes. When I finally did manage to bring one down the next season, I could not believe how good they were to eat. Grouse is the only "white-meat" bird I ever had that tastes good to me, with that rich, nutty flavor. Turkey and chicken taste like cardboard in comparison. For that reason, ever since, I have taken every opportunity to hunt grouse that I could get. I have yet to get a limit on grouse, but have doubled on several occasions. My most memorable hunt was another with my dad's old Browning. On a hunt long ago, he and I were down to our friend's Southern-tier camp for the opening of deer season. It opened on Mondays back then, Sundays were off-limits, and we got to camp on Saturday. Myself and two young friends, about my own age, decided to check out our tree stands and do a little grouse hunting on Saturday afternoon. My buddies headed deep into a ravine where their stands were and I headed for an old overgrown apple orchard at the edge of the woods where I planned on hunting Monday. When I got there, I flushed a grouse. Just as it disappeared into the heavy cover, I pulled the trigger on the old Browning and dropped it with a load of 7-1/2's. When I went to pick it up, it flushed again (or so I thought), and I fired again with the same result. It turned out to be a second bird, so I ended up with two in the bag with two shots. There have been less grouse killed at that camp than deer, so all the old guys back at the cabin were quite surprised when they saw that both shots they heard had connected. One of the old fellas was a little perturbed because he thought the shots would run off the deer. He settled down a bit after we gave him a taste of that grouse however. They still talk about those two shots at that camp 30 some years later. In the years since then, I have killed a lot more deer than grouse. I can clearly remember every grouse, while some of the deer are a little hazy now, the does especially. For me, shooting deer is like shooting ducks in a barrel compared to shooting grouse. I would say the same thing about Woodcock. The jury is still out on the pheasants, but I do know I don't like eating them as much a grouse, so that takes away any incentive I might have to pursue them, the same as with wild turkeys. I have ate many kinds of North-American wild game, and hands down, ruffed grouse is my favorite. Lucky for them they are so tough to hunt.

I am cranking up the woodstove for all its worth. I hauled about a face-cord of split, seasoned ash onto the adjacent, covered, side porch yesterday. Right now, I have the main living space up over 80 degrees and the bedrooms in the lower 70's. The kids are huddled around the stove making crafts, wife watching TV and I am tying some buck-tail jigs. A couple packs of ground venison are thawing (wife is making stuffed cabbage, our favorite for dinner). After dinner, I will bundle up and clear the drifts from the driveways after letting the block-heater warm up the diesel tractor for a couple hours. If it were just about 10 degrees warmer and a little less windy outside, I would do some snowshoeing. Conditions are otherwise perfect for that with 3 to 4 ft of powdery snow in most areas. It has also been a little too cold for comfortable skating back on the pond over the last week or so, but the long range fore-cast looks warmer next week so hopefully those activities can resume for a while before we get the big melt-down.

3 legs hardly even slows them down. I can run faster on two however. If she looses another she is in trouble.

I agree that an archery education course should be mandatory to hunt with a crossbow. The way the NY law stands now, one could fill his tag(s) during the regular season without taking the course, but would need to have taken the course to hunt with one during last (legal) part of the archery season. Since very few hunters would opt to use a crossbow during the regular season, the number of "uneducated" shots should be minimal. That said however, there is a tremendous amount of misinformation out there concerning the crossbow and its effectiveness compared to conventional bows. Most of that implies that crossbow is approximately the same as a conventional bow. From my own personal experience with both a compound bow and a crossbow, over more than 30 years: I would rate the crossbow, using telescopic sights, and fired from a rest, as approximately 10 times more effective on deer, and 5 times more effective on targets, than a compound bow fired from a standing position. The effective range is about doubled, and the group sizes at all ranges is multiple times smaller (about 5X for me) with equivalent amounts of practice. Because the crossbow is so much more "lethal", than conventional archery equipment, the potential exists to greatly reduce the number of wounded and unrecovered deer during archery season. "String jump" probably causes more wounded deer during archery season than any other single factor and that is greatly reduced by eliminating the need to draw with the deer in close. That is a huge advantage for the crossbow. Couple that with no tiring while holding at full draw, waiting for the right shot, and there is no reason a deer should get wounded with a crossbow. Some mandatory education would certainly help realize that potential. Shot placement is still critical, and even though I have seen some pictures of powerful crossbow arrows penetrating shoulder blades at close range, such shots should never be taken intentionally.

I have a sort of love hate relationship with the coyote. To me, the venison from deer less than a year old is natures "perfect food" and it seems a shame that such food "fit for a king", should go "to the dogs". That is where the hate part comes in. I would bet that most of the pounds of venison that the coyotes actually consume comes from older, weak deer. Removing them is a good thing, so I got a little love for the coyote there. When the fawns are born, escape conditions are good and there is plenty of other coyote food around, but at the end of the rut, when the old bucks in particular are at their weakest, snow often hurts the deer's escape chances. I think that is where a lot of the hate comes in from deer hunters. I know there are many who are fixated on antlers and/or harvesting older bucks. I personally do not suffer from that condition, but rather I am fixated at harvesting the highest quality venison, and that comes from deer that are less than 3 years old. The "perfect" deer for me, from a quality and quantity standpoint is a 2-1/2 year old buck. After that I wouldn't care if the coyotes got all the bucks. I would personally rather take the young bucks than does because they taste just as good, are easier to butcher (less fat to trim), and killing them compared to a doe makes it easier to score the following season. The last few seasons, I have passed on numerous 1-1/2 yr bucks early in the respective seasons, so that I can get a crack at a 2-1/2. The quality is about the same here, but the quantity is way more on the 2-1/2. I have also been blessed with quite a few 6 month bucks over the years(one this past season) and they truly are in a class by themselves and "fit for a king" in taste. Most of my love for the coyote comes from the fact that they are such an efficient predator of that "feathered rat", the wild turkey. I can think of few foods that are lower on my personal preference list than wild turkey and feeding them to the dogs is ideal as far as I am concerned. Turkeys also hit my field-corn hard when their numbers get high and that is my biggest problem with them. Raccoons also hit it hard when they get out of control but at least they can be legally removed rather easily by trapping. I am certain that my partner the coyote helps out a bit with them masked bandits also. Man does not control the balance of Nature, but our creator does, and the coyote is just another of his tools to keep the balance.

Thanks for the spell check. That reminds me of a couple things that do seem a little better in some other states. The ladies are prettier in California on average by a wide margin, and there is definitely better food available for purchase in most of them other states. What you can kill and make yourself does not get any better than we have right here however. I never cared much for the sweets and usually skip "dessert".

I have been to almost all of the lower 48 and I would put NY well above all of them. No other state has the beautiful places that we have. I cant stand desert and all them shots of the grand canyon during last nights Super-bowl kept me turning away from the screen. Anywhere South of upper PA is just too damn hot in the summer for me. I look forward to all seasons in upstate NY, spring, summer, fall, and winter. California is a nice place to visit but I would never choose to live there. I certainly would not want to live in a Southern State where it was almost always uncomfortably hot outside in the summer. I also wouldn't want to live and hunt in a state that was inundated with wild hogs. Smallmouth bass rate right up there with whitetail deer with me and no other state can touch the fishing we have here for those. If winter gets to you, then before shipping out to "greener pastures", try taking up some winter sports. Skiing, Snowmobiling, Snow-shoeing, Ice-skating, Ice fishing, etc.. A wood-stove in the house helps a lot also. Making firewood in the winter can be fun. I even enjoy clearing snow out of the driveways. Having good equipment is a necessity for those two jobs however. When my job or family has me travel to those other states, I always look forward to coming home, and I take pity on those poor folks who have to live outside of upstate NY.

I was up a tree when I got that buck last year, but I did modify all of my tree stands with shooting rails, about 3 feet high. It is great to lay that x-bow on that rail, totally supported up front, and let them crosshairs (or red-dot in my case), settle in for a nice steady shot at longer range. I honestly feel a little sorry for them deer now, as they don't seem to have much chance against such a "lethal" weapon. The older I get (just turned 50), the less I like climbing trees. I also like hunting from ground blinds and have made 3 permanent ones on two different farms that I hunt. Anytime the weather is bad, that's where I hunt. None are high enough to stand up in with a regular bow, but all work great with a crossbow or gun. One of my blinds has a second "open" level, with a 3-ft high rail around, and I plan to add an "upper deck" to another one this year.

I use a foam "block" target and my 300 fps model drives the arrows about 3/4 thru. I have heard that a canvas bag full of rags makes a good crossbow target, and I will try that after my block gets a little more worn out and the arrows start going thru. I have a friend with a 380 fps crossbow who says the "bag of rags" works very well. Close shots are great, but last season I only had one deer under 40 yards during the short crossbow season. That was a little 4-point who snuck up within 15 yards while I was sound asleep in my blind (I had stayed out too late the night before). I was awakened by the sound of his footsteps and I managed to slowly lift the x-bow, but he caught the motion and took off without offering a shot. The significantly larger-bodied 6-point I took a few days later, on the last few minutes of the last day I could hunt, teased me with that long shot. He turned out to be about 9 yards further than I estimated, but the little 300 fps crossbow still got the job done. The arrow struck him about 10" below my point of aim, but I had picked the right "hair" to aim at, up high behind his shoulder. I hunt for meat not thrill, but the thrill was there when I heard that arrow "thump" and saw the big, bright red blotch on his armpit, indicating a heart hit, then heard him pile up a short ways into the brush. Even more when I walked up and saw him laying there, eyes wide open and tongue hanging out. More yet a few days later sinking my teeth into them tenderloins cooked medium rare. All of us in NY are "newbies" with the crossbow, but I have more confidence in that weapon than almost anything else I have hunted with. I cant wait to use it this season. Good luck with yours. There is absolutely no comparison on the effectiveness of these compared to conventional archery equipment. I would put mine at about 10 times more effective on live deer than my compound, and 5 times more effective on targets. Best of all is the time required for practice is about 1/100 of that I need with a compound. Truly the crossbow is a "wonder weapon" that has more than lived up to it's hype in my hands at least.

I am very thankful that God put man on top of the food-chain to do as we please with all the rest. I certainly wouldn't want to be in any of those lower slots.

Congrats on the purchase. After one season, my crossbow has greatly exceeded my expectations, both on the range and in the field. Too bad it took so long for NY to let us use them. Hopefully we will soon get the rest of archery season, as that would help me a ton in filling some doe tags, none of which I was able to last season. Thanks to tons of acorns last year, the does had gone nocturnal for the most part once crossbow finally opened. I only saw two all season, which were just out of range. Eliminating the need to draw, with the deer in close, should make the crossbow a super effective doe-killer. I always see does in groups, and getting a compound drawn with that many eyes that close is always difficult. We would have had to eat chicken, rather than venison tacos for dinner tonight, had I not been able to take a nice young buck with my crossbow last season. At almost 60 yards, he was way out of my compound bow range, but not too much of a stretch for my little 300 fps crossbow. That's probably right in the "sweet-spot" for your 400 fps model. My arrow penetration (8") was a little marginal at that range, but did get it all the way thru the heart.

Raccoons, Wild Turkeys, Wild Hogs, Opossums, Skunks, Rats, Red squirrels, Woodchucks, Moles, Mule deer, Antelope, and Porcupines. Take them all away in that order and I would be a happier camper. I could take or leave the coyotes, as they put a hurting on the turkeys and raccoons and I like that. I just wish they would leave the deer alone. At least they take more bucks than does, which minimizes overall population reduction. They can have them rutted out, old bucks, which are easy picking for them in early winter, having spent most of their energy chasing does. It is a shame that so many fawns, food that is "fit for a king", should go "to the dogs" however.

I am 6 ft, 200 lbs so no problem finding coveralls. Don't listen to the guys recommending the bibs & jacket. Coveralls are the way to go for real cold jobs like working on an open tractor clearing snow. Trust me, I just finished doing it. They are great for ice fishing in the wind also. I am sure you already know that however or you would have asked where to find bibs. My Father in law is a smaller guy too (lucky for me), and he works outside and in dairy barns all winter. He also cant find coveralls to fit, and my mother in law always modifies "regular size" ones for him. It usually only takes her 15 minutes or so on her heavy-duty sewing machine. He buys the regular ones by the dozen at some big warehouse down near Erie PA. He has been doing this for years, so I don't think good, heavy coveralls are readily available in small sizes, unless he is just buying the big ones to keep my mother in law busy. It works good for me, because when she gets sick of tailoring or runs out of thread, I can usually score a pair or two that fit me good.

Hunting at home, with a bow, or ML, I would target the doe first, with a center-lung shot. Here, in the NW part of the state, the local deer population is well above optimum. With a repeating rifle or shotgun, I would first target the shoulder blade of the doe, anchoring her on the spot, then go to the largest fawn, with a center-lung shot. I prefer to send them to deer-heaven (our families food supply) together if I have the tags and means do so quickly and cleanly. I average a button-buck every other year or so, and most are taken with this method, immediately or shortly after their mammas. There are no deer that are finer eating, especially the livers, than them 6 month old bucks and does. I do hunt one area where the local deer population is a usually a little under optimum (NW Adirondacks) several times a season. Up there, during the early archery season, or ML, I would certainly look to take the fawn first, especially if it was a buck-fawn. Usually I am in for a long, manual drag, so it is less work for me that way. I like to leave the does around up there, as they are the key to getting chances at them big mountain bucks, one of which I was finally able to score on this past season.

The main reason for low sightings during hunting season this past season was due to near record acorn production across the state. Most of the deer went completely nocturnal as soon as they started smelling hunters in the woods. Except for the 1-1/2 year old bucks, for a week or two in the rut, there was no reason at all to come out of hiding during the day when it was so easy to find all they could eat, in one little safe spot, at night. The acorns are gone now so the deer that "were gone" are everywhere now. Low antlerless harvest numbers from last season, coupled with a mild winter across much of the state, and normal acorns next season should result in well above average, maybe record harvest numbers this year. There will likely be about twice as many available targets next season as there was the last and I don't think the state would be making a mistake by doubling the number of antlerless permits they issue in many of the zones, or maybe letting us use the ones that we were not able to fill last season.

Back to the original question, If anyone hears about any further relaxation of NY's former hard stance against the x-bow please post ASAP. I need at least 6 months of regular practice, 20 - 40 shots/week with a compound, before I would feel comfortable taking a 30 yard shot at a deer with one of them. A half hour total is plenty for me to feel comfortable at 40 yards with my x-bow. I have yet to miss the bulls eye by much over an inch at that range or under anyhow. Is it not amazing how much tighter of a group you can hold from a rest with a telescopic sight than off-hand with open sights? Medical issues prevented me from any compound practice last spring and summer, but I am all healed up now, so I am ready to get back at it if I need to. If I don't hear anything by April 15, I will start shooting the compound again. My main concern is filling some doe tags, as I was not able to do any of that last year and had to settle for my 2 bucks (1 x-bow, 1 rifle). Except for the two young does that showed up at about 75 yards (+/- 20) to distract the buck in question here, the rest of the does and fawns vanished last season just when the crossbow became legal. Maybe that's because the white oaks started dropping acorns heavy then. The does and fawns are back in force now however. Were it not for the excellent brakes and light weight of my new car, I would have surely nailed one or two on the drive to work yesterday. They have cleaned up all of my remaining 3 acres of field-corn over the last couple weeks. It will just be a matter of time now before they start on the shrubs around the house. The only thing worse than pounding dents out of your fenders, watching your landscaping disappear over the winter, and holding onto unfilled antlerless tags, is doing it with an empty freezer. At least I don't have to worry about that one thanks to a little "range underestimation" coupled with some help from up above (I just had to throw that one in for jjb, and because its the truth). All I can do now is pray that the state loosens up and gives us them other 3-weeks this season, when 30 yard or under shots at antlerless deer should be plentiful. They would save me a lot of practice time if they did it before tax-day.

Venison is very important to our family. This past season, for the first time ever, I was able to do a real "apples to apples" comparison of 1/2, 1-1/2, 2-1/2, and 4-1/2+ buck venison. The button was struck by a car at the end of our driveway and I finished it with a knife. The 1-1/2 was my x-bow kill, the 2-1/2 was a "gift" from a friend during archery season, and the 4-1/2 + was my rifle kill. All, except the button died on their feet from the shot, or within seconds from massive heart/lung damage. The button probably lingered 5 minutes before I was able to end his suffering. I personally consumed the tenderloins from each, 3-4 days after the kills, all cooked the same (rare the way I like them) in a frying pan on the stove in olive oil. The button was about 50 lbs dressed, the 1-1/2 160 lb, the 2-1/2 200 lb, and the 4-1/2 + 225 lbs. The 3 younger bucks were all killed in a southern, Ag region of the state and the stomachs were all filled with corn. The old buck was taken in the NW Adirondacks and its stomach was loaded with white-oak acorns, mostly un-chewed due to well-worn teeth I suppose. The results of the "taste test" of the tenderloins were: 1) The drawn-out "road-kill" fawn was best by a wide margin, pretty much about the most tender, best tasting tenderloins I ever had. 2) Very little if any noticeable difference between the 1-1/2 and the 2-1/2. Due to the larger size I would definitely pass a 1-1/2 if I knew I would get a crack at a 2-1/2. Most years lately, I get them "cracks", so antler restrictions wouldn't hurt me too bad. To me, as a full blooded "meat hunter", a 2-1/2 year old buck is as good as it gets when you combine quantity of meat and quality. 3) The tenderloins from the old buck were definitely a bit "chewier", but still tasted good. Quantity of meat was only marginally more than the 2-1/2. The loss in meat "quality" with the old buck certainly had nothing to do with method of death, hanging temp, or cooking method as all 3 mature bucks were similar. The diet is a bit of an unknown however, as there is no corn within many miles of where that old buck lived. With a 3-point min per side AR, we would be eating the same as we are today (the 1-1/2 was a 6), but I would still vote against the AR's if I could. I want my freedom to apply my own AR's depending on where we are in the seasons and with the freezer. I have gone many seasons with no bucks and full freezers due to liberal doe tags. This is the first I remember where we were full with no does. I do prefer butchering bucks, due to less fat to trim on average, and the bucks taste just as good within each age class.

So how does pretending that a crossbow is no more effective than a compound help us get the rest of archery season? Any other ideas? I paced off that shot at 59 yards. Check out the arrow placement in the photo. Bottom line here is the man upstairs is the one who determines whether or not you make the shot, I know I ain't that good. Feel free to post any of your photos of shot results at "ethical" ranges, or maybe send in a photo of your little yellow tag if that's all you got. I am sorry if I have ruffled a few feathers here but I am enjoying the entertainment. Bring it on.

For me to take a shot at a deer, I need to know on average, within about 90% certainty, that I can recover the deer with a clean kill. I have never had enough sightings to wait for the 100% shots. Last season, I only had 4 bucks within range from the beginning of crossbow season until the end of ML, and not a single doe or fawn. Fortunately, I was able to connect on both bucks that I shot at, or it would be one long, hungry off-season. That was in a total of 37 morning and afternoon hunts. My % number goes a little lower near the end of the respective seasons (archery, gun, ML), mostly because my whole family loves venison. I judged the 60 yard shot (which I guessed at 50), to be about 80% on the last day I could fill my archery tag. We ate our first roast tonight from that corn-fed 6-point buck, and it was excellent. Far tastier than them little yellow tags it sounds like many of you 100%'rs might still be clinging to. If venison were not so darn good, I could maybe hold out for the better than 99.5% shot, but in 37 years of hunting, I only had one. That was at a doe, standing, looking at me, just 13 yards away, as I aimed my scoped, 12 gauge slug gun at the center of her rib-cage. It was not to be however, as the gun froze up due to the extreme cold conditions, and did not fire when I pulled the trigger. Just goes to show that there is no such thing as a 100% shot. Every hunter should know his limitations with every weapon, on that we all agree.

Would our chance for full inclusion be better if a crossbow was not really more effective than a compound? The problem is, the truth can not be suppressed, and it don't take long after you pick one up, before you realize how much more effective they truly are. Range at least double, group size (from a rest) well under 1/2 at all ranges compared to those made with vertical bow shots. No need to draw with deer in close. No fatigue from long hold. Telescopic sights. All that stuff adds up in favor of the crossbow. The one I got is not front heavy, and balances as good as my .22 carbine rifle for off-hand shots. If the state truly wants to reduce the deer herd in some areas, then they should strongly consider letting us use this 10X or so more effective weapon throughout archery season as most other states have done. You can keep drinking that "kool-aid" that says the crossbow is no different in effectiveness than a compound if you would like. Only problem is, it just don't match the facts.

Maybe some folks cant shoot any better with a crossbow than a compound but I certainly am not one of them. Cutbait says they are about equal in effectiveness. I have taken plenty of deer with a compound over 30 some years and would not consider a shot over 30 yards with one. 60 yards with a crossbow was a little longer than I estimated, but it still got the job done. With a slight upgrade, I would not hesitate to take that shot again. My 60 yarder was across an open field, at a distracted buck (focused on two does), that was in no position to "jump the string". I might not get a chance like that again, but I am very confident in the accuracy of my crossbow at that range, just a little concerned about penetration. 30 more fps and 15 more pounds of draw weight should take care of that. I have enough experience with deer and archery equipment to know when "string jump" is an issue and when it's not. Most, if not all "string jump", that I have experienced with a compound, was a result of the deer picking up the motion of the draw in their peripheral vision and changing to a state of extreme alert. Guess what folks - you don't need to draw the crossbow with the deer in close. That, more than anything is what makes the crossbow so much more effective than the compound on "live" targets. They never know what hits them until it is too late, without that little visual warning like they always get when you draw your compound. If they are not alert, they can't instantly react to the sound of the bow's energy release. Most crossbow shots are taken from a rest using telescopic sights. Think about how that compares to taking shots with a compound from a standing position. Its not fair. What chance does the poor deer have? The less he has the better as far as I am concerned. I want him dead and in my freezer. If you want to give the deer a chance, stick with the compound, or maybe even a recurve or longbow. Personally, I would rate my crossbow as at least 6 times more effective on deer than my compound, and 4 times more effective on fixed targets. Your results may vary.

You had me worried there Cutbait as I always have been a real stickler for the rules. When I bought the Recruit in April 2014, It was advertised as "18" wide. I just checked it with a scale, and the overall width, to the outside of the cables, wrapped around the pulleys is 18-1/18". The NY law says that the minimum width, undrawn, measured to the "Tips of the limbs" is 17". When I measured to the limb tips, I got 17-1/64", or legal by a very narrow margin. I fired it 40 - 50 times since I got it including practice & unloading, 1 shot at a grouse (miss), and 1 at a deer (hit), and it is very likely that it did not meet the width law with a new string. Just a little stretch, and "good to go" however. I have only shot it 4 times since killing my buck so I will still consider that a legal kill, even if I did push the range a little at 60 yards. I did not see any rules on maximum range, although I will limit future shots to 50 yards with that crossbow due to insufficient penetration by my own personal standards (I like a pass thru, and only got 7-1/4", enough to get the mechanical broadhead thru the heart, but not thru the body). I will definitely check the tip to tip width of the Raptor before I upgrade this fall. I know I can achieve the accuracy I need for 60 yard shots and I was hoping that one would deliver the penetration with that extra speed and poundage.

I know of several trophies that have fallen to newbies with almost no hunting knowledge. Those bucks didn't get big by "following" the rules and doing predictable things that are reported in magazines and internet forums. Old bucks have usually patterned the "real woodsmen", but the newbies are an unpredictable lot. Its the same way with fish. When I take my wife bass fishing she cant even bait her own hook but nearly always hooks the largest fish. I always catch more however.

I bought an entry-level (Barnett Recruit - $250 from Amazon) last April and it exceeded my expectations in many areas. It arrived in the mail in about a week and was simple to assemble. It came with a quiver, rope cocking device, three arrows with 100 gr field tips, and a red-dot type sight, with three dots that could be changed red or green at various light intensities. My only complaint with the thing is that the intensity level / on-off knob on the sight is tough to turn. It is very easy, and responsive to adjust however, unlike some of my expensive rifle scopes. I switched to 125 gr field tips, and about 3/4 turn vertical adjustment up was required, that's it. It shot flat from 10 to 30 yards with all groups under a quarter's size, all using the top dot. At 40 yards, it was about 3" low with the top dot and group size was about 2". These shots were all from a rest. I was very impressed with how flat this thing shot compared to my compound, especially given that it was just a 135 lb draw, 300 fps model. On the range, I tried the first shots at 30 and 40 yards with the middle dot, but they always went high (about 6" at 30 and 3" at 40). While hunting last season, I only had one buck (small body 4 pt), within range, no does. Unfortunately I was asleep in my blind and when I awoke to the sound of his footsteps 15 yards away, he was looking straight at me and the x-bow was on the ground. I lifted it up in "slow motion", but when it got above my rest he took off and I never got a shot. That turned out to be bad news for his bigger brother (6 pt) a couple days later on the last day I could hunt during archery season. The 6 point never got within range, but he stood broadside at 50 yards (my estimate) tempting me to take the shot. I figured I had a 75% or better chance (that's my number on the last day), so I decided to take the shot. I had some idea what would happen with the middle dot from my work on the range, so I held for a high lung shot and squeezed the trigger. I heard the tel-tale thump as the arrow found its mark, about 10" below my point of aim, and straight thru the heart. Penetration was a somewhat dismal 7-1/4", but the buck only made it 40 yards due to the location of the hit. I used a three blade mechanical broadhead. It looked like someone emptied a can of red spray-paint on the buck's armpit as he ran off and crashed down. When I paced the range to where the the buck had stood, it was 60 yards, or a little longer than I had guessed, hence the low strike. left-right was right on the mark. It looks to me like that middle dot on the Recruit is for 50 yards as I thought, and the bottom dot must be for 60. I will find out for sure this year before hunting. I was not thrilled with the penetration at 60 yards however, and I will likely fork over another hundred or so for a Barnett Raptor (next model up 150 lb, 330 fps). That should be a legit 60 yard x-bow. The Recruit is very light (6 lb), narrow (18" undrawn), and well balanced. It actually handles and points as easy offhand as my Ruger 10/22 carbine. The Raptor is just a hair heavier and same width. Build quality seems to be very good. It is unreal how much more effective these things are than a compound. All that talk about them being similar in effectiveness is BS (have you ever compared the accuracy shooting a rifle from a rest to offhand?). In my own hands, I would rate the x-bow as at least 6 times more effective on deer and 4 times as effective on targets as a compound. I actually feel sorry for the deer. My favorite thing about them is how much time they save me by almost eliminating the need to practice compared to a compound. I am not retired, and have a family, and farm to take care of so my time is very valuable. I probably wont pick up a compound again after my experience with the crossbows. Good luck with your purchase. The only thing we need now is full inclusion for all of archery season. I know I could fill all my doe tags if we had that.

I have a slight preference for bucks because they are easier to butcher due to less fat to trim, and I like saving the buck horns to remind me of the successful hunts. I have no problem shooting does if the local deer population is above optimum, which it has been in most areas I have hunted in Western NY over the last 20 years. Meat is the main reason I hunt, so I would continue to hunt as long as it was legal. Most of the venison our family has consumed over the last 15 years, since they loosened up a bit on the DMP permits, has been does. I filled both my buck tags last season, plus we received (2) "gift" bucks, so all the deer we will be eating until next season will bucks for the first time I can remember. We might be sick of "buck-meat" by next season so the doe-only pipe dream might be a good thing.