NY DEC: Southern Zone Deer Harvest Reports Up Slightly

[Dave]

Eddie, you are correct you must report both. If you were successful and also if you were unsuccessful.

Sorry for the confusion.

Dave

[jasons75]

Make the penalty $5 per un-reported tag. Bear and turkey permits should follow the same rules...... The penalty must be paid before your tags are issued......after the second warning fines should be uped and no sporting licenses issued for the 3rd year......fishing or hunting. Life timers thatviolate the reporting rules should have there licenses suspended or revoked. The life time license can be restored after a year.

Another idea.... You are only issued the number of tags that you reported the previous year. And only for the seasons that the tag was designated for (bow, reg ml etc...).

[G-Man]

why not do what other states do had have mandatory check stations that seal your deer so it can be processed no seal no deer cutting by a service(of course you could do the deer yourself) but that would take staff to man the stations...of course no $ for hiring in ny..so the state will spend thousands on a study to figure out how to estimate our deer herd population. Face it they don't want factual information just want to sell licences to fund the general fund. If only our monies from licences and robertson/pitman act went to fund our own game comission maybe then the state would manage our game properly.....

[WNYBuckHunter]

Doc, no one ever said ban anyone from hunting. I don't know where you got that from.

Dave

I was replying to WNYBuckhunter's suggestion as shown in my previous reply and copied here below:

Make it simple, you dont get your tags next year if you dont report back on each one this year.

It actually sounds like a pretty good idea, and puts some teeth in the law. However, I was trying to look at it the way the DEC might be viewing it. I know that the DEC is now aware of the "1 tag - 1 report" idea because I have sent them that suggestion numerous times, and at least once it was on an official questionairre that I placed in the hands of one of the DEC workers at a "state of the herd" DEC public meeting where they were soliciting such suggestions. But there is something about it that they don't seem to like. I was speculating that it might be the penalty part of the concept that they are afraid of. Just guessing.

No, I am still a firm believer in the concept, but I will be the first to admit that there are some details that have to be ironed out (by better minds than mine .... lol). The toughest of those details is the penalty part for non-compliance.

I dont know, its just what I think would be the most effective way to do it. I think that a small monetary fine would not do much good other than to bring in more money. It still doesnt get the reporting numbers in line. What you could do is make a hefty fee for people that dont report all of their tags by the time they buy their next license, say....double the price of a normal license... and Id be willing to bet that most people wont make the mistake, and those that did, wouldnt do it again. Its like poaching, why bother having the law if you dont give it teeth, its the only way to get people to follow it and make it effective. Like I said, just my opinion.

[Doc]

I would also wonder how much would be involved to maintain all this info on the DEC's computer system . The fines could possibly cover any additional expenses to the DEC ( if there were any ) .

One of the good points of this system is that there are no inputting tasks involved. The license tags are already issued via computer, so that's "in there". The harvests are inputted to the computer via computer, and inputted by the hunters (no DEC personel needed there), so that's "in there" for free. What is needed is some one-time, not too tricky, software writing to do the sorts, compile the lists of hunters that are non-compliant, and send out warnings or citations or whatever communications that are required, so there is a slight cost there. I see it all as a massive cost cutting activity, which is the kind of thing that the DEC is in bad need of these days. Remember the costs of the current system to achieve some rather dubious results. That is, sending DEC personel all over the countryside trying to amass license info from deer processors and other harvested deer collection places, collating all that input and then having someone manually input that into the computers. Then there is the computer work that develops the "reporting rate from all that and then applies that to the actual reports tallied up. All that activity and effort and expense eventually results in a harvest count. That's not cost effective.

[bubba]

again I ask the question. I know again northern zone pain in the azz, but, I have 4 days to use my unused tags at the end of september for archery. Am I supposed to report them as unused by February, then report them as used in September? Or do I just hunt those 4 days and not report anything?  Oh I know I get it.  Take away those 4 days and not let me start until 10/01. 

[wztirem]

PDF]  CFAB Correspondence Letter  File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View

RE: NYSDEC DECALS and the Statewide E-Licensing Program. Dear Mr. Paterson: Below is the text (italics) of an email that was sent to Ms. Knapp with the NYS ...

www.dec.ny.gov/docs/wildlife_pdf/finaltestimony1110.pdf        An interesting read!

[WNYBuckHunter]

again I ask the question. I know again northern zone pain in the azz, but, I have 4 days to use my unused tags at the end of september for archery. Am I supposed to report them as unused by February, then report them as used in September? Or do I just hunt those 4 days and not report anything?  Oh I know I get it.  Take away those 4 days and not let me start until 10/01.

You would have to report them before you got your new tags, whether that be at the end of the season or the beginning of the next season. It may be a minor inconvenience for you to do, but if you hunt the 4 days, then deal with the inconvenience.

[bubba]

umm ok I guess the 4 days are out. I purchase my license in August when they go on sale to apply for a dmp.  Too bad for the nz guys I guess

[fasteddie]

umm ok I guess the 4 days are out. I purchase my license in August when they go on sale to apply for a dmp.  Too bad for the nz guys I guess

Yeah , I guess it sucks to be in the Northern Zone . There is no benefit to getting the license early as the permits are not on a 1st come 1st served basis . They are random .

[bubba]

I know there is no reason, but I do it asap.  I guess the good part is it will never happen.  The state has a hard time compiling the data from the reoprts that are done now.  They will not want to compile data of the deer not taken.  I guess when there is no report it is assumed there was no deer, bear or turleys taken.

[WNYBuckHunter]

umm ok I guess the 4 days are out. I purchase my license in August when they go on sale to apply for a dmp.  Too bad for the nz guys I guess

Yeah , I guess it sucks to be in the Northern Zone . There is no benefit to getting the license early as the permits are not on a 1st come 1st served basis . They are random .

Correct.

[bubba]

http://www.newzjunky.com/record/dec_violations.html

It looks like in my area the dec is working hard to ticket those breaking the laws including not reporting game taken.

[nyantler]

you see fellas, this is truly why nothing gets done ... no hunters can agree on anything...the DEC must get sick of asking the public what they think... somehow , someway there is always someone that thinks they are being slighted... :

[WNYBuckHunter]

I saw one failure to report. Catching lawbreakers really isnt the point though, its about accurate (or more accurate) reporting and how to accomplish that.

[nyantler]

exactly!

[bubba]

umm ok as it says in my signature

[WNYBuckHunter]

Rather than complain about the idea, why not offer up a solution of your own?

[burmjohn]

umm ok as it says in my signature

That gave me a good giggle.

[bubba]

wny if you lived where I do you would have the same complaints.  I dont see where any other plan is going to work any better than the one we have.  But keep brainstorming, I like to see creative minds.  Maybe before all these ideas are thrown out, look at the whole state and how things are different.  You want to do what is being proposed, you bring in your old license when you purchase the new one. They could get a scanner and scan to see what was used, and what wasnt. the data goes directly to the computers.  Make it so that when you apply for a dmp, it doesnt have to be done by the last night people in the nz can use them.  In other words move the time to apply back to October 15th.  It is instant you know you get them or not.  No need for it to be started in mid august and end october 1.  put a cpu bar code on the license one trip through the scanner poof instant scanning and data collection.  However, the way the system is now, it takes a year to get data back just tallyng the take. Hw long do you think it will take if they have to collect data on how many weren't?  If you do not bring your old license, or proof that you reported all takes and used all tags, or you do not get a new license.  If you report online, you can print a copy of your reporting. Bring those for all tags used and unused tags.  Seems pretty easy to me.  Now feel free to tear my plan apart.

[WNYBuckHunter]

wny if you lived where I do you would have the same complaints.  I dont see where any other plan is going to work any better than the one we have.  But keep brainstorming, I like to see creative minds.  Maybe before all these ideas are thrown out, look at the whole state and how things are different.  You want to do what is being proposed, you bring in your old license when you purchase the new one. They could get a scanner and scan to see what was used, and what wasnt. the data goes directly to the computers.  Make it so that when you apply for a dmp, it doesnt have to be done by the last night people in the nz can use them.  In other words move the time to apply back to October 15th.  It is instant you know you get them or not.  No need for it to be started in mid august and end october 1.  put a cpu bar code on the license one trip through the scanner poof instant scanning and data collection.  However, the way the system is now, it takes a year to get data back just tallyng the take. Hw long do you think it will take if they have to collect data on how many weren't?  If you do not bring your old license, or proof that you reported all takes and used all tags, or you do not get a new license.  If you report online, you can print a copy of your reporting. Bring those for all tags used and unused tags.  Seems pretty easy to me.  Now feel free to tear my plan apart.

I dont see how that plan is much different than the one that has been mentioned, other than you wouldnt have to bring any print out with you, it would all be associated with you in the computer system already.  You dont report, you dont get your tags. It doesnt matter when you apply for your tags, its all random anyway, so if you want to hunt those final 4 days with your old tags, then go get your new tags after that 4th day is over. I dont see how that is so tough. They could really make it easy and change the dates that the license are good for to an earlier date so that you dont have that 4 day period anywhere to begin with.

The data wouldnt take any longer to compile, its all done with computers anyway.

[bubba]

you really do not believe that the state bureaucrats would not make it longer and hire a hundred more people to inpterpret the data and take more money away from the real needs in conservation?  I know you are smarter than that. 

[WNYBuckHunter]

Theres no need for it, their current system would be able to be modified to add in one selection. The most they would have to do would be temp hire a programmer to make the change, they probably have someone that could do it currently. Im not trying to say the state would necessarily do it the smart way, just saying it would be easy to do.

[bubba]

and realistically we both know it will never happen. So have a nice day and stay warm.

[growalot]

another program...and how accurate is the information gathered here as far as deer #'s when they aren't over seeing the NP system properly?