NOT HAPPY AT ALL

[Five Seasons]

Btw, there have been studies that show a shotgun slug has the potential to go further than a rifle bullet after it strikes something. Not sure why rifles are any more concern than shotguns as long as you are making safe shots (some type of backstop, no skyline shots, safe direction, etc).

please link to said study because i call BS

[WNYBuckHunter]

Cracker, what did I say to offend you? Im speaking about what the laws are, what a safe backstop is, etc.

Honestly, I dont give a damn what other people think about me for being a hunter. I may be a little skeptical about things, especially this subject, as I have had issues at my fathers property with one of the neighbors. His house is well over 500 feet away, not even close to any direction in which I shoot from my stand, I have never set foot on his property, and I have permission from all of the other landowners for recovery rights, etc. Its an agricultural area with large fields, etc, but this guy goes out of his way to be an a-hole because he doesnt like hunting. Hes told me straight to my face that he hates deer hunting. Well F him, Im not doing anything illegal, so he doesnt have a leg to stand on anyway. If I wanted to be a real jerk, Id put every gut pile right on the corner of my fathers property as close to his house as I could. I dont though,. I just mind my own business and ignore the dope unless he forces the issue.

[WNYBuckHunter]

please link to said study because i call BS

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=37208

http://www.buckmasters.com/the-slug-gun-ricochet-factor.aspx

http://tribune-democrat.com/local/x519139106/Hunting-study-Shotguns-no-safer-than-rifles?keyword=topstory

How many other links to the study do you want?

[Five Seasons]

http://www.m4carbine...ead.php?t=37208

http://www.buckmaste...het-factor.aspx

http://tribune-democ...eyword=topstory

How many other links to the study do you want?

pshhh ricochet... please... You know very well that's not a concern in 98% of areas

[WNYBuckHunter]

Seems like it is in this thread.

[Doc]

please link to said study because i call BS

http://lbfc.legis.st...gun_webpost.pdf

Here is one of the links to the study. However, let's try not to hijack the thread. If you want to dispute this study, please start another thread.

[the blur]

reckless and endangerment. The decision is up to the cop.

[nyantler]

Come on Joe, you have more sense than taking on an extreme opinion like that. There are plenty of neighborhoods directly adjacent to open land, etc.

Bottom line here is that none of us know what the distances between the houses and what the layout of everything really is.

I think you know what I mean... and so does everyone else. Anyone hunting where I can see him from my back window is too close in my opinion... there are millions of acres to hunt in NYS and nobody should have to encounter a hunter out the back door of their home. Especially if he has "other places to hunt". There are some out there that think that hunting 501 feet from my back door is okay.. it may be legal but it certainly is not okay in my book. With a bow okay.. with a gun.. absolutely not!

[nyantler]

I've read about the one study, and I have read a few rebuttals to it. But primarily I have seen plenty of evidence that not all hunters shoot in safe directions, and as I have pointed out, backstops are not often required by all or even very many hunters. All hunters simply are not responsible.

However getting back to the original thread, rifle or shotgun, I have to agree with nyantler ..... what the heck reason does anyone have for plagueing a neighborhood with any kind of close-in shooting? Just because it is legal? To me, a little consideration for the residents is in order even if you totally ignore the safety implications.

Exactly Doc... How am I to know if this particular hunter isn't one of the many that aren't safe? I don't.. and no hunter should take the chance when it comes to the safety of others in the area..period

[erussell]

If were talking bow / crossbow from a tree stand then I dont see a problem. But to use a gun that close to house's shows a severe lack of comon sense and disregard for other peoples safety IMHO. You dont have a clue where that bullet is going after it go's through a deer. That bullet could go left, right up, down or It could come right back at you if it hits something at the right angle with enough energy left. I probably would have had a hard time not running him down and wrapping his gun around his stupid pencil neck.

[SteveB]

A ricochet can't cause injury or kill?

[phade]

Ricochets kill just as easily.

[jjb4900]

I've got a few spots that are just over 500' away from a house or two, I actually checked with my rangefinder to make sure........should I not hunt these spots because someone may see me and not like it? I don't think so........if the hunter in the original post is actually 500' away from your house and does have permission from the houses he's closer too, and is making sure of his backstop and not shooting recklessly, can you really tell him he can't hunt there? all you can really tell him is to stay off your property.....if he is shooting too close to the other houses without permission and is shooting recklessly, report him before a tragedy happens......and if it were me, I'd keep my kids inside if this guy is shooting anywhere near where they play.

[jjb4900]

and knowing your surroundings and what may be in your line of fire is much more important than the 500' rule as far as safety goes.........

[Five Seasons]

A ricochet can't cause injury or kill?

Ricochets kill just as easily.

they sure can kill just as easy, and no i dont believe they kill "just as easy".

[WNYBuckHunter]

they sure can kill just as easy, and no i dont believe they kill "just as easy".

Wait, which one is it?

[Five Seasons]

ha. I meant that they can kill, but not just as easy. that's what you get for typing before coffee.

[phade]

ha. I meant that they can kill, but not just as easy. that's what you get for typing before coffee.

Wow....some people.

Just as easy....a bad riccochet kills just as easy. Doesn't matter if it loses energy, fragments, etc. A piece of metal flying several hundred feet per second up to several thousand feet per second...will wreck havoc on a human body.

That's like saying getting hit by a train doesn't kill as easy as getting hit by a speeding car. Both are deadly. Beyond that, there's not discussion...because both people are dead.

[Five Seasons]

ugh it's all lost on you. "just as easy" was meant in reference to the probability of a ricochet killing someone vs a stray bullet fired into a field or over a hill, not the ability of it to kill. I'm not sure there could ever be an accurate study to prove which is more likely to hit a human but I cant image a ricochet which can ricochet into the ground, backwards or into the sky on an almost infinite number of vectors would have a greater probability than an uninterrupted bullet on a straight trajectory.

Edited November 29, 2012 by Belo

[phade]

ugh it's all lost on you. "just as easy" was meant in reference to the probability of a ricochet killing someone vs a stray bullet fired into a field or over a hill, not the ability of it to kill. I'm not sure there could ever be an accurate study to prove which is more likely to hit a human but I cant image a ricochet which can ricochet into the ground, backwards or into the sky on an almost infinite number of vectors would have a greater probability than an uninterrupted bullet on a straight trajectory.

Dude, all you have to do is look at the news....riccochets are the ones that get press.

Remember the baby a few years back that got hit by a slug riccochet that went into a house?

How about the trailer that was shot by a riccochet in Wayne County (Arcadia) a few years back, 2009 or so?

An uninterrupted bullet is most often (MOST OFTEN) shot in a safe direction by most sportsmen. It's what happens after it meets an object that becomes uncontrollable - and is the REAL risk on non-hunting people from hunter shootings. Thus, tracing this back to the point of the thread - that's where the real danger lies here. You are discounting the hunter in your thought process.

I hunt small parcels - if the guy is breaking the law, then it's a black and white issue. If not, nothing can be forced and the hunter is hunting by the law.

Edited November 29, 2012 by phade

[13BVET]

Wow. This whole thing reminds me of Dutchess County-especially Southern Dutchess, where development has wiped everything out. Anyone who used to hunt Southern Dutchess knows what I'm talking about.

Here, we have had tons of people from down below, who wanted to build their "dream home" in the "country". Well-guess what-that "country" has been wiped out. What used to be beautiful rural areas, are now overwhelming developments of $700,000 & up homes. Hunting is virtually impossible, because you can't get 500' from all these damned developments. That is why, at one time, I supported the 150' rule for bow.

With this development, of course, came all the anti hunters. So, even if you could manage to get 500' away, there was a high chance the cops would be called on you.

This has also had a huge impact on a lot of the gun clubs that have been here for ages. These houses, in a hell of a lot of instances, were built within 500' of the clubs. Naturally, when people shoot, the neighbors complain. Should the clubs just uproot themselves, or stop shooting because these jackasses built within 500' of a club that was there for almost 100 years?

The locals, who had hunted-a lot of them gave up. A lot of them, including myself, are also sick and tired of having to change where I hunt, how I hunt, and every damned thing else, because some friggin idiot moves up here that wants that $700,000 dream home.

I've lost 16 places to hunt, because of these "dream home" builders. I don't have, and, quite frankly, can't afford to travel to that 1 million acres, that is over 250 miles from me. There are far more deer here to begin with-just no way to hunt them anymore. Thanks to the over development of this area!

[jjb4900]

Wow. This whole thing reminds me of Dutchess County-especially Southern Dutchess, where development has wiped everything out. Anyone who used to hunt Southern Dutchess knows what I'm talking about.

Here, we have had tons of people from down below, who wanted to build their "dream home" in the "country". Well-guess what-that "country" has been wiped out. What used to be beautiful rural areas, are now overwhelming developments of $700,000 & up homes. Hunting is virtually impossible, because you can't get 500' from all these damned developments. That is why, at one time, I supported the 150' rule for bow.

With this development, of course, came all the anti hunters. So, even if you could manage to get 500' away, there was a high chance the cops would be called on you.

This has also had a huge impact on a lot of the gun clubs that have been here for ages. These houses, in a hell of a lot of instances, were built within 500' of the clubs. Naturally, when people shoot, the neighbors complain. Should the clubs just uproot themselves, or stop shooting because these jackasses built within 500' of a club that was there for almost 100 years?

The locals, who had hunted-a lot of them gave up. A lot of them, including myself, are also sick and tired of having to change where I hunt, how I hunt, and every damned thing else, because some friggin idiot moves up here that wants that $700,000 dream home.

I've lost 16 places to hunt, because of these "dream home" builders. I don't have, and, quite frankly, can't afford to travel to that 1 million acres, that is over 250 miles from me. There are far more deer here to begin with-just no way to hunt them anymore. Thanks to the over development of this area!

that's one of the reason's I'm thrilled that NYC DEP is buying up loads of property around where I hunt and allowing hunting access to it........it's not making the real estate broker's too happy, but I could care less.

[tughillhunter]

ha. I meant that they can kill, but not just as easy. that's what you get for typing before coffee.

the point is, they still can kill. period.

[growalot]

I have to say....if the clubs were there for a hundred years...THEY SHOULD HAVE HAD THE BRAINS.... TO PURCHASE SO THEY WOULD FIT INTO THE LONG STANDING 500' RULE...

Just saying...it's not as if they did not see the possibilities of land development...

[13BVET]

I have to say....if the clubs were there for a hundred years...THEY SHOULD HAVE HAD THE BRAINS.... TO PURCHASE SO THEY WOULD FIT INTO THE LONG STANDING 500' RULE...

Just saying...it's not as if they did not see the possibilities of land development...

It doesn't matter if their 500', for that matter. These idiots will still complain. The point is, the world shouldn't have to alter their lives just to appease you. A lot of these clubs are "grandfathered" in, but, because of the excessive development, the taxes have gone through the roof. This has forced some clubs to have to sell some land to keep up with the taxes. The problem here, is that the politicians have their heads so far up the developers a$$e$, that they can't see daylight. They also cater to "outsiders" more than the local base. The outsiders have more money.