Caveman Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 nyantler, it can be valuable to be reminded of just what it is we're doing in the woods. I think sometimes we look at it as a game, we put crosshairs on it and pull the trigger, find it in an hour and it's dead. But to watch the life drain out of an animal reminded me the gravity of what I try to do in the woods and what's necessary for me to eat the food I like. I was just a dumb 16 YO kid at the time and it's not something I see myself doing again out of safety concerns but I do think it was a valuable experience in terms of not taking too lightly what we do. Again, just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 This humane stuff is crazy.. deer don't process pain the same as humans... suffering is a human emotion and doesn't exist in the animal kingdom as an emotion... it is only relative to what humans consider suffering... our suffering is not their suffering... so a shot to the heart, head, ass, foot with a bow or a gun means nothing to a deer, only to the hunter.. that is why many times hunters see badly wounded deer going about their regular daily routine .. they exist on instinct and instinct alone... they live.. they die.. its that simple How do you know? Have you ever been a deer? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyantler Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 haha.. that is always the response when someone tries to explain biological facts on here about whitetails...so, if I have to explain further you definitely wouldn't understand... nyantler, it can be valuable to be reminded of just what it is we're doing in the woods. I think sometimes we look at it as a game, we put crosshairs on it and pull the trigger, find it in an hour and it's dead. But to watch the life drain out of an animal reminded me the gravity of what I try to do in the woods and what's necessary for me to eat the food I like. I was just a dumb 16 YO kid at the time and it's not something I see myself doing again out of safety concerns but I do think it was a valuable experience in terms of not taking too lightly what we do. Again, just my opinion. I don't understand the need to be reminded of what I'm doing in the woods... some of you spout out stuff like being human and taking good shots and learning about the gravity of killing a deer.. yet can't rap yourself around the importance of buck age structure, and buck to doe ratios... or even why knowing when legal shooting time is... I think you all like saying stuff that makes you feel good... because you think that is what we all want to hear... I think it would be ridiculous to tell any hunter that he should cut a deers throat because he needs to learn something about appreciating the gravity of death or whats necessary to eat the food he likes... you really can't learn that without slittting a deers throat?... I don't need to dig that deep into my head to enjoy a little hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snor Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Did it once, I shot a 7pt high and broke its back. I pulled out my knife grabed the horns with one hand and cut the throat, as soon as the knife poked him, blood was blowing out of its throat he thrashed his horns i had to really hang on not to be gored. When i finally let let go you could hear him drowning in his own blood. It was the fight of hanging onto the horns i don't want to have to do again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 never had to do it and never will as long as i have another shot wast of time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave6x6 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 NY, did you have a rough day at the office? You are taking alot of statements way out of context and reading into others in a way that's a bit overboard. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wooly Posted November 30, 2011 Author Share Posted November 30, 2011 NY, did you have a rough day at the office? You are taking alot of statements way out of context and reading into others in a way that's a bit overboard. LOL Lol- I was about to slit my own throat when I see where this is going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 I have read many times that we all have a right to our own opinion so why do some have a problem with the opinions of slitting the throat of a deer under certain conditions? How one feels about this is a personal feeling that is neither right or wrong. There are lessons learned from every aspect of hunting and if this is one of them. But some people just want to tell everyone that their opinions don't count but theirs does. No one knows how a deer really feels and can't speak for them. Dave 6x6 I agree with you on this one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arrow nocker Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Shot my first buck with a bow high behind the front shoulders.It droped right there.It started to crawl away on its front legs.I was in my climber.I had to drop my bow and geer and un harness and all that jazz and climb down.It felt like a lifetime watching this deer suffer while i was climbing down.i finally got down and started to go to it and take out my knife out of my pouch but it wasn't in my pouch.So i had to arrow it.I shot it again at an angle toward the lungs and heart trying to hit both.I sat there and watched it die.When he breathed you could see the blood and steam come out of the wound.He just starred at me as i him.He took about 3 minuits to expire,as the breaths slowly got slower.It was an experiance not excactly like slitting the throat but none the less it was something that still felt weird. I have barried pets and finnished of birds by ringing thir necks but nothing compared do that time i watched that deer breath its last breath.Its just the way it looked at me.Like it was thankfull but scared all at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 I didn't say that.. I said there is nothing to be gained as it pertains to hunting.. there is no reason for a lesson to be learned about death while hunting... slitting a deers throat has no bearing on why, where when or how we hunt... watching an animal die can be done without hand to hand combat... I get no appreciation for anything watching someone or cutting a deers throat myself... what have you learned other than you are capible of killing something with your bare hands.. I learned that in 28 years of martial arts.. I didn't need to actually kill something to learn it. Despite my earlier post, I agree-- we 'should' act in the best interest of quickly ending any suffering of the animal we are taking, and also should act in interest of our safety as well. In this light I agree that cutting the neck as a method of dispatch on a wounded deer is a last resort means (and based on some of the stories above, truly some folks used it as a last resort to finish a deer). My post was more generalist than that-- I meant, in general, in my opinion only, someone who uses animal products that result from the death of an animal, at some point in his or her life, should be educated to the origins of the product (be it meat or something else) and not shun personal responsibility for what it is they are doing. With respect, I understand that witnessing the death directly does not impact everyone the same way. That said though, it impacts many people in a profound way and if it means that it helps us learn respect for the critters we eat (or harvest, or whatever) then I'm all for it. Reading the stories, here, of hunters expressing that it was hard for them to witness, speaks a great deal to me! I will leave it at that for fear of getting all weird and spiritual on you poor folks!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four Season Whitetail's Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 (edited) Are you trying to say that a deer or any other animal does not feel pain??? I hope not because that is so far from the truth it's borderline ?????? Edited November 30, 2011 by Four Season Whitetails Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culvercreek hunt club Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 This humane stuff is crazy.. deer don't process pain the same as humans... suffering is a human emotion and doesn't exist in the animal kingdom as an emotion... it is only relative to what humans consider suffering... our suffering is not their suffering... so a shot to the heart, head, ass, foot with a bow or a gun means nothing to a deer, only to the hunter.. that is why many times hunters see badly wounded deer going about their regular daily routine .. they exist on instinct and instinct alone... they live.. they die.. its that simple While they may not process suffering the same way we do the reality is they do feel pain. That reaction is not processed as an emotion and expanded into suffering but pain is real as the instincts you mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve863 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 there is no reason for a lesson to be learned about death while hunting... We kill animals don't we?? And killing leads to death, don't it?? How a hunter can say that there are NO lessons to be learned about death while hunting is beyond me. If there is NO lesson to be learned, then our killing of the animal has little significance and we might as well just leave it laying in the field. Your trophy then has little value and the meat I get from a deer should not be treasured anymore than a McDonalds hamburger. I myself think there are plenty of lessons to be learned from the death we see in hunting. It even makes some of us reflect on our own inevitable deaths and of those we love. Today it was the deers turn to take it's last gasp in life, in the future it will be our turn. It is one thing that ALL life forms have in common. A good thing to keep in back of our minds in my opinion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 To the judgmental members on this site here we go again . We are not living up to your ethical standards , and no we don't need a biological study on the issue if deer feel pain or not. IMO they do! That was not the intent of the original question posed by WOOLY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 We kill animals don't we?? And killing leads to death, don't it?? How a hunter can say that there are NO lessons to be learned about death while hunting is beyond me. If there is NO lesson to be learned, then our killing of the animal has little significance and we might as well just leave it laying in the field. Your trophy then has little value and the meat I get from a deer should not be treasured anymore than a McDonalds hamburger. I myself think there are plenty of lessons to be learned from the death we see in hunting. It even makes some of us reflect on our own inevitable deaths and of those we love. Today it was the deers turn to take it's last gasp in life, in the future it will be our turn. It is one thing that ALL life forms have in common. A good thing to keep in back of our minds in my opinion. Good response Steve great answer and I agree. I have those emotions every deer season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Nicky Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 No, thankfully I never had to. I've spined a few over the years, I either finished them off quickly with a gunshot to the head or another arrow. I hate to see anything suffer, and the thought of being gored or kicked in the head or shin doesn't appeal to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the blur Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Shot my first buck with a bow high behind the front shoulders.It droped right there.It started to crawl away on its front legs.I was in my climber.I had to drop my bow and geer and un harness and all that jazz and climb down.It felt like a lifetime watching this deer suffer while i was climbing down.i finally got down and started to go to it and take out my knife out of my pouch but it wasn't in my pouch.So i had to arrow it.I shot it again at an angle toward the lungs and heart trying to hit both.I sat there and watched it die.When he breathed you could see the blood and steam come out of the wound.He just starred at me as i him.He took about 3 minuits to expire,as the breaths slowly got slower.It was an experiance not excactly like slitting the throat but none the less it was something that still felt weird. I have barried pets and finnished of birds by ringing thir necks but nothing compared do that time i watched that deer breath its last breath.Its just the way it looked at me.Like it was thankfull but scared all at the same time. Geezzzz, that's pretty serious, guess it comes with the hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve863 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Thanks Dave. Look, I have said it before. Where I hunt, I can't afford to let deer walk like other hunters do, because I may not get to see another one, so I don't hesitate to shoot to kill when I do see one. So to some people, I am a "if its brown, its down" type of hunter. They can call me what they wish, but I can honestly say that I have never walked up to the deer that I shot without taking a few moments to reflect on what I just did, which was to put a living creature to DEATH. If we forget this fact then in my opinion we are nothing but killers with little regard to what we are doing. That is not what we hunters should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Thanks Dave. Look, I have said it before. Where I hunt, I can't afford to let deer walk like other hunters do, because I may not get to see another one, so I don't hesitate to shoot to kill when I do see one. So to some people, I am a "if its brown, its down" type of hunter. They can call me what they wish, but I can honestly say that I have never walked up to the deer that I shot without taking a few moments to reflect on what I just did, which was to put a living creature to DEATH. If we forget this fact then in my opinion we are nothing but killers with little regard to what we are doing. That is not what we hunters should be. Again Steve you hit the nail on the head. If we don't have feelings for what we have just killed then there is something wrong and we are heartless killers. I always reflect and appreciate any deer I have been lucky to kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virgil Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Well said, Steve. I think it's important that, in all the excitement of the hunt, we not lose sight of the fact that we are in fact killing a living creature. We should take it seriously, do it with respect and humanity, and not forget it. If after pulling that trigger or releasing that arrow, you don't feel at least some sort or regret or empathy for the animal, you shouldn't be hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveNY Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 We kill animals don't we?? And killing leads to death, don't it?? How a hunter can say that there are NO lessons to be learned about death while hunting is beyond me. If there is NO lesson to be learned, then our killing of the animal has little significance and we might as well just leave it laying in the field. Your trophy then has little value and the meat I get from a deer should not be treasured anymore than a McDonalds hamburger. I myself think there are plenty of lessons to be learned from the death we see in hunting. It even makes some of us reflect on our own inevitable deaths and of those we love. Today it was the deers turn to take it's last gasp in life, in the future it will be our turn. It is one thing that ALL life forms have in common. A good thing to keep in back of our minds in my opinion. Well said Steve, struck a cord in me.The thing I always think of is how people put different animals into different categories. We talk about killing deer and for some people it is an emotional thing. For some this emotion is only for the first deer they kill, or the first couple, or the first one they actually watch die close up. But a fish? Who cares about fish? We catch fish, and throw them in a cooler or in a bucket and they suffocate and expire. How many cockroaches or mosquitoes have we killed? Did we stop and reflect on it, and think about the life we have taken? Even turkey or other birds. I know people that WILL NOT hunt deer, but will shoot a turkey with out the blink of an eye. One female hunter I know in particular says she will turkey hunt because they are "ugly" and wont shoot deer because they are so "pretty". Funny how we value some forms of life over others... And how our human emotions come into play depending on the type of animal it is we have just killed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve863 Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Well said Steve, struck a cord in me. The thing I always think of is how people put different animals into different categories. We talk about killing deer and for some people it is an emotional thing. For some this emotion is only for the first deer they kill, or the first couple, or the first one they actually watch die close up. But a fish? Who cares about fish? We catch fish, and throw them in a cooler or in a bucket and they suffocate and expire. How many cockroaches or mosquitoes have we killed? Did we stop and reflect on it, and think about the life we have taken? Even turkey or other birds. I know people that WILL NOT hunt deer, but will shoot a turkey with out the blink of an eye. One female hunter I know in particular says she will turkey hunt because they are "ugly" and wont shoot deer because they are so "pretty". Funny how we value some forms of life over others... And how our human emotions come into play depending on the type of animal it is we have just killed. For the mere fact we post and argue on a HUNTING website, the death of a deer should have some sort of effect on every damned one of us here! Yes, we kill cockroaches and mosquitos without blinking an eye, but I highly doubt any of us spend the time and effort to join a bug killing forum and read and discuss the many facets of the creatures lives, habitat, and weapons available to bring them down. Many of us look forward to hunting all year, so the death of an animal in a successful hunt should have some very significant meanings to all of us. If it doesn't, then there really is something wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpStateRedNeck Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Never had to cut a throat, but I've seen the knife in the heart, and it sounds like that is the most effective way to end their misery. I have been very fortunate, for the past 13 years and haven't had a messy kill since I was 18. I remember, very poignantly, the look a doe gave me right before I gave her a 12 gauge round to the cranium (and made a huge mess out of my hunting clothes). I imagine most of us have seen at some point. "Why the %^&* did you do this to me?" Look. Hated it. I still hunt, and while I'm a little de-sensitized to it, I think it gives us as hunters a higher appreciation for life, and our oppurtunity to live it. Even the big buck kills where I'm absolutely AMPED about my success, I always feel a little sad. I can tell you if I catch up with the big boy I've been dogging for 3 years now, and take him, I'll probably sit down next to him and feel pretty sad that I'll never see his big self cruising through the woods we've shared for at least 4 or 5 years now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virgil Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 bugsquashingny.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveNY Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 For the mere fact we post and argue on a HUNTING website, the death of a deer should have some sort of effect on every damned one of us here! Yes, we kill cockroaches and mosquitos without blinking an eye, but I highly doubt any of us spend the time and effort to join a bug killing forum and read and discuss the many facets of the creatures lives, habitat, and weapons available to bring them down. Many of us look forward to hunting all year, so the death of an animal in a successful hunt should have some very significant meanings to all of us. If it doesn't, then there really is something wrong. hahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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