New to rifles

[reeltime]

If you shoot behind the shoulder, thru the ribcage, roughly 1/3 will drop dead on the spot.  Bullet or caliber is not as critical as time of arrival.  If the bullet hits on the pressure stroke of the heart, the cardiovascular system can't handle the pressure shock and the lights go out immediately.  That is why some will drop with a .243, while others will run off a short distance when hit in the same spot with a 300 win mag.   The shoulder blade puts them down on the spot every time, with pretty much any centerfire caliber or bullet. 

 

bullets time of arrival and pressure stroke of the heart?  I have heard allot of crazy things about deer shot placement but I have to say that right there takes the cake!  

 

whether a deer drops in its tracks or runs depends on many factors, bullet placement, displaced/transferred energy, physical damage results and also the individual deer.

 

fully alert deer, and or deer running with a center rib shot, lungs liver are likely to bolt after a shot that that goes through with little energy transfer. with a faster, lighter bullet .243, 22-250, 222, 220 swift where you may not get an exit hole the entire energy load is transferred to the animal so you not only get the physical damage but all of the kinetic energy transfer.  some deer will run, some will not,  no possible way to put a number on how many will run -vs- drop.  

 

break the shoulders and you will likely drop the deer on the spot, same as a well placed center line base of the neck shot, both are causing catastrophic physical damage to skeletal structure, whether it be shoulder blades or cervical spine in the neck.  shoulder shots provide more room for error than the neck shot but either will work to anchor a deer on the spot.  

 

 

no matter where or with what you shoot a deer with you are going to have some loss of meat, granted some shots will obviously cause a greater loss of meat but one thing for is for certain, you shoot them in the highest probability of anchoring on the spot and you may loose a few pounds of meat, you hit them in a spot where they may run 60-100,,,150 yards and you MAY end up loosing all of the meat because someone else gets the deer.

[Buckmaster7600]

There is one way and one way only for instant incapacitation that is a disruption of the central nervous system "CNS" this is can be obtained via a direct impact or hydrostatic shock. A high shoulder impact will most likely "drop" a deer but often requires a second shot or a little time for the animal to die. With a shot behind the shoulder to the vitals the animal will be dead very soon but may run a distance often determined by terrain.

[Pygmy]

Well said....I have said the same thing many times, just not as WELL as 7600 said it..

 

Of all of the animals I have shot and have SEEN shot, the only ones that drop at the shot were either hit in or NEAR the CNS or a major skeletal structural area, like shoulders or leg bones..

 

I butcher all of my own game and  enjoy studying the terminal effects...A bullet passing close to but not breaking the spine will often drop an animal from hydrostatic shock ( such as a high lung shot) and the animal dies from  blood loss from the lung shot before it can recover from the shock

[BBDEric]

I will drop them where the stand everytime.

[Five Seasons]

I will drop them where the stand everytime.

You're bad ass

[The_Real_TCIII]

I hit a doe high shoulder with a slug once and she tipped over like a decoy, legs straight out and stiff, i could have stood her back up

[WNYBuckHunter]

What gun are you using that "double lung" hits are 150 yd track jobs? I'm very curious... My brother and father both shot deer yesterday through lungs and they went 60 and 50yds. What bullet do you use?

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Mine is a 308 using 150 grain Federal Fusions. His was a 30-06 IIRC. Not sure what bullet.

 

Ive had the same result with shotguns (12 and 20 ga) and 50 cal muzzle loaders. Using Remington Copper Solids, Hornady SSTs and Remigton sluggers.

 

BTW, someone mentioned terrain, the doe I shot that ran 150 yards went uphill for 100 of those yards, then flat land for the final 50.

[the_narrows]

To me, double-lung, is the most ethical shot.  It's high-probability and quick-acting, and usually does not require tracking in excess of 50-60 yards. Neck and shoulder shots can be ethical for a few, but the significant majority of hunters I know should be shooting center-mass.  I consider head shots unethical and wouldn't hunt with someone taking them.

 

For myself, if I can't get a clean double-lung shot, I'll tip my hat and wish the deer a good day.  

[nobody]

 Sometimes a hi velocity rifle round can and has happened to people that when the round hits the shoulder bone, they have blown up.

 Always go for behind the shoulders to get the major organs involved , heart ect.

 

 Good Luck,

 Froggy        ( A 270 Winchester user. )

[Elmo]

Sometimes a hi velocity rifle round can and has happened to people that when the round hits the shoulder bone, they have blown up.

Just pick a more suitable bullet construct.

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[chas0218]

Just pick a more suitable bullet construct.

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I agree, I had a .270 round shrapnel at 60 yards hitting the ridge on the scapula of the shoulder blade. It was because my bullet was going too fast for the yardage. Although I doubt many other bullets would have held up.

 

The base held up but the front ballistic cavity broke apart.

 

60 yards:

 

160 Yards same bullet, powder, and powder gr.:

[wildcat junkie]

This is a good question for first time rifle hunters like myself. I figure right behind the shoulder like I did with my shot gun will get the job done. But it would be cool to just DROP one in his tracks or dead right there. Using a 7mm-08 with 140gr. nosler ballistic tip ammo. From all you long time rifle hunters, where do I want to hit them to have them DRT???? 

 

I tuck the crosshairs right up behind the shoulder joint in the pocket formed by the scapula & the leg. The vertical crosshair would be in line with the front leg. A hit right there takes out both lungs & the major arteries off the top of the heart. If they do run, it isn't more than 10-15 yards. A bit low is a heart shot. A little high is in the shoulder/spine.(DRT) A little forward & it breaks the shoulder & still gets some lung. (DRT) Hit a little back & it still gets both lungs.

 

That's a little more forward that I would shoot with a bow as I would want to avoid hitting bone with a bow. With a rifle, it is the "high percentage" shot.

[wildcat junkie]

I agree, I had a .270 round shrapnel at 60 yards hitting the ridge on the scapula of the shoulder blade. It was because my bullet was going too fast for the yardage. Although I doubt many other bullets would have held up.

 

The base held up but the front ballistic cavity broke apart.

 

60 yards:

 

 

 

Hornady 139 gr .284 Interbond. Mv 3150 fps, 30 yds impact quartering on right through the heavy part of the scapula of a 160# dressed weight doe. 86% weighty retention, expanded to .795". Bullet penetrated all the way to the hide on the off side hind leg.

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2016 by wildcat junkie

[turkeyfeathers]

Hornady 139 gr .284 Interbond. Mv 3150 fps, 30 yds impact quartering on right through the heavy part of the scapula of a 160# dressed weight doe. 86% weighty retention, expanded to .795". Bullet penetrated all the way to the hide on the off side hind leg.

160 pound field dressed doe ? Hmm , processor I took my deer to has been butchering deer for 30 years. Largest doe ever : 143. 2nd largest doe 127 pounds. You sir shot a Holstein Edited January 4, 2016 by turkeyfeathers

[chas0218]

Hornady 139 gr .284 Interbond. Mv 3150 fps, 30 yds impact quartering on right through the heavy part of the scapula of a 160# dressed weight doe. 86% weighty retention, expanded to .795". Bullet penetrated all the way to the hide on the off side hind leg.

 

 

 

Hornady makes a good bullet I tried the ballistic tip 130gr. sst and had more shrapnel than the nosler 130gr. BTBT. Also the nosler were a much tighter group. My MV is around 3300+ fps (3300 was my slowest reading.)

[Buckmaster7600]

An impact velocity over 3000fps is asking a lot of a bullet. That's one of the reasons I don't carry my 270 anymore I had a few issues with bullets not staying together. Never had the same issues with anything under 3000fps mv.

[wildcat junkie]

160 pound field dressed doe ? Hmm , processor I took my deer to has been butchering deer for 30 years. Largest doe ever : 143. 2nd largest doe 127 pounds. You sir shot a Holstein

 

In 1999 we were seeing a large track from a deformed hoof. From the size of it we assumed it was a big buck. I shot the doe in the post above in 2003, 4 years later. She turned out to be the "large buck" with the deformed hoof.

 

A cloth tape measure pulled tight around her chest measured just over 42".

 

We have another big doe running around on our place. I saw her one evening along with a 7-point buck that was later killed that dressed 135#. She was huge compared to that buck & she was standing 50 yards behind the buck when I saw them.

 

A friend saw her the  morning after Thanksgiving & described her as looking like a small horse.

Edited January 4, 2016 by wildcat junkie

[wildcat junkie]

Hornady makes a good bullet I tried the ballistic tip 130gr. sst and had more shrapnel than the nosler 130gr. BTBT. Also the nosler were a much tighter group. My MV is around 3300+ fps (3300 was my slowest reading.)

 

I had similar experience with the SSTs. The Interbonds don't group as well as either the Nosler Accubond or Ballistic tips but they group well enough & their ternminal performance is better than either. I like the 140gr Ballistic tips when Mv is less than 3000 fps. The SSTs are crap giving poor accuracy & they shed the cores far too easily.

 

Interbonds group just over 1" at 100 yds.

[wildcat junkie]

A 168# doe once won the big deer contest (muzzleloader catagory) at an Indiana gun shop back in the 1980s.

[turkeyfeathers]

A 168# doe once won the big deer contest (muzzleloader catagory) at an Indiana gun shop back in the 1980s.

And 200 + pound and bigger  bucks are routinely shot in other states. Just checked my drivers license , it says New York.

[wildcat junkie]

And 200 + pound and bigger  bucks are routinely shot in other states. Just checked my drivers license , it says New York.

 

And in 2004 I shot a 4 1/2 year old 219# 4-point buck on my place. Might have been one of her fawns in 2000.

 

 

 

 

So what's your point?

 

[turkeyfeathers]

So what's your point?

 

That the 168 pound doe you said was shot in Indiana  .Other states produce larger deer sometimes and sometimes smaller species of other things. . Southern states have smaller eastern coyotes, Missouri has 30 pound Eastern turkeys etc. 

[wildcat junkie]

So what's your point?

 

That the 168 pound doe you said was shot in Indiana  .Other states produce larger deer sometimes and sometimes smaller species of other things. . Southern states have smaller eastern coyotes, Missouri has 30 pound Eastern turkeys etc. 

 

The point is someone questioned that I shot a 160# doe on my place. 200# bucks turn up with some frequency around here. Every few years or so.

Edited January 4, 2016 by wildcat junkie