Antler Restrictions - voluntary or otherwise

[Curmudgeon]

Since I am a relative newcomer to this forum, forgive me if I am covering well worn territory.

 

In my neighborhood, there is a large group of hunters that still do those traditional big drives - 20+ people at times. They hunt all around me, kill no does, and shoot every legal buck. The result is that most of the bucks here are small 18 month deer. On my cameras, I have over 10 photos of individual spikes and forkhorns, and only 2 larger deer. The larger deer are not that large.

 

Out of pragmatism, we do not let legal bucks walk by. If we don't kill them the neighbors will. Some of the younger members of that crowd have urged them to not kill every buck. It seems to not have made a difference.

 

If DEC puts an antler restriction in 4F - as they have done immediately to the south - it will probably put the neighbors out of business.

 

What do people think of antler restrictions? Where it is the law, are there decent buck harvests after a few years?

 

 

[TreeGuy]

Dead horse.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Since I am a relative newcomer to this forum, forgive me if I am covering well worn territory.

 

In my neighborhood, there is a large group of hunters that still do those traditional big drives - 20+ people at times. They hunt all around me, kill no does, and shoot every legal buck. The result is that most of the bucks here are small 18 month deer. On my cameras, I have over 10 photos of individual spikes and forkhorns, and only 2 larger deer. The larger deer are not that large.

 

Out of pragmatism, we do not let legal bucks walk by. If we don't kill them the neighbors will. Some of the younger members of that crowd have urged them to not kill every buck. It seems to not have made a difference.

 

If DEC puts an antler restriction in 4F - as they have done immediately to the south - it will probably put the neighbors out of business.

 

What do people think of antler restrictions? Where it is the law, are there decent buck harvests after a few years?

It has been discussed, argued and beat to death over and over and over again on here...lol.

 

I can tell you I am personally seeing a shift in how many think about their taking bucks. Voluntarily. Their are many that probably won't make the move but I am still not a fan of mandatory AR's. I have had a few hunters tell me what you just said. "we do not let legal bucks walk by. If we don't kill them the neighbors will" and I tell them that the only sure way to guarantee that that buck doesn't make it to 2.5 is if YOU shoot it. It has zero chance then.

 

NY's habitat is widely varied as are the deer populations and availability of Doe permits. Out by me a 3 side rule wouldn't protect the majority of the 1.5's I see every year.

[Nomad]

I think you should only be able to shoot young deer the half hour preceding sunrise and the half hour following sunset,only from a stand you place on the property line and right next to the neighbors stand. You must not wear any hunter orange,and must mark the blood trail with survey tape. There did I cover them all?

AR restriction discussions generally go,south fast....

Now where I hunt in 8 several large farms,land owners all have self imposed AR ,it's seem to work well for us. I see more bigger bucks then before ,now we ve been doing it for idk 10 plus years and control miles of prime farm land. Sure there are some gaps in it and I'm sure a few guys get desperate and shoot a young one here and there.

We have an annual meeting of hunters,last one we had 75 plus guys attend,seems to be catching on!

Keep in mind few will kill a big buck each year even under our conditions .

[Culvercreek hunt club]

For anyone out in our area (WNY) our QDMA branch will be having an educational even in January. I will post all the details once they are finalized, but one of the topics we are tossing around is Co-ops. Theory, organizing and how to implement. Good way to get like minded folks all pulling in the same direction.

[gfdeputy2]

Anyone else read this? just saw it this AM it sounds like DEC is thinking about statewide AR's?

http://www.wellsvilledaily.com/article/20141110/SPORTS/141119990/10200/OPINION/?Start=1

Edited November 12, 2014 by gfdeputy2

[steve863]

Good article.  Those with the trophy mindset probably love it that people are giving up hunting.  There will be more deer and land for them to hunt once people give it up.  When I started hunting people were happy with ANY deer they got.  Now you get condemned if you shoot something that doesn't measure up for these clowns.  For me hunting is NOT about antler size and never will be.  And I know that I'm not the only one who thinks that way.  Of course you have others (Place name here_____________) who say that the only thing that deer hunting is about is BIG ANTLERS.  Yeah right, keep dreaming.

 

 

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

 sounds like DEC is thinking about statewide AR's?

http://www.wellsvilledaily.com/article/20141110/SPORTS/141119990/10200/OPINION/?Start=1

 

 I don't read that in the article?

Edited November 12, 2014 by Culvercreek hunt club

[steve863]

 I don't read that in the article?

 

 

Just a brief mention at the very end.

[gfdeputy2]

Just the way he was talking made it sound like they were & he was reasoning against it

maybe just the way I read it?

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I haven't even seen any further expansion discussed for next year.

[BowWeldingJohn]

So beacause a couple guys want to be Trophy hunters. We all have to suffer?

[Culvercreek hunt club]

So beacause a couple guys want to be Trophy hunters. We all have to suffer?

 Don't get your panties in a bunch just yet. I haven't seen anyone even post the DEC's plan to increase the AR areas. Has anyone?

Edited November 12, 2014 by Culvercreek hunt club

[burmjohn]

Since I am a relative newcomer to this forum, forgive me if I am covering well worn territory.

 

In my neighborhood, there is a large group of hunters that still do those traditional big drives - 20+ people at times. They hunt all around me, kill no does, and shoot every legal buck. The result is that most of the bucks here are small 18 month deer. On my cameras, I have over 10 photos of individual spikes and forkhorns, and only 2 larger deer. The larger deer are not that large.

 

Out of pragmatism, we do not let legal bucks walk by. If we don't kill them the neighbors will. Some of the younger members of that crowd have urged them to not kill every buck. It seems to not have made a difference.

 

If DEC puts an antler restriction in 4F - as they have done immediately to the south - it will probably put the neighbors out of business.

 

What do people think of antler restrictions? Where it is the law, are there decent buck harvests after a few years?

 

In your case, mandatory AR's would help as it did in every other area it was implemented. 

[burmjohn]

So beacause a couple guys want to be Trophy hunters. We all have to suffer?

 

If it was about Trophy Hunting the restrictions would be far greater. 

[gfdeputy2]

Sorry I did not mean to rile people up just a story like this out of the blue I was wondering if this was something DEC was actually considering

 

 

If it was about Trophy Hunting the restrictions would be far greater. 

 

Agree
 

Edited November 12, 2014 by gfdeputy2

[Five Seasons]

self imposed limits have to be followed by all hunters in the area or they don't work. I always say let the youth shoot what they can though.

 

It's a heated topic but mostly because we're all so passionate about it. Not a bad thing. Depending on the size of your property all you can really control is your land. Make it appealing to deer. Have some sanctuary bedding areas that you don't hunt. Some good food sources (apples, food plots etc) and water. Keep it logged to avoid the hard woods that deer avoid when the guns go off. that can help hold them.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Just a brief mention at the very end.

I saw that but they didn't reference any source.

[burmjohn]

Just a brief mention at the very end.

 

That wouldn't happen anyways at least in it's current form, it wouldn't make sense. 

[monkeyman2269]

I personally won't shoot anything smaller than a six. On the land I hunt but others shoot whatever walks by

[blackradio]

If you let the small bucks walk, the other hunters may or may not shoot them.

 

If you kill them, then then definitely won't have a chance to grow big.

[BUCKANDAQUARTER]

It is difficult for me to commit to shooting 2.5yr and older deer since most in my area shoot any legal buck. I would much rather take a deer with more meat on it. I got my first bow buck last year, 1.5yr 8pt. I would have let it walk because it wasn't big bodied, but I know anyone would have corked him just because he was an 8. I would rather have shot a 160# spike. Double standard, I know. Other than that I would let a 1.5 yr walk.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I personally won't shoot anything smaller than a six. On the land I hunt but others shoot whatever walks by

But in reality what is the real difference between the 1.5 year old 6 or the 1.5 year old spike? (besides 4 points)

[coonhunter]

Curmudgen, I am in 4F in the township of Edmeston. The property I hunt, and quite a bit of the surrounding properties have been letting the young bucks walk for several years. There are always at least 2 or 3 mature bucks in the area. These are by no means rules or mandatory. Just a bunch of hunters that have killed a lot of bucks over the years. Any youngster gets a free pass, as well as hunters that just want the meat. Fortunately, 4F is back giving out doe tags so they can get their meat that way if they so choose.

 

The biggest drawback to having some nice bucks is that everyone posts up their land and more people quit hunting. My farm is not posted, but a lot of the other land is. I can't fault people for wanting to have good hunting, but there are a lot of properties that only have a couple guys hunting that could easily be hunted by a half dozen without crowding at all. In the end, not enough does get shot in a lot of areas, and the population gets out of hand.

 

It's a tough call with posting property because we have all seen how some hunters are just too greedy and inconsiderate of the landowner and other hunters. I am fortunate in the fact that my woods are a long way off the road and uphill, so the numbers have never gotten very high. The farmer does not allow 4 wheelers at all, and this is the one thing that keeps it pretty quiet. I would like to say it will always be open, but I have never had to deal with the inconsiderate hunters that others deal with all the time.

[Grizz1219]

For me, I try to shoot 6 pt or better... Hence my rifle tag usually becomes a either permit during BP... I shoot a lot of does... Not many bucks make my 6 pt rule..