Are we being Scammed with Ethanol ?

[fasteddie]

The government has mandated that a certain amount of Ethanol ( a biofuel ) be used as an additive in the gasoline we purchase . Ethanol plants are subsidized by the government to produce this product from food sources ( corn , sugarcane , etc ) . The addition of ethanol to gasoline cuts back on the mpg you get from your vehicle . Ethanol also gums up lawn mower , ATV and other engines . I saw a pint can of a product at tractor supply today that helps to keep small engines from being damaged . $8 a pint .

Aren't we taking a big step backwards by using this biofuel ???

[Single_shot]

Backwards YES! Ethanol JUNK YES! Lower mpg YES! I have ruined but repairable,2 saws that were in perfect condition from regular gas. New piston,rings and carb on both to fix+labor. The bill I get from the dealer now have "USE HIGH TEST GAS ONLY" on the bill now.....never did before.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Even the high test gas has ethanol in it. I use the additive for all of my small engines. Pain in the butt and more expensive. Its all a work to get more money out of our pockets.

[Gthphtm]

Ever since I can remember It said in all my small engine2 and 4 cycle to use high test gas,this is nothing new,Ethanol is just another form of alki.(it does not gum up parts) It degrades some of the materials in the fuel system.which might be the problem.Years ago if you had a race engine and ran it on methanol or ethanol,you would have to change a few of the internal parts of your carb.with compatable parts.The factory know this why aren't they putting the right pieces in.The answer is so they can sell parts.   

[Single_shot]

Even the high test gas has ethanol in it. I use the additive for all of my small engines. Pain in the butt and more expensive. Its all a work to get more money out of our pockets.

If it all has ethanol then why run high test? My thought is that it burns hotter and thus burning up more of the "junk" they have added into it. I have run small engines for many years without a problem on reg gas and have only had problems since this added stuff.Previous to when they started the ethanol,I had purchased an 029 Super Farm Boss from the local dealer who said it was ok to run regular in it. Then the ethanol came out and in one season the hose from the tank to the carb recieved 100's of tiny holes in it. Took it to said dealer and low and behold,he states that the new hose is made from a different material and the gas won't "eat" through it. I bought and extra "justin case". Now all I run is high test and stabil in all my toys.

[G-Man]

ethanol will eat gaskets,hoses and burn valves..thats what they replace ....we use corn for ethanol,only get 50% return for amout of energey used to make it. Sugarcane has a 200% yeild for energy put into it to make ethanol. We are subsidising a losing industry that can only be effective if normal gas is 4$ a gallon. so guess what 4$ is what we pay... sad really

[Fantail]

Ethanol is crap.

The oil industry knows it. The U.S. Dept. of Energy is forcing a serious smoke enema up our collective @ss.

[sweet old bill]

cost of a bag of corn has gone up by close to 100% in just one year time frame. They are also saying that it does not do well in your car or truck. If you do a analysis oc cost to produce gas from corn the cost is almost 75% of the finished

product, not a smart way to go. I think we also should not give tax loop holes to those making the product. I just wish we would go back to drill baby drill on shore and off shore. Make it a total USA goal

to reduce the amount of oil being purchased by us in the middle east. I also feel we should tax these wind fall profit of the tax firms.

[Dave]

ethanol will eat gaskets,hoses and burn valves..thats what they replace ....we use corn for ethanol,only get 50% return for amout of energey used to make it. Sugarcane has a 200% yeild for energy put into it to make ethanol. We are subsidising a losing industry that can only be effective if normal gas is 4$ a gallon. so guess what 4$ is what we pay... sad really

Two years in a row I have brought my quad in for a gas leak. Seems the over flow hose off the Carb just kept leaking when you turned the quad off. Dealer said it's a result of ethanol eating the gaskets.

Dave

[burmjohn]

Whats the additive called to help protect from the ethanol?

[fasteddie]

Whats the additive called to help protect from the ethanol?

I called up our local Tractor supply and Al told me the name of the additive is "Startron" and that a 16 oz bottle is now $4.99 and will treat 48 gallons .

Here is a link to the product ;

http://mystarbrite.com/startron/

[Doewhacker]

Corn is in all kinds of food's that don't need it too, it is up there in biggest scam's in my book. But it keep's farm's alive so it's a double edged sword I guess, not needed in fuel if you ask any sensible person.

[nyantler]

The scam is so good.. that it has us buying Stratron... for $5.. that we never had to buy before... :  I guess it must be part of the new stimulus plan...

[fasteddie]

I looked up the Srartron additive and 16 ounces treats 256 gallons ......

http://www.starbrite.com/sproductdetail.cfm?ID=1537

It seems pretty stupid to pay more for a product that will give you less and then buy something that will make it better .

[nyantler]

absolutely! 

[16. ga hunter]

hi test gas does not burn hotter it is actually less volitile. most small enigines have higher compression ratios than vehicle engines hence the recomendation for hi test it will eat your fuel lines gaskets and such at the same rate as regular. however running the regular in a high compression small engine can lead to detonation and possible burnt pistons

[fasteddie]

FORMULATED E-10 ETHANOL ENHANCED GASOLINE

[/size]

The gasoline we buy for our boats and cars is in the process of a major reformulation. Ethanol, an alcohol derived primarily from corn, is both a domestically produced, and renewable fuel. E-10 (10% ethanol) has become a critical component of our fuel infrastructure, but it requires better housekeeping, especially in the boating industry. Ethanol is being phased into the fuel supply across the country.

The problem is all alcohol’s are hygroscopic. That means it likes water, and it attracts and couples with moisture in the air, resulting in greater amounts of water collecting in the fuel tank. Since water is heavier than gasoline, the water and ethanol mix settles to the bottom. This is referred to as "phase separation", and eventually the water/ethanol phase is drawn into the fuel delivery system. If there is no water separator in the line, the water goes into the injector/carburetor and the engine does not run properly. In extreme cases, the engine will stop running. For automobiles, this is not a common problem in that an entire tank of fuel will most likely be used up within one week, well before a water/ethanol build up takes place. Also, automobiles have smaller gas tanks, leaving less air space for condensation to accumulate. Boats usually do not use up their fuel for many weeks, if not months, and their large gas tanks, when left low in fuel, readily form condensation. This presents a problem for most boaters.

An additional problem boaters will face is loss of octane, which is critical to an engine's performance. Ethanol is over 100+ octane, and provides the fuel with much of its octane rating. Once water reaches about a .5% level, it will phase separate. With the ethanol drawn to the bottom along with the water, the fuel will lose octane, and this can cause a loss of performance, including pinging and engine knock, which can damage your engine. It also severely worsens fuel economy and power.

There are other problems with E-10 fuel. Ethanol is a powerful solvent and readily breaks up tars and organic sediment found in many marine fuel tanks. The ethanol/water mix also makes a potent stripping agent for old varnish and gum accumulated from years of gasoline sitting in the tank. These organic contaminants, once loosened from tank walls, can plug filters and injectors quickly, disabling your boat’s engine. In cold weather, the water/alcohol phase can also freeze, turning into a syrupy mix that plugs filters.

To assist boaters, Star Brite has introduced Star Tron, a revolutionary fuel additive based on enzyme technology that can prevent these water-related fuel problems. The enzyme package in Star Tron disperses water derived from normal condensation into microscopic clusters, and allows the water to pass through the fuel system and engine harmlessly, preventing the buildup on the tank bottom that can contribute to poor performance, fuel gelling and corrosion. This de-watering effect prevents potential phase separation. If large amounts of water are already present it will be de-emulsified and drop out of the body of the fuel, improving overall fuel performance. Over a period of time, with fresh gas loads treated with Star Tron, even large accumulations of water will be totally eliminated. Star Tron can also counter the effects of lost octane, greatly improving the combustion performance of E-10 fuel that has had water contamination. Star Tron can also prevent filter plugging from old gum and varnish. The enzymes help break down the dislodged sludge and other deposits into sub-micron-sized particles that usually pass through the fuel filter and are burned away as part of the combustion process. Tank deposits that would cause gelling are solubilized so that fuel flows uninterrupted through the filters. Star Brite Star tron is available in 8 fl. oz, 16 fl. oz, 32 fl. oz. and bulk sizes at most marine supply retailers. One fluid ounce of the additive treats 15 gallons of gas.

[Single_shot]

Good read there Ed...thanks.

[HectorBuckBuster]

The gas company that blends the Ethanol in the gas get a federal tax credit of around 46 cents per gallon. So you wonder why they like adding it to gas. I don't have a problem with using some ethanol even though it gets worse gas mileage, but ethanol can be made out of other stuff that we do not use for food. If something is used for food it should not be used to make fuel.

[Stretchhunts]

Ethanol is crap. I had a white milky film on my sled carbs. Never had issues with reg gas. I always run the treatment in my sleds and boat. I've seen way to many sled egines and boat engines burn up this year. Just another way for us to pay.

[ELMER J. FUDD]

      http://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=NY  Pure Gas Stations in New York 

  [table]    [tr]  [td]City[/td]  [td]Brand[/td]  [td]Octane[/td]  [td]Name[/td]  [td]Street Address[/td]  [td]GPS*[/td]  [td][/td]  [td][/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Albany[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Rhoades Service Center[/td]  [td]1904 Western Avenue[/td]  [td]N42.69368 W73.87757 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Amsterdam[/td]  [td]PIT STOP[/td]  [td]87 89 93 [/td]  [td]Slezak's Church St Service Center[/td]  [td]170 Church St[/td]  [td]N42.93712 W74.17820 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Arcade[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 89 91 [/td]  [td]Former Uni-Mart in Arcade[/td]  [td]278 Main Street[/td]  [td]N42.53387 W78.42390 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]BASOM[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 93 [/td]  [td]TOTEM POLE SMOKE AND GAS[/td]  [td]1025 LEDGE RD[/td]  [td]N43.04521 W78.41564 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Canandaigua[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]89 [/td]  [td]Seager Marine[/td]  [td]811 S. Main St.[/td]  [td]N42.87620 W77.27328 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Canandaigua[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Seager Marine Service Center[/td]  [td]21 Parrish Street[/td]  [td]N42.88000 W77.27673 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Castile[/td]  [td]KWIK FILL[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Kwik Fill[/td]  [td]main street[/td]  [td]N42.63215 W78.05035 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Clymer[/td]  [td]KEYSTONE[/td]  [td]89 [/td]  [td]Lictus Keystone[/td]  [td]01 Rt. 474[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Clymer[/td]  [td]KEYSTONE[/td]  [td]87 89 93 [/td]  [td]Lictus Keystone[/td]  [td]001 main Street[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Clymer 14724[/td]  [td]KEYSTONE[/td]  [td]87 91 93 [/td]  [td]Lictus Keystone[/td]  [td]route 474[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Eagle Bay[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 89 93 [/td]  [td]Big Moose Yamaha[/td]  [td]Route 28[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]fort ann[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]93 [/td]  [td]Super Shop[/td]  [td]route 149[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Jamestown[/td]  [td]KWIK FILL[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Kwik Fill[/td]  [td]1781 Foote Ave[/td]  [td]N42.09834 W79.23474 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Ledyard[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]90 [/td]  [td]Wilcox General store[/td]  [td]Rte 34b[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Mayville[/td]  [td]KEYSTONE[/td]  [td]87 93 [/td]  [td]Chautauqua Marina[/td]  [td]104 West Lake Rd[/td]  [td]N42.14180 W79.29380 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Mayville[/td]  [td]KEYSTONE[/td]  [td][/td]  [td]Crosby's[/td]  [td]292 W. Lake Rd.[/td]  [td]N42.23350 W79.48900 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Northville[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]87 89 93 [/td]  [td]Edinburg Marina and Powersports[/td]  [td]140 North Shore Rd.[/td]  [td]N43.22146 W74.10141 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Penn Yan[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]89 [/td]  [td]Morgan Marine[/td]  [td]#2 Route 54 - East Lake Road[/td]  [td]N42.38924 W77.03721 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Pittsford[/td]  [td]EXXON[/td]  [td]87 89 93 [/td]  [td]Pittsford Automotive[/td]  [td]Monroe Avenue[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Pittsford[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td][/td]  [td]Pittsford Automotive[/td]  [td]Monroe Ave[/td]  [td]not available [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Rushville[/td]  [td]UNBRANDED[/td]  [td]93 [/td]  [td]Rushco Oil[/td]  [td]1 Warehouse[/td]  [td]N42.76007 W77.22637 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Schoharie[/td]  [td]PIT STOP[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Schoharie Service Station[/td]  [td]US 30[/td]  [td]N42.66591 W74.30958 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr]  [tr]  [td]Watervliet[/td]  [td]PIT STOP[/td]  [td]87 [/td]  [td]Selby's Auto Service[/td]  [td]200 23rd Street[/td]  [td]N42.73258 W73.70116 [/td]  [td]map[/td]  [td]details[/td][/tr][/table]*GPS coordinates may be located from the supplied address, and may not be accurate. View the station details.