stubborn1VT

How far???

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I shoot a CVA Kodiak and run 2 pellets of Triple 7 behind a 250 grain Shockwave.  What is the effective range of this load?  

This afternoon I took a 125-135 yard shot at an adult doe.  I had a rock solid rest. She jumped at the shot and took off running.  She didn't bound out of the field, but ran and dove through a thick hedgerow instead of using a path.  

I realized I had taken my reloads out of my wet jacket pocket, so I walked back to the house.  I reloaded and walked back out and found blood.  From the blood in relation to the tracks, the shot was great, as far as front to back.  She had only gone 100 yards and bedded.  My heart sank when I saw her bound off.  I went up and checked out the bed.  There a blood spot the size of a softball.  I backed out for 4 hours and went back with a headlamp.  I only found 2 spots of blood.  It had rained a bunch and the snow was melting.  She went through an area with big pines where there was no snow.  Either the rain washed the blood away, or she clotted up.  I combed all the trails for 200 yards and backed out.

I will be back out in the morning, but I'm not feeling hopeful.  The shot felt great.  Her reaction was right.  I probably should have given her a half hour instead of 15 minutes.  I'm not sure what else I could have done differently.  I'm upset, but I am also in a bit of disbelief.  I feel like I did my part, but I'm not sure the muzzleoader is good for that range.  

I will report what I find in the morning.  

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What yardage  did you sight in at ? I’m shooting the same combo as you. Sighted at 100 and have killed a few at 125 or so without any problem.  That combo is more than fine out to 200 if knowing the drop. Good luck in the morning. Hope you find her 

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Thanks for the reply TF.  

I sighted in an inch high at 75.  I don't feel like the load has much punch.  I never get two holes.  In this case I may have hit the far side shoulder.  

Hopefully I find her, but there will be no blood or tracks after the rain and melt.  I have all day to grid search.  Fingers crossed.

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If I don't find her it will be because I didn't shoot enough.  I shot a bunch of different bullets and am really happy with the accuracy.  However, I didn't put in the time to practice over 100.  The ML isn't a rifle.  

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It seems odd to me that you never get two holes. I exclusively hunt with a MZ and used pellets and now bh209 and always get two holes. The gun should have enough umph out to 150 at the least. Like @turkeyfeathers said,even further if you know the bullet drop. I wonder if you hit low and missed the vitals.

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one i shot last year with the same 2 - 777 pellets - I shot at about 90 yards and didnt get punch thru cause i hit shoulder.  But it dropped right there with the bullet in opposite shoulder.  

Muzzleloader deer '18.jpg

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33 minutes ago, stubborn1VT said:

If I don't find her it will be because I didn't shoot enough.  I shot a bunch of different bullets and am really happy with the accuracy.  However, I didn't put in the time to practice over 100.  The ML isn't a rifle.  

Rare is the person that practices with ANY firearm over 100 yards.........

Good luck this morning. 

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13 minutes ago, BowmanMike said:

It seems odd to me that you never get two holes. I exclusively hunt with a MZ and used pellets and now bh209 and always get two holes. The gun should have enough umph out to 150 at the least. Like @turkeyfeathers said,even further if you know the bullet drop. I wonder if you hit low and missed the vitals.

I'm wondering the same thing.  She jumped and mule kicked and "dug" out of the field.  I felt really good about the shot.  Hopefully I can do an "autopsy" and figure out what happened.

Last year I shot a very small doe at 75 yards.  She was quartering to me and I slipped it behind the shoulder.  She dropped right there, but I recovered the bullet against the ribs on the far side.

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1 minute ago, Lawdwaz said:

Rare is the person that practices with ANY firearm over 100 yards.........

Good luck this morning. 

I take a whopping 3 practice shots with my 7 Rem Mag at 100+.  Probably because I don't have to run a patch through it between shots...

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I seldom get a pass through out of my ML with basically the same ammo combo. How far to shoot is based on how far you practice. Heavy slugs moving relatively slow drop quick, no matter the inline folks bragging rights about shooting as flat as a rifle. I sight for 75 yards, (with a scope) really don't hunt where I would ever have a 100, and just know for myself I wont take a shot that far. By far most of my shots are 40-60 in the woods.

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My scoped muzzleloader is sighted in dead on at 135yds. This allows me to hold huddle of deer from 0-160yds without ever being more that 3” high or low and having to hold high or low, I’m still holding on hair at 200 and won’t take a shot further than that. This is with a max load of blackhorn and a 275gn bullet. No idea how much slower your load is than mine because I never shot 777 through a crono but you still have plenty of energy at 150yds.

 

Anyone that has their muzzleloader dialed in at 100yds that’s willing to take a shot further than that is really short changing the weapon. All of my scopes rifles are sighted in the same way whatever the distance works out to be so I can hold in the middle of a deer and never be more than 3” high or low without having to adjust aim point. Chronographs are cheap and give you everything you need to know to get the most out of a gun.

 

 

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Nothing good.  I found a few blood clots where she stopped, and that was it.  It rained off and on all night and the remaining snow melted, so I had poor conditions for tracking.  I walked out the trails, checked under blow downs, busted through the brush and checked the nearest stream and a fence crossing.  I find it odd that she went more than a couple hundred yards after I jumped her out of her bed.  

Bottom line is that I didn't shoot enough and I treated the ML like a rifle.  It really doesn't make any sense to sight in for 100 yards and then shoot farther.  I paced it again today and it was 120-125 yards.  I can't say I know the bullet drop between 75 and 125 yards.  With my 7mm I have it an inch high at 100 yards and don't worry about it.  If I can see it, I can hit it.  

I probably should have given her more time after the shot.  Not sure it would have made much difference, but jumping her out of her bed sure didn't help.  I treated the hit like I was using a rifle.  Any ideas here?  

That's a wrap on my deer hunting.  Our season ends Sunday.  I'm disgusted with myself and have no confidence in the ML.  I'm not interested in figuring out a solution at this point.  Next year I will probably look into different powder, a different ML, or just limit myself to 100 yards and under.  I would probably benefit from thinking of the ML as a type of crossbow.

Maybe somebody else can learn something from this.  Hopefully I have.  It puts my stomach in a knot.  I don't know where I hit and  I don't know where she went.  Maybe she's coyote food.  Maybe she makes it.  Either way, I need to make sure I do my part in the future.  

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Sorry man. Doesn’t sound like you did anything wrong. I’ve lost 2 gun deer in my life. Couldn’t eat and couldn’t sleep for days. Unfortunately if we hunt long enough it’s going to happen. All we can do is do our best it doesn’t happen again to the best of our ability . Sighted at 100 and shooting at 125 has very little difference in impact. Inline ML’s In fact do shoot like a rifle. I ditched my slug gun many years ago because of it. Don’t lump yourself up. You did everything by the book : the shot , trying to retrieve and now feel bad about it. That load is deadly , stay with it and current gun. My words won’t make it any easier but been there twice as I said. Definitely sucks but keep at it. There’s a week left and we’d love for you to be back out there for redemption. Put a couple on paper and get out there !! 

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Sorry for your loss, don't give up on your muzzle loader and "pattern" it before next season and get your confidence back.

I sight in using three pellets and it give one more shock power down range. I also sight in at about 2" high at 100 yards and where I hunt (Adk's) long shots are very rare.

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stubborn1VT,

If you typically hunt open fields you could sight in at 150 yards and range find some known spots where you hunt and then you can estimate shot distances more consistently from known landmarks.

All food for thought and practice pays great dividends in confidence...

Best of luck to you. 

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19 hours ago, stubborn1VT said:

Nothing good.  I found a few blood clots where she stopped, and that was it.  It rained off and on all night and the remaining snow melted, so I had poor conditions for tracking.  I walked out the trails, checked under blow downs, busted through the brush and checked the nearest stream and a fence crossing.  I find it odd that she went more than a couple hundred yards after I jumped her out of her bed.  

Bottom line is that I didn't shoot enough and I treated the ML like a rifle.  It really doesn't make any sense to sight in for 100 yards and then shoot farther.  I paced it again today and it was 120-125 yards.  I can't say I know the bullet drop between 75 and 125 yards.  With my 7mm I have it an inch high at 100 yards and don't worry about it.  If I can see it, I can hit it.  

I probably should have given her more time after the shot.  Not sure it would have made much difference, but jumping her out of her bed sure didn't help.  I treated the hit like I was using a rifle.  Any ideas here?  

That's a wrap on my deer hunting.  Our season ends Sunday.  I'm disgusted with myself and have no confidence in the ML.  I'm not interested in figuring out a solution at this point.  Next year I will probably look into different powder, a different ML, or just limit myself to 100 yards and under.  I would probably benefit from thinking of the ML as a type of crossbow.

Maybe somebody else can learn something from this.  Hopefully I have.  It puts my stomach in a knot.  I don't know where I hit and  I don't know where she went.  Maybe she's coyote food.  Maybe she makes it.  Either way, I need to make sure I do my part in the future.  

Youre being too hard on yourself. Nothing goes to waste. Its also possible you zinged her high or low and she makes it. If every hunter committed themselves to figuring it out before going back out, like you have, the sport will be better for it. I was lucky after my miss I had some time and a place to go re-sight in. Im hoping for redemption


I find a duck's opinion of me is very much influenced by whether or not I have bread

-Mitch Hedberg

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10 minutes ago, Salmon_Run said:

stubborn1VT,

If you typically hunt open fields you could sight in at 150 yards and range find some known spots where you hunt and then you can estimate shot distances more consistently from known landmarks.

All food for thought and practice pays great dividends in confidence...

Best of luck to you. 

I generally don't hunt open fields during ML season, but now I realize that I NEED to be able to shoot over 100 yards.  Looking back, I have never shot a deer over 70 yards with the ML before this year.

I agree with using landmarks and know distances.  I hunt the same properties year after year.

Practice is going to be the key, as well as having a propellant and bullet that perform.  Live and learn.  

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Thanks for the replies.  I hope to at least shoot one round out of the ML tomorrow and see where it is hitting.  I don't want to hunt with it again until I have had time to tinker with it.  

I am strongly considering replacing it with a CVA Wolf with a Blackhorn 209 breech plug.  

If I do go back out, it will be with my Xbow.  At 35 yards it is a stone killer.

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1 minute ago, stubborn1VT said:

 

I am strongly considering replacing it with a CVA Wolf with a Blackhorn 209 breech plug.  

 

That rig is a tack driver

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I find a duck's opinion of me is very much influenced by whether or not I have bread

-Mitch Hedberg

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I use the same ML but use 2 Pyrodex pellets and a 245 grain sabot. I bought some 240 grain sabots for this year, but I have had issues with mine punching 2 holes in the past as well but at shorter distances.(No shots over 70yds) I do know that I have hit low on 2 of the deer and had to reload and take a killing shot but the 1st shot did no go through. It may be the sabots and how they react to soft tissue which I read about in another thread on here but I am no expert.
That ML is a magnum too, so if I was going to take shots over 100, I would practice using a magnum load or 3 pellets and a heavier bullet than 250 grains. Just my opinion and again, no expert here. Wish we could get a breach plug to use BH209 for this ML but you would have to have the original machined which is a risk I am not willing to take. A new ML is a better idea. Sorry you lost her. I have 4 days and will be using the Kodiak so I will report how it goes.

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Good luck Zem.  I tried 3 pellets in my Kodiak Magnum, but it seemed to be inconsistent and I got too many fliers.  I agree about the breech plug.  Wish it was as simple as a $36 part.  I like the idea of the BH209 and a bit more velocity.  Let me know how you do.

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11 minutes ago, sbuff said:

You would just need to open up the flame channel to 5/32 and install a vent liner in your plug. Badger Ridge use to modify your plug .

https://www.badgerridgeind.com/store/p70/BPventlinerconversion.html

 I researched this before the season.  It's not worth it to me to have the plug modified.  I don't like the idea of vent liner.  It would be cheaper than replacing the ML!  Thanks anyhow.  I'm leaning toward a CVA Wolf with a factory BH breech plug.

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