Paper tuning question

[2012_taco]

I can't get a clean paper shot. I always get a right tear. i just had the string and cables replaced and tuned up. (thanks Tacks !) I moved my rest a tad to the left , it got a little better so I moved it a little more, no change. I was reading that it could be over spined arrows?  I used luninocks so I have weighted practice tips, should I try adding weight to the tip? I did check my FOC and its not perfect but it does have some FOC, I don't remember the actual numbers. I use 100 gr tips/BHs maybe i can try using a 125gr tip? Previous years I've tried walk back tuning and it just drove me crazy! I've never been able to get field tips fly the same as my BHs. I've been told it's my form but I've been shooting for years and i don't think i can change?

I'll try to post a pic of the paper.

Second picture is sideways, tear is actually a right tear.

Edited August 20, 2018 by 2012_taco
Added pics, spelling

[Jeremy K]

Adding weight to the tip should be the easiest way to see if you're over spined.

What are the bow specs and arrow spine?

Edited August 20, 2018 by Jeremy K

[tommyc50]

yeah my problem started when I came down with diabetes it effected my eyes and I don't know why but all of a sudden I had to turn my face and anchor on the left side of my nose [I shoot righthanded] and that was just to see the pins thru the peep and I wasn't even in the bullseye I had to move the bow arm trying to get  pin on the bullseye, I was so frustrated I gave up shooting ,This was with 2 bows I have so I couldn't understand what happened .I use to shot so well 20-30-40 yds all I had to do was anchor @ my ear put the string on the tip of my nose and let her rip.But the guy @ my bow shop help me and adjusted the bow one shot and he said dead center I said I know I seen everything line up when I shot. look on the bow tuning post on here and see if it is the arrow or bow or you , there's a lot of info on there. hope you correct the problem I know how frustrating it is and shooting is something I love to do and I do it to relax and it hurt so bad and no way was I going to hunt and take a shot @ a deer know my shooting wasn't up to par.

[rob-c]

Bow make , poundage  and draw length. arrow spine and brand of arrow  please .. 

[2012_taco]

12 hours ago, Jeremy K said:

Adding weight to the tip should be the easiest way to see if you're over spined.

What are the bow specs and arrow spine?

2013 Elite hunter set at 65lbs. 29" draw length, arrows are Gold tip 340 with 100 gr heads.

[Lawdwaz]

I’d like to shoot mine through your paper. I think you’ll be thrilled with yours........

[Doewhacker]

You could try with a regular nock too. 

Weight on the back makes the arrow react as if over spined, so to counter act you can add weight up front or switch out nocks. 

I used lead sinkers I had so I didn’t have to buy all new broad heads. I weighed them and smashed them down to proper size then ran them down in and glued in place. Did wonders for me to add 25 grains. 

I shoot a set up about the same as yours. 

[2012_taco]

I threw on some 125 gr field points and I believe my tear got worse! I switched to normal nocks with 100 gr FPs that seems to be ok, but still getting a right tear.

Lawd, come on over we can shoot your bow through paper.

[moog5050]

Taco

2 questions:

1.  What is the current measurement of your rest centershot?

2.  As currently set, do the arrow, string and pins all line up when viewed from behind?

could be bow torque based on grip position.   Might be worth eliminating that possibility by letting someone else try a shot or 2 through paper and see how it looks. 

Edited August 21, 2018 by moog5050

[NFA-ADK]

Video yourself shooting so you can look at your form, sometimes you will pick something up you should not be doing.  Elite bows have great draw cycle but you have to keep on target after the shot.  (Follow through.)

I would also question the distance you have the paper tune setup.  To often people have it to close. 

Sometimes due to form you might never be able to get a good paper tune.    

Edited August 21, 2018 by NFA-ADK

[Lawdwaz]

40 minutes ago, 2012_taco said:

I threw on some 125 gr field points and I believe my tear got worse! I switched to normal nocks with 100 gr FPs that seems to be ok, but still getting a right tear.

Lawd, come on over we can shoot your bow through paper.

Tomorrow after work OK??

[moog5050]

Assuming it’s not form taco, here are my suggestions.  

1. Confirm CS is set at 7/8”.

2.  Confirm shims on cams are set so that thinner shim is on right/cable side of Cam.  If not, flip the shims.  Moving cams in same direction as tear will help straighten the tear.  

3.   I think 340 with 125 should be good but you may want to try 400 spine if you have them. 

Adjusting shims will make the most dramatic difference but requires a press.  I confirmed this with Breathn who many many people pay plenty to tune their bows.  He knows his stuff.  When I am stuck, I ask him.  

[Jeremy K]

Does the hunter have the ability to twist the cable guide to change cam lean ?

[rob-c]

One thing you may want to try first is rotating your cable rod to the 3 o’clock position to see if this helps your tear. plus pay a lot of attention to your grip . can you attach a laser pointer to your stabilizer ? If so put the dot on the wall and draw your bow watching the dot to see if your inducing alot of torque in the riser..

Also what arrow rest are you using ? and can you get a 400 spine arrow to try ? 

Edited August 21, 2018 by rob-c

[Jeremy K]

I'm shooting some 400g Axis ,I can give you one to try . I'm running an inch shorter though.

[2012_taco]

10 hours ago, moog5050 said:

Taco

2 questions:

1.  What is the current measurement of your rest centershot?

2.  As currently set, do the arrow, string and pins all line up when viewed from behind?

could be bow torque based on grip position.   Might be worth eliminating that possibility by letting someone else try a shot or 2 through paper and see how it looks. 

 don't know the measurement? Tacks set it up and everything was good. I'm pretty sure it's my form as I always get a right tear and years ago when having other bows tuned and paper shot at Nick's, Roy would get a perfect tear and i would shoot it and get a right tear. He would say it's my grip that  I need more thumb pressure. I never could get it right. It's probably because I'm left handed shooting right handed? I am right eyed.

[2012_taco]

10 hours ago, Lawdwaz said:

Tomorrow after work OK??

I should be here

[moog5050]

2 hours ago, 2012_taco said:

 don't know the measurement? Tacks set it up and everything was good. I'm pretty sure it's my form as I always get a right tear and years ago when having other bows tuned and paper shot at Nick's, Roy would get a perfect tear and i would shoot it and get a right tear. He would say it's my grip that  I need more thumb pressure. I never could get it right. It's probably because I'm left handed shooting right handed? I am right eyed.

Well shoot Taco, you already knew your answer

[NFA-ADK]

Not sure I would use a 400 spine as you are right on the border.

I shoot 65lbs at 28.5 inches and I am just within the border of using 400 spines.  A good bow tech can set up the bow in a vise and paper tune the bow for a perfect shot, then you have to perfect your form.  Typically this is how I start off and the paper tune only requires minor adjustments. 

Watch your bow hand, make sure you are not gripping the bow, keep it loose so you don't torch it.  Possibly try other arrows to see if it make a difference, different weights, I would stick with 340's with that set up. 

You could also have another shooter with the same draw length and good form try it to see if it is something with your form and not the bow. 

Good luck and don't get to crazy with this.  I found that if the bow shoot straight out to 80 yards the deer don't care if its tune properly.  

 

Typically how I tune.  After setting up factory specs (If I can't have it tuned in a vice.).  I will do a paper tune and get it as close as possible if I can't get it perfect.  Then I will set up at 10 yards center shot then out to 60-80 yards and fine tune the center shot, then back to 10 yards. 

If the bow hits perfect center shot at 5 - 80 yards I am good, then I test broad heads and tune for them, keeping the bow set up for hunting.   

[2012_taco]

Shot at "the academy" last night and bow shoots good. Even out to 50 yds although i do see an occasional corkscrewing arrow in flight. I have to assume it's my form. 

Thanks for the help! When tacks gets back we'll go over the bow again and make sure it's all set up right, I bet Tacks can get it to paper shoot just fine!

[The_Real_TCIII]

It was to spec when I was done but I did get a VERY slight right tear. I didn’t want to mess with it until you were shooting it. We can look it over now that we are both back in town. I can take a look at the shims too.


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[The_Real_TCIII]

If you’re arrows are “grouping” vertically out to 50 yards we should shoot some broadheads before we touch anything


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[sodfather]

13 minutes ago, The_Real_TCIII said:

If you’re arrows are “grouping” vertically out to 50 yards we should shoot some broadheads before we touch anything


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Tacs now your home we can have a meeting next Tuesday. Thanks to Jeremy we now have a full force tech division 

[sodfather]

Of course I’m down to like 3 arrows 

[The_Real_TCIII]

I’ll fletch the ones I have for you. You still want those custom wraps that say “Bad Mutherf$?*#r”?


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