Here is where our taxes go for Education

[erussell]

Was in Wally World the other day getting some groceries. The guy in front of me had 3 carts full of food that came to over $400. Paid for it all with food stamps or card or whatever the heck they have now. And here I am working 40hr week and The wife working 32 hrs a week and could barely scrape together $50 to get the essentials. That is where the problem is. My grandmother needs welfare not able bodied people. I would work at MC Donalds before I would get assistance from the gov. I looked up the teachers in my area and dont see where they have any room to complain. Tho I find it funny I have never had a day of college and make almost as much as they do doing less and the PE teacher makes 6 grand more a yr than my Daughters 3rd grade teacher. The super is way over paid to!!! Give him a pay cut and I bet we wouldnt have these stupid votes to buy buses anymore.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I wish I taught in the school districts that you are talking about because I have been teaching for about 12 years and don't make close to those numbers. I work a second job in construction during the summer to live on Long Island just like everyone else. We all pay the same taxes!!! Don't you think that if teachers were not paid well, "Quality" teachers wouldn't be interested. Isn't that true for all professions??? I had a plumber do work in my basement last year. He worked for about 4 hours and I payed him $700 just in labor. He was the cheapest estimate!!!

If educators are so well paid and the benefits are so great (which we pay towards) I encourage all to go through the necessary schooling and get a job in todays education field.

you analogy for the plumber is perfect. The ones that were charging even more than that could go out of business if they are charging a competitive rate. We do not have that luxury with public servants. It should be skills and results based compansation ...just like the private market is. Why is it so much more cost efffective to privatise many of the government functions? Because the govt is bloated and over paying. There should be school vouchers....the prisons will be run by private companies in the next 20 years. (already happening in many states). The best employees should be getting the best money...not the ones with the most years in.

[nyantler]

Here is my real bitch.. not individual salaries necessarily... but, for the sake of argument lets say a principle is worth $100,000... when I was in highschool... there were nearly 2000 students... 9-10th grade... and roughly 25 students per teacher... with one principle and one ass't principle...1 guidance councelor... the same school now has 750 students... 10-12th grade only... 3 principles.. 3 assistants... 4 guidance councelors and the teachers average 12 kids per and the school building is twice as large... so that $100,000 budget for a principle, just went to $300,000 for 3... I was very good at math in school and no matter how many times I go over the numbers they just don't add up... I sometimes wonder how I got such a better education than the kids in the same highschool today... we tested better, we had better sports teams, less kids on ritalin, all with less teachers, less staff, smaller school, and less money spent per student... somebody really needs to explain this one to me... I guess my teachers weren't good enough to make me understand how this kind of math works... I just don't see why everything doubled and tripled except the number of kids which dropped to almost a third of what it was when I went to school there. Must be some crazy kind of union math I've never heard of..

[erussell]

And thats just elem, middle,and high school. What about the SUNY school system.

[nyantler]

And thats just elem, middle,and high school. What about the SUNY school system.

Easy there... I don't want my head to explode!!..LOL

[Pav2704]

Here is my real bitch.. not individual salaries necessarily... but, for the sake of argument lets say a principle is worth $100,000... when I was in highschool... there were nearly 2000 students... 9-10th grade... and roughly 25 students per teacher... with one principle and one ass't principle...1 guidance councelor... the same school now has 750 students... 10-12th grade only... 3 principles.. 3 assistants... 4 guidance councelors and the teachers average 12 kids per and the school building is twice as large... so that $100,000 budget for a principle, just went to $300,000 for 3... I was very good at math in school and no matter how many times I go over the numbers they just don't add up... I sometimes wonder how I got such a better education than the kids in the same highschool today... we tested better, we had better sports teams, less kids on ritalin, all with less teachers, less staff, smaller school, and less money spent per student... somebody really needs to explain this one to me... I guess my teachers weren't good enough to make me understand how this kind of math works... I just don't see why everything doubled and tripled except the number of kids which dropped to almost a third of what it was when I went to school there. Must be some crazy kind of union math I've never heard of..

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

[Culvercreek hunt club]

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

In case geography wasn't taught in the school you attended.....there is a lot more state than LI. And I don't care how you want to doctor the testing as a teacher or keep making claims of all this multitude of standardized testing. The kids today suck in comparison to what used to be the standard. I have a 17yo daughter...a Junior that is sitting in all Senior level and AP courses with a 98 average and my head explodes when I see what they are teaching and what they really know. I am making a general observation from my experiences as a student and a parent.... it doesn't apply to evryone.....Teachers aren't what they used to be...they fall short....and neither are the kids. (asian kids aside...they seem to be driven and that is coming from the homes)

[Dave]

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

Ok, lets quit the BS a pay freeze my but. Even though you may have had a pay freeze you still got step increases so your salaries went up every year. A little know fact that most people don't have any idea of. I guess you don't work only 180 days and have your summers off!!!!!!! Just cut the BS, and stop trying to make like you have the toughtst job around. Funny how children in other states with less resources can score just as high as the LI kids can. My ex is a teacher on the Island I know the deal and" how sweet it is" if you are looking for sympathy, as my father would say, it's in the dictionary between shit and sweat. Really, I will say something you have gaull.

[wooffer]

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

I live on LI and haved never seen any stats showing the schools to be worthy of what they charge. Can you post or pm me the link? I have seen bs stats, like number of kids going to college, etc. Anyone can go to college now, to study anything. Don't get me wrong, I don't put all the blame on the educators.

In fact the school teachers on LI oppose standarized testing. Standarized testing is the only way to get a base line for all schools to be compared to. The facts are that kids today DO NOT compare to students that came before them. The Regents and SAT's are now graded on a curve. That was not done when we went to school.

[pistolp71]

Like a lot of things, this teacher "bashing" is usually driven by jealousy. Yes, it's a good job that pays well, with a lot of days off. It is also available to anyone that wants to go to college for a bunch of years for it.

[wooffer]

Nice defense mechanism, but you are wrong. I am not against anyone doing well. But when it is at the expense of my earnings and my childrens future financial security, then yes I am against it. Did you ever see the facts stated on the attached flyer. Learn the truth and then maybe you'll sing a different tune. A teacher retiring today will cost the taxpayer over $2,000,000.- for the next 30 years of their retirement. WHERE DO YOU THINK THAT MONEY COMES FROM???

It comes from us, my checkbook and money that would have been saved for my childs future.

I have alot of respect for the teachers that taught me. Sadly teachers today are not those people. They are blood suckers who are attracted to hi pay. Teaching paid carp before and as a result attracted people who knew but wanted to work with our kids.

We saw how they reacted in Wisconsin when they tried to reign in spending. Those are teachers, they are thugs with chalk.

PLEASE SAVE OUR SCHOOLS AND OUR CHILDRENS FUTURE BY VOTING….pdf

Edited March 6, 2012 by wooffer

[wooffer]

Ok, lets quit the BS a pay freeze my but. Even though you may have had a pay freeze you still got step increases so your salaries went up every year. A little know fact that most people don't have any idea of. I guess you don't work only 180 days and have your summers off!!!!!!! Just cut the BS, and stop trying to make like you have the toughtst job around. Funny how children in other states with less resources can score just as high as the LI kids can. My ex is a teacher on the Island I know the deal and" how sweet it is" if you are looking for sympathy, as my father would say, it's in the dictionary between shit and sweat. Really, I will say something you have gaull.

Well said Dave, I actually dated a second grade teacher once. She basically admitted what we all we know. She taught a class of 20 kids (not special ed) and had an assistant as well. My 2nd grade teacher taught 30 of us, and did not have an assistant.

[Dave]

Ok, lets quit the BS a pay freeze my but. Even though you may have had a pay freeze you still got step increases so your salaries went up every year. A little know fact that most people don't have any idea of. I guess you don't work only 180 days and have your summers off!!!!!!! Just cut the BS, and stop trying to make like you have the toughtst job around. Funny how children in other states with less resources can score just as high as the LI kids can. My ex is a teacher on the Island I know the deal and" how sweet it is" if you are looking for sympathy, as my father would say, it's in the dictionary between shit and sweat. Really, I will say something you have gaull.

I think I forgot to mention the Holidays they have off that the rest of the working world has to work.

Jewish Holidays

Winter recess

Snow Days.

The Summer from end of June to September.

Christmas Holidays

All this on just a Liberal Arts Degree ????????

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Like a lot of things, this teacher "bashing" is usually driven by jealousy. Yes, it's a good job that pays well, with a lot of days off. It is also available to anyone that wants to go to college for a bunch of years for it.

Personally, I have a case of ass burn for any position that is not evaluated. If a person performs their job well they should keep it and be paid what the market will bare. If they do not perform well ...hit the bricks....Anything other than that is welfare.

[pistolp71]

Personally, I have a case of ass burn for any position that is not evaluated. If a person performs their job well they should keep it and be paid what the market will bare. If they do not perform well ...hit the bricks....Anything other than that is welfare.

Makes sense to me. I would never defend the dead wood. There are people on my job that make the same salary and do next to nothing.

I'd like to stay and chat, but I have to go spend some of my wifes teacher salary. Thanks to Woofer paying her salary of course.

[wooffer]

Very funny.

[pistolp71]

I try. Had to lighten it up a bit.

[wooffer]

Yeh, the topic is a sensative one.

[virgil]

if you are looking for sympathy, as my father would say, it's in the dictionary between shit and sweat. Really, I will say something you have gaull.

Your dad's dictionary was wrong. It's actually a few pages after sweat. Just sayin'.

[ants]

To me the whole point is we're paying this piece of crap a monthly check for rent but he's just gaming the system and spending the money on himself. How many pieces of crap like him are out there??? A WHOLE S--T LOAD!!! If you knew how much fraud like this goes on in the welfare system you would puke....Trust me on this one.

[Pav2704]

To me the whole point is we're paying this piece of crap a monthly check for rent but he's just gaming the system and spending the money on himself. How many pieces of crap like him are out there??? A WHOLE S--T LOAD!!! If you knew how much fraud like this goes on in the welfare system you would puke....Trust me on this one.

That's exactly what I'm trying to figure out? How did that video lead to "Here's where our tax dollars go for education"????

I'm sure we can continue to argue about the details of how great teachers today have it, so I'll end with this. Seven or eight years ago before the economy tanked, everyone was doing great financially. If your family only made 100,000 you were just doing ok during this time period. I knew contractors, realtors, and many other people making well over teacher salaries and no one said crap about teachers. In fact, most people looked down at you if they knew you were a teacher. Now that the pendulum has swung and teachers salaries aren't so bad anymore, we are the ones to blame. Apparently more than the man in that video since this where the discussion has went. Like everything else though, the pendulum will swing back the opposite way! In the meantime though, I will definately enjoy my wife's as well as my "teacher salaries" and "benefits"!!!

[wooffer]

You're comparing apples to oranges. The private sector generates money that keeps the econemy going. The municipal sector generates no money and the larger it gets the more the economy declines. Other differences.

Private sector does not guarantee your job

You get tenure

Private sector does give pensions.

You will receive (depending on your tier) up 50% pay for sitting on your butt.

Your mediocre health insurance in the private sector stops when you stop working

A teachers "premium" health insurance never ends.

If you made $100,000.- six years ago you were in management. If you made that pay, not many people did.

You can teach and make over $100,000. with as little as 7 years experience.

In the private sector you can work 20 years and then get laid off.

You can retire after 20 years and still live well.

In the private sector you can get a pay cut.

Won't happen as a teacher.

You must work full-time in teh private sector, 40+ hours a week and year round.

As a teacher you may teach a maxium of 5 actual hours and only work 180 days a year.

And lastly,

The Governor of NY makes $179,000.00 a year and did NOT take a raise last year. My school’s Superintendent makes $294,000.00 a year, and DID take a raise last year. Go to http://seethroughny.net/payrolls/schools/ to see your teachers and administrators base salaries. Make sure you sitting down, you won’t believe your eyes.

I can write all night but if you don't see the truth now, you never will.

Enjoy your benefits while you can, the NYS pension system does not have the actual money to meet all its comittments for future retires. Looks like we may see you at the future riots screaming for our money.

[First-light]

I've been down this road with you guys so I stayed out of it. Right now NYS is going through changes in education accountability. Administrators are being trained by the state this very minute on a new way of evaluating teachers and school districts. Funding will depend on performance. Pav2704 I hear everything you say cause I've said it hear many times.

[sits in trees]

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

does it really make a differance, the money is gone, unfunded pensions, taxpayers going broke, people foreclosing and running down south, the well is drying up. i agree teachers are well eductated, work with kids that have crap for brains in alot of cases, but the money's done GONE. what to do, keep raising taxes? yea that worked in the past but we are entering different times here folks. something is going to give in a big way and i think NY state will be the first to see it happen..

[nyantler]

That must be an Upstate school or charter school that everyone thinks is great because those "facts" that you provided couldn't be farther from the truth here on Long Island in public schools!!! Most classroom that I teach in average 25 to 30 students and include various types of learning disabilities. Most teachers on Long Island, myself included have taken a pay freeze for the last three years!!! And as far as testing better, that once again couldn't be further from the truth again!!! The students today take many more tests than we ever did growing up and if you check the scores in Newsday, Long Island schools do very well!!!!

What truly amazes me is how ignorant some people really can be!!! There arguments are based on supposed facts that couldn't be further from the truth. Arguments can be comparable to anti-hunter groups!!!

JUST PLAIN IGNORANT!!!!!!!

I still am in total amazement about how the video that started this entire discussion is the "educators" fault????

Spoken like a true teacher..lol... yes it was an upstate public school... one that I attended and one that I currently pay taxes for... sorry that your reality isn't my reality.. my argument is purely based on numbers provided by the school and verified by myself... along with my personal experience having gone to the school 35 years ago... I can't speak to learning disabilities... we didn't have the ones that are common today back in the 70's.. you know?.. laziness, dontfeellikelearninghowtoreadosis, yourworkingmetoohardolepsy, of course the grandaddy of them all ADHD... but I think that's because our parents had the stopwhininganddowhatyouaretold vaccine...lol