Why aren't there elk in new york

[RobC]

We're planning to take a trip to benezette pa to see some elk and it got me thinking with the trip only 115 miles away why aren't there any elk in ny?

[Rev Ev]

My guess would be there isn't enough continuous range for them, with the exception of the Adirondacks. Even there, I imagine with as many private landowners there are they would be against it. Elk can be fairly destructive to crops and landscaping. Still, I would do whatever I could to bring them back. I did a search and found that there was a push in 2006 to bring them back that failed. However the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation (I'm a member and their HQ is in my hometown, definitely a sight to see if you can make it to Missoula MT) did a feasibility study on NY and found that it would be worthwhile to reintroduce them. RMEF has successfully reintroduced them into Ontario.

[RobC]

So are the dec keeping them out of new york or do they just not move up?

[Rev Ev]

Their range in PA has not made it to NY yet, as a herd that is. It is pretty tightly contained in their "elk zone" something like 40 miles south of the NY border.

[erussell]

Shoot, any moose that make it out of the ADK park are instantly shot and the shooter claims " they thought it was a deer ". Happened a few yrs back down here around binghamton NY. I wouldnt think the Elk would fare any better. Not to mention I dont want elk eating up all the Whitetail food around here while we are waiting for them to get to huntable numbers. Would be bad overall in my book.

[Rev Ev]

I could understand not wanting to wait, but depending on how many are released, it could be as soon as 5 years that a lottery could be set up. I think if 50 were released in the Adirondacks, there could be a huntable heard fairly quick. And I might be wrong, but I think that there would be plenty of room for them there. For what its worth, the PA elk are starting to rival the western herds for the top spots in the record books. If you look at top 10,half are from the east now. And that's from reintroducing in just the past 20 years.

[erussell]

Deer have a hard time finding things to eat in the Adk! Moose are aquatic and find it a little easier to find food up there but Elk are like Whitetails they need suitable brows and understory which the ADK does not have. Maybe if it was burned off every once in a while but there isnt enough food in the ADK for Elk. I say we set them free out in WNY so they can eat all their whitetail food.

Edited August 25, 2012 by erussell

[Ford]

I could understand not wanting to wait, but depending on how many are released, it could be as soon as 5 years that a lottery could be set up. I think if 50 were released in the Adirondacks, there could be a huntable heard fairly quick. And I might be wrong, but I think that there would be plenty of room for them there. For what its worth, the PA elk are starting to rival the western herds for the top spots in the record books. If you look at top 10,half are from the east now. And that's from reintroducing in just the past 20 years.

I have always been under the belief that Elk were never that plentiful in the Adirondacks to begin with. I must have read it somewhere a while ago. If that is true, (I guess some digging is in order) there would not really be that much of a huntable population, I would think.

[WNYBuckHunter]

And that's from reintroducing in just the past 20 years.

Actually, they began introducing the in PA in 1913 and the last one was brought in less than 20 years after that. Since then the herd has gone up and down in size but stayed pretty small until 30ish years ago, then it blew up in size to where it is now. From what I have read, they figure it stayed small due to poaching, but once they started studying the herd, it kept the poachers away and they started improving the environment for the elk. Its really a cool story to read up on that shows the positive effects of good management.

[Rev Ev]

Your right, WNY. Moving from TN, I was thinking that the KY and TN herd was done in the 90s. I think Wisconsin's herd was around the same time.

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My thought on the whole thing is this: Conservation. I think as hunters we ought to do all we can to improve and restore the environment and wildlife. I'm not saying hug a tree, but TR set an example that I think is worth following. If we can do something to bring back elk I would be all for it. It probably would impact some whitetail land, but in a larger perspective it would do wonders for the media/general population to see that a group of hunters brought back elk. I don't think it will ever happen in NY because of politics.

[sampotter]

There were elk on the Whitney Park in the ADKS back in the 30s and 40s. The harsh winters killed them off though.

[nybuckboy]

The Catskills would be a better as there is both the mountains and the valleys where cropland is abundant. The PA elk herd is somewhat contained in about a 20 sq mile area about 10 miles SE of St Marys PA.

I've been there 3 different times in recent years. I know the back roads well. There are between 800-1000 and sometimes some are seen as far away as Coudersport PA, about 40 miles from the herd. So they will migrate some and some do get out of the area. When the herd begins to move out of the desired area, helicopters are used to drive them back. Several of the big bulls are collared so they can track the herd.

[covert]

Crossbows and mountain lions.

[Pygmy]

Ya beat me to it, Covert....

Those pumacougars that the state stocked to control the coyote population that they stocked to control the deer population at the behest of the insurance companies, ATE all of the elk.. It's only logical..Elk are a NATURAL prey of them there pumacougars...

[Lawdwaz]

We're planning to take a trip to benezette pa to see some elk and it got me thinking with the trip only 115 miles away why aren't there any elk in ny?

When are you going?

Staying over night? Have a place to recommend?

Do you have a plan of where to view or just runnin' & gunnin'? <grin>

I've been thinking of going this fall also. Take the wife for a quickie overnighter. I checked the Google thing this morning and it is about 150 miles to Benezette PA for me.

Tips, anybody??

[Lawdwaz]

The Catskills would be a better as there is both the mountains and the valleys where cropland is abundant. The PA elk herd is somewhat contained in about a 20 sq mile area about 10 miles SE of St Marys PA.

I've been there 3 different times in recent years. I know the back roads well. There are between 800-1000 and sometimes some are seen as far away as Coudersport PA, about 40 miles from the herd. So they will migrate some and some do get out of the area. When the herd begins to move out of the desired area, helicopters are used to drive them back. Several of the big bulls are collared so they can track the herd.

Note my post above.........pointers, places to hit OR miss?

[WNYBuckHunter]

Covert i just about spit my coffee all over when i read that

[nybuckboy]

Note my post above.........pointers, places to hit OR miss?

This is a real nice old home in St Marys where we always stay. Outdoor pool and about 14 miles north of Benezette. http://cozyafghan.com/Home.html

I will attach some more info below. To see the elk take RT 255 south from St Marys about 7-10 miles and look for a L turn onto Caledonia Rd. Take a L on Mt Zion Rd and just follow the dirt rds to Gray Hill Rd and follow any of the dirt rds up and around and you will come out eventually on Rt 555. Benezette is kinda the hub and the road up to Winslow hill but you can see elk on any of the dirt rds so just drive around. Tip: get there early just after dawn. I've seen 26 one morning 6 big bulls and 6 cows with 6 calves. Eat dinner at the Benezette Hotel and there is a good chance you will see elk right there. Then about an hour before dark head up Winslow Hill Rd. PM me and I send you some pics. Oh yeah avoid the 3rd week in Sept. Winslow hill is a traffic jam Try to go in the first half of Sept.

http://cozyafghan.com/Home.html

[Larry]

There is an electric elk fence on the border then a mine field to keep them out. If that doesn’t keep them out they have Bigfoot or are that feet they trapped and transferred from Washington State to eat them

[Gthphtm]

Well a couple of years on the rout 87 in Hudson Valley.There were pictures of either an Elk or Moose hit and killed on that highway,I forgot which it was.And another case where a bunch 5 or more escaped from a private preserve here in the Catskills.Some were rescued and I think 1 or 2 had to be put down.

[MuzzyLoader]

I thought perhaps the reason there's no elk in NY is because Doc & Bubba shot 'em all!

[BizCT]

The PA elk are huge! Many 8x8's and bigger running around there. The outfitter I hunted deer with in PA showed me videos he took of like 6-7 big bull elks together. All looked to be big 5x5's or bigger!

I just checked his website and he does Elk viewing tours.

"ELK VIEWING: WE HAVE ELK WITHIN 10 MILES OF THE CAMP AND DURING THE SEPTEMBER RUT YOU CAN SEE MANY TROPHY BULLS AND COWS. TOURS CAN BE ARRANGED TO SEE AND BUGLE IN BULLS.."

http://www.littlegeneraloutfitters.com/

Edited August 27, 2012 by Biz-R-OWorld

[G-Man]

The dec ruled out reintroduction in 2006 as farmers would be suffering massive crop damage, they are grazers not browsers like whitetail. i'd rather pay the farmers for damage and re introduce them to native range. and wny has a huge paleontolocical history with most bone remains found in the elma/ east aurora area.