Would you pay extra money for Mineral rights when purchasing land ?

[607 HUNTER]

I found a 14.15 acre property for sale, it is  acres 3 acres field and 12 acres of mature timber ( pines, oak, maples and about 20 mature apple trees)logged in 2004.

The owner showed me the property, he is asking $25,000. I told him I will buy it, he confirmed he had all mineral rights.

Now we are starting the paper work I found out the real estate company that sub divided the property in 2004 reserved the mineral rights. The timber rights are mine, if i purchase. I contacted this company they would sell the mineral rights for $6,000.

It seems pretty high in my opinion, I would much rather use that money for a future cabin. BUT... I hate the though of some one else having the right for water, oil or gas on my property at any time. 

Just wondering what you guys think ?  I value the land about $25,000 for market value. The owner will not drop the price at all after telling them the situation, I tried to get them to split the difference, they said no way. 

Thanks 

[Zag]

Id tell them to stick that property u know where. Keep looking for another property. I highly doubt the mineral rights will amount to anything and don't settle for anything other than all rights. I also doubt they didn't already know that and hope to find someone who will bite at their gimmick. 

[tommyc50]

my opinion is no they can keep it fracking is a dead issue in new york , but jump on that it looks like a beautiful piece. 

[growalot]

He's not talking just gas and oil..he ALSO said water rights...from a real estate company that worked the sub division. Walk away is my opinion

[left field]

A lot of developers in the 80s reserved the mineral rights when the sold they subdivided. They had or have no intention to act on those rights, it's simply a cheap money grab. When this happened to me I told the seller to secure the rights or the deal would fall through. They did. My guess is that the developer will take 3K.

There's a lot of property out there. Unless this is heaven, pass and find another if they won't sell it to fully unencumbered. 

 

[tommyc50]

i just did the math thats about $1785 an acre you aint finding better than that

[growalot]

Now that depends on where he HAS to buy and how he HAS to buy. In other words county and cash...private or agancy

[TACC]

Walk away, don't give up anything on your property

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[607 HUNTER]

It's in a town of Birdsall, an area I have been looking for land for about 5 years. Seems like 2-3 parcels a year get listed in this town I am looking for.  I have been hunting state land there for about 20 years, I really want to secure a property so I can instill the lessons and  in the wild in my kids as I was taught. So I am in a little rush and anxious to find something. 

I am 99% sure gonna buy this property, seems like my mind changes every 5 minutes. So I am just debating wether its worth spending the $6,000 for mineral rights or not. 

Thank you all for the input

[growalot]

Have you looked into bank or tax foreclosures?

[NYBowhunter]

11 hours ago, tommyc50 said:

i just did the math thats about $1785 an acre you aint finding better than that

Think again. Theres better deals to be had, you can find land in central NY still for $1,500.00 an acre. Just need to look around. Sometimes timing is everything.

[NYBowhunter]

9 hours ago, TACC said:

Walk away, don't give up anything on your property

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I agree completely, all rights or nothing. Dont want to have to deal with any type of bull$$it in the future or if and when you want to resell.

[hunter]

I was told no bank will finance a deal without all rights so if you build on it you can only sell for cash. I walked away from a sweet deal because of this and you should too. Good luck.

[BigVal]

I wouldn't own it without the rights. If it's that rare and you want it pretty bad then I'd spend the extra six and be done. 

[chas0218]

Wouldn't own it without mineral rights. Most banks won't finance you to put a hitable structure on the land without them. We were trying to just buy land and banks would lend the money with the 20%-30% down but financing to build a house later would not be possible with a bunch of banks.

[chas0218]

The prices you mentioned put you at $2200/acre. Personally I wouldn't be paying more than $1000/acre with no mineral rights, then secure the mineral rights for the extra $6000. $1766/acre is pricey for no mineral rights. Go on and look at what land is selling for without mineral rights you might be surprised. I have found land for $1000/acre-$10,000/acre with mineral rights in the southern tier just have to look around a little. Personally the property your talking about I wouldn't pay more than $15,000 for its location and without mineral rights.

Edited September 28, 2017 by chas0218

[land 1]

ok i bought 90 acres last year and i dont own mineral rights but i only paid $450 and acre so it was a good deal.... and when  i bought there were several other properties being sold by the same company the most was $600 acre the least was $360... so if  your not getting the mineral rights there should be a sharp reduction in price, 6000 grand i would say is not a bad price to buy the rights but the owner should be reducing his price .... also i got what they call a buffer zone this means  i selected a 10 acre area that the mineral co. cant touch... now fracking is not likely in NY but they can put a regular gas well in or whatever..I would say walk away dont know what land goes for in your area but if the owner is even remotely close to what a normal 25 acres goes for walk away.

[land 1]

also look at the mineral rights very close  can the holder of the rights sell it to a third party with out your knowledge . u said it was a development company say they need dirt or fill for a sight they are developing they can come in and take it from your land. if your going to build a cabin get a buffer zone u could wake up one morning and find a dozer two feet away tearing your land up. If they do do something with minerals or whatever do they need to put there own driveway in or do they have the right to use yours and tear it up with big trucks . Can they put above ground pipelines in meaning that they could put a line blocking u if u want to ride a tractor or atv.  Also i cant dig a pond a or septic tank outside my buffer zone.

Just some stuff to consider.

[growalot]

I have to say we actually bought our last piece giving up several RIGHTS... that said I did the wording so it's not too bad and it connects to our main property 24 1/2 acres...and we signed off on NO commercial or residential building. Now that leaves agricultural and recreational...so legally a permanent camp can be built just not lived in as a residence and a barn or agriculture  type of activities that include building can happen...now for doing this and giving a ,with notice, right to access a grave..... we got that land for 10,000.00 ..When you cut out the realtors and like to talk...so many deals can be had...Oh and when you have cash.

PS only living relatives live on the West coast and Vermont...

Edited September 28, 2017 by growalot

[607 HUNTER]

On 9/28/2017 at 9:11 AM, growalot said:

Have you looked into bank or tax foreclosures?

Every year, every local counties. Never found the right piece I am in search of

 

[607 HUNTER]

23 hours ago, hunter said:

I was told no bank will finance a deal without all rights so if you build on it you can only sell for cash. I walked away from a sweet deal because of this and you should too. Good luck.

That is GREAT to know, the plan is to build a cabin so future re sale is very important.

[607 HUNTER]

23 hours ago, chas0218 said:

Wouldn't own it without mineral rights. Most banks won't finance you to put a hitable structure on the land without them. We were trying to just buy land and banks would lend the money with the 20%-30% down but financing to build a house later would not be possible with a bunch of banks.

That is HUGE to consider, about future resale. Thanks for the bit of knowledge, I was un aware of banks not financing with out mineral rights. O trust me I have looked and looked and looked, tough market out there ! 

 

[607 HUNTER]

22 hours ago, land 1 said:

ok i bought 90 acres last year and i dont own mineral rights but i only paid $450 and acre so it was a good deal.... and when  i bought there were several other properties being sold by the same company the most was $600 acre the least was $360... so if  your not getting the mineral rights there should be a sharp reduction in price, 6000 grand i would say is not a bad price to buy the rights but the owner should be reducing his price .... also i got what they call a buffer zone this means  i selected a 10 acre area that the mineral co. cant touch... now fracking is not likely in NY but they can put a regular gas well in or whatever..I would say walk away dont know what land goes for in your area but if the owner is even remotely close to what a normal 25 acres goes for walk away.

WOW sounds like you found a fantastic deal, good for you ! Thanks for all the info

[607 HUNTER]

16 hours ago, growalot said:

I have to say we actually bought our last piece giving up several RIGHTS... that said I did the wording so it's not too bad and it connects to our main property 24 1/2 acres...and we signed off on NO commercial or residential building. Now that leaves agricultural and recreational...so legally a permanent camp can be built just not lived in as a residence and a barn or agriculture  type of activities that include building can happen...now for doing this and giving a ,with notice, right to access a grave..... we got that land for 10,000.00 ..When you cut out the realtors and like to talk...so many deals can be had...Oh and when you have cash.

PS only living relatives live on the West coast and Vermont...

I am buying cash and buyers won't drop a dollar !! Sure is tough when people know they have a good product. The property is not on the market, just word of mouth. Ofcourse someone else came a couple days after me and said if I don't buy it they would. I am glad the owners did not start a bidding war or give him the chance to buy it from under me.

[607 HUNTER]

HERES THE UPDATE AS OF NOW.

Reise realty from Cuba, NY is the company reserved  the mineral rights. I guess they hold all mineral rights when they sell properties. The people I am purchasing from are a little older, and swear they had no idea it was ever reserved.

Cuba is extremely close to PA, with that having so much land I would not be surprised they would have connections with big fracking companies in PA to move in fast on there properties. 

Thinking about that and doing a lot of reading online on mineral rights, fracking and your guys input I will definitely be purchasing the mineral rights. I plan to keep this property a long time, who knows if fracking will ever be legal in NY or not, but the though or not owning or chance of other people coming on my property for dirt or water does not sit well with me. 

They have lowered there price to $3500, I countered $2000 and can only hope they accept my offer or a middle group. The land is completely raw, so any extra funding will help for projects. 

Thanks for all the input