Interesting story on a violation

[SteveB]

3 hours ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

Yup..save the babies!

Yup - so they can be targeted as a young teenager (aka 2.5 buck) resulting in almost no real increase in 4.5 and older.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

2 minutes ago, SteveB said:

Yup - so they can be targeted as a young teenager (aka 2.5 buck) resulting in almost no real increase in 4.5 and older.

Wrong. Many smartin up quick from 1.5 to 2.5 and many will continue to live on into 4.5.  Worse case is they are bigger in both rack and body from baby to 2.5 so still equals a positive.

[TreeGuy]

If you target the smallest legal bucks possible, than yes. 2.5 will be a "target" buck.

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[Four Season Whitetail's]

2 minutes ago, TreeGuy said:

If you target the smallest legal bucks possible, than yes. 2.5 will be a "target" buck.

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True That...And many will make it to 3.5 and up after getting past their first stupid baby years.  Positive all the way around.

[TreeGuy]

I'm not gonna sweat ars personally, but why is it so hard to swallow for some ? How can you say it's wrong for the Dec to determine what we can and can't shoot... That's how it is now !? Why aren't there long drawn out post about "only" 2 buck tags, or why we can't have a longer season ? Don't sweat it, most of us will prob never see ARs in our hunting career.

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[Four Season Whitetail's]

2 minutes ago, TreeGuy said:

I'm not gonna sweat ars personally, but why is it so hard to swallow for some ? How can you say it's wrong for the Dec to determine what we can and can't shoot... That's how it is now !? Why aren't there long drawn out post about "only" 2 buck tags, or why we can't have a longer season ? Don't sweat it, most of us will prob never see ARs in our hunting career.

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Not so sure. many keep pushing for them every year. I also see where Pa is now in talks of adding a 1 buck a season law on top of their successful Ar laws.   I am sure the hunters pushing for better hunting will be showing Ny rule makers how well things are turning out just a few hours away.

We will keep the push with more hunter signatures.

[goosifer]

13 minutes ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

Not so sure. many keep pushing for them every year. I also see where Pa is now in talks of adding a 1 buck a season law on top of their successful Ar laws.   I am sure the hunters pushing for better hunting will be showing Ny rule makers how well things are turning out just a few hours away.

We will keep the push with more hunter signatures.

Why does the [DEC?][lawmakers?] keep pushing for more ARs or harvest limits, in your opinion? Is it really because of low deer population levels in certain areas? Money grab via fees? Indirect anti-gun sentiment? It seems to me a declining hunter population is also a concerning issue, but I don't see the DEC or lawmakers doing anything about that. I just don't understand what is driving these things.

[helmut in the bush]

If you can't tell if a deer is legal, don't shoot, you shouldn't shoot little bucks anyhow, they'er way more interesting with bigger racks. It's like shooting into a flock of ducks you can't identify when you have your limit of Hen Mallards.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

3 minutes ago, goosifer said:

Why does the [DEC?][lawmakers?] keep pushing for more ARs or harvest limits, in your opinion? Is it really because of low deer population levels in certain areas? Money grab via fees? Indirect anti-gun sentiment? It seems to me a declining hunter population is also a concerning issue, but I don't see the DEC or lawmakers doing anything about that. I just don't understand what is driving these things.

I believe in todays world it is all about the inches when it comes to deer. Most hunters that are left are hunters that want the best of the best and that is what they are pushing along to their kids that become hunters.  The increasing age of hunters is pushing many to the side and hanging up the weapon. The DEC can make very good if not great deer hunting in most parts of the states with some season and buck harvest changes and they can still get their needed number of does killed of with the antlerless tags in muzzy/bow along with dmap's.

It can be done. Some wont be happy but in the big picture the DEC will cater to the masses.  And hunters that have poor hunting can travel very little and find great hunting.

[Dom]

How many button Bucks are shot every season I have a tag either sex for bow and muzzle loading and if I am not able to kill harvest a buck of required my regular season tag can be used for either sex again.If you want to hunt bigger deer that is your choice and should not be what tha state says you can take as the deer of your liking for some its antlers and some it's food for family or donations I buy the license/tag it becomes my choice

[Four Season Whitetail's]

15 minutes ago, Dom said:

How many button Bucks are shot every season I have a tag either sex for bow and muzzle loading and if I am not able to kill harvest a buck of required my regular season tag can be used for either sex again.If you want to hunt bigger deer that is your choice and should not be what tha state says you can take as the deer of your liking for some its antlers and some it's food for family or donations I buy the license/tag it becomes my choice

You mean like your buck tag has to be on a buck with 3 inches or better?  Your Choice?  I think Not!

Buck tag would be buck tag and there would be no use in late season. Buttons will be taken every year for sure but unlike a few on here, most hunters will let those 50lbs babies that give ya a few sandwiches the pass. Plus they would only be taken during bow/muzzy where there are less hunters.

[Doc]

14 hours ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

Its a law to save young bucks so they can mature. If you have to spot test one that bad its probably 1 of 2 things.....Its not big enough to meet the law or its a risky shot to begin with. To fast or to much brush.

Yup..save the babies!

It sounds like another avenue to collect fines, or add to the complexity of the law to frustrate hunters (an anti-hunting reference there ....lol). I have had situations where the point count was not all that simple, and that had nothing to do with speed or brush. Here again is just another unnecessary complication of the law because some hunters are overly concerned about what other hunters are perfectly happy with.

[Doc]

9 hours ago, Four Season Whitetails said:

I believe in todays world it is all about the inches when it comes to deer. Most hunters that are left are hunters that want the best of the best and that is what they are pushing along to their kids that become hunters.  The increasing age of hunters is pushing many to the side and hanging up the weapon. The DEC can make very good if not great deer hunting in most parts of the states with some season and buck harvest changes and they can still get their needed number of does killed of with the antlerless tags in muzzy/bow along with dmap's.

It can be done. Some wont be happy but in the big picture the DEC will cater to the masses.  And hunters that have poor hunting can travel very little and find great hunting.

Have you noticed that your push for AR is all based on your own personal preferences and philosophies on hunting. And that is fine. You are free to set whatever personal goals you think you need.

Fortunately, it appears that the majority of hunters seem to value having choices as to what they consider to be a satisfactory harvest. There are even some that think the hunting in NYS is already damn good and likely will stay that way if we can keep the armchair fad-managers from mucking things up with their latest brain-fart restrictions to heap on the backs of everyone else.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

Have you noticed that your push for AR is all based on your own personal preferences and philosophies on hunting. And that is fine. You are free to set whatever personal goals you think you need.

Fortunately, it appears that the majority of hunters seem to value having choices as to what they consider to be a satisfactory harvest. There are even some that think the hunting in NYS is already damn good and likely will stay that way if we can keep the armchair fad-managers from mucking things up with their latest brain-fart restrictions to heap on the backs of everyone else.

Yeah Ok.  If you get your head out of the sand and look a the big picture you will see that huntnig today is all about the bigger the better.I am just one of most. Your still stuck back in the old days of hunting and dont worry as you can still get all the meat you will ever need.  Cant eat the horns remember so might as well make the bodies bigger than those 100lbs baby bucks.

If you are having a hard time seeing points in your hunting as you say then you a probably looking at a baby buck that will most likely be off limits.  I find it funny how some say they have a hard time? I hunt every day of every season and i very rarely have that problem and even not seeing the head one can se that they are looking at a little very young animal?

[gjs4]

So, is that the purpose of AR? ..... to let more legal bucks escape? I didn't realize that, but I'll bet it frequently does work out that way. So it is a law to confound hunters. I wonder if it is backed by PETA. It seems like they would love it.

Have you ever gone fishing?


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[YFKI1983]

I'm glad we're all in agreement

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[WNYBuckHunter]

16 hours ago, TreeGuy said:

If you target the smallest legal bucks possible, than yes. 2.5 will be a "target" buck.

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With a 3 per side or even a 4 per side restriction, many 1.5s are still going to get shot.

[dbHunterNY]

15 hours ago, goosifer said:

Why does the [DEC?][lawmakers?] keep pushing for more ARs or harvest limits, in your opinion? Is it really because of low deer population levels in certain areas? Money grab via fees? Indirect anti-gun sentiment? It seems to me a declining hunter population is also a concerning issue, but I don't see the DEC or lawmakers doing anything about that. I just don't understand what is driving these things.

Being plugged into the AR crowd and DEC.  it doesn't seem to be any of that with ARs.  it's not driven by insurance, money, or any conspiracy like that.  heck DEC's confidence in outcomes of citizen task force meetings to come up with buck take objective is even diminishing. It just a large group of outspoken hunters from particular areas of the state that have higher % of yearlings taken and don't see numbers or age structure that's seen in other places. you can't just say go find them. they're around.  some areas in this state simply don't have "big" or older bucks in any noticeable numbers. In areas with higher numbers of hunters and less bucks per square mile it's practically impossible to be conservation minded, pass young bucks, and truly think it probably won't get shot.

DEC is very much handcuffed by politics and general public desires, both hunter and anti-hunter. Lawmakers are only plugged into those squeaky wheels that talk to them.  I mean they've got all types of interests flying at them from all directions.  Hunting is a small percentage here in NY.

[dbHunterNY]

28 minutes ago, WNYBuckHunter said:

With a 3 per side or even a 4 per side restriction, many 1.5s are still going to get shot.

I don't think it'd be so much of a wash. hunter that shoots the yearling 8 pointer after restrictions would be one that'd shoot it now anyway.  if he/she's selectively harvesting yearlings based on antlers their misguided anyway.  the thing about harvest data is it evens out the people that would pass that yearling 8 with those that say an 8 is an 8 or just don't care how many points it has.  by design going off DEC harvest data AR's could protect enough in any part of the state. even then it's not a set them and forget them restriction.  it'd be monitored year to year and changed accordingly say every few years or longer.  that is if DEC was to have control over them.  hell if that was the case DEC could have them 3" of antler on one side for your area and it'd be "no change".  I don't believe how close minded people are to this type "restriction" statewide, because crap showed up from a politician in the form of a bill that never went anywhere, as if it was the only way to do it.

[WNYBuckHunter]

23 minutes ago, dbHunterNY said:

I don't think it'd be so much of a wash. hunter that shoots the yearling 8 pointer after restrictions would be one that'd shoot it now anyway.  if he/she's selectively harvesting yearlings based on antlers their misguided anyway.  the thing about harvest data is it evens out the people that would pass that yearling 8 with those that say an 8 is an 8 or just don't care how many points it has.  by design going off DEC harvest data AR's could protect enough in any part of the state. even then it's not a set them and forget them restriction.  it'd be monitored year to year and changed accordingly say every few years or longer.  that is if DEC was to have control over them.  hell if that was the case DEC could have them 3" of antler on one side for your area and it'd be "no change".  I don't believe how close minded people are to this type "restriction" statewide, because crap showed up from a politician in the form of a bill that never went anywhere, as if it was the only way to do it.

That is just simply not true. Things are vastly different across many parts of the state, for a variety of reasons.

I am personally against ARs because it is just another way that people are pushing their way of hunting on others, which I do not see as being right or fair. Would it affect my personal hunting? Most likely not, unless we are talking about large, more mature 6 points under a 4 on a side restriction, which is the only way it would accomplish anything in this area. I would much rather see the DEC continue with their education on the benefits of passing young deer, and leave the choice to the hunter.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

22 minutes ago, WNYBuckHunter said:

That is just simply not true. Things are vastly different across many parts of the state, for a variety of reasons.

I am personally against ARs because it is just another way that people are pushing their way of hunting on others, which I do not see as being right or fair. Would it affect my personal hunting? Most likely not, unless we are talking about large, more mature 6 points under a 4 on a side restriction, which is the only way it would accomplish anything in this area. I would much rather see the DEC continue with their education on the benefits of passing young deer, and leave the choice to the hunter.

If we were a 1 buck a season or a must report and mail back old tags i would not believe Ar would be needed either. 

2-3 yearlings and 1 mature buck makes up many a hunters season and that is either using their tags or others.  That is way to many bucks not needed in areas where doe take is needed. Of course all parts of the state wont be the same but close good hunting can be found not far from any.

And again the old saying..Cant eat the antlers>. Should not matter to them if they dont kill that spike or 4 pointer?

[dbHunterNY]

2 minutes ago, WNYBuckHunter said:

That is just simply not true. Things are vastly different across many parts of the state, for a variety of reasons.

I am personally against ARs because it is just another way that people are pushing their way of hunting on others, which I do not see as being right or fair. Would it affect my personal hunting? Most likely not, unless we are talking about large, more mature 6 points under a 4 on a side restriction, which is the only way it would accomplish anything in this area. I would much rather see the DEC continue with their education on the benefits of passing young deer, and leave the choice to the hunter.

harvest data is always used to implement management tools and make decisions, both on the state level down to a small group of hunters or landowners. setting the bar of what's "enough" protected would be based on other things too if that's what you're getting at with semantics.

I would much rather DEC continue their efforts with education regardless of the outcome.  Little disappointed it's taken years worth of an AR pissing match to get more of that education, something beyond having to do obscure google searches to find info of interest, buried within the DEC web domain.

[Five Seasons]

a few years back i forgot to call in a doe i shot. she was harvested legally and taged. When i remembered it was past the deadline so I went online and searched frantically to see if there were any exceptions. After all, I assume they want honest data for better or worse. All I could find was the strict reporting time frame. 

I was still tempted to report it as I feel the dec is too high on their doe numbers in my area and data like this will help better educate them. However, for fear of stories like the one posted I didn't. And honestly that's a sad state to live in.

[Five Seasons]

something else kinda funny is 40 yards from his house. that's like in your back yard lol.

[SteveB]

I agree - end of season reporting status of all tags for that season. 2 hrs, 2 days 2 weeks don't matter - totals do.