New York Crossbow Hunters..

[buddybags]

While I am a supporter of crossbows,I am not during archery season!!

[NFA-ADK]

I have the stats everyone has been waiting for. 100% of the people shot with a unloaded weapon survived last year...

Fact: No hunter was ever shot by a bow being discharged accidently by dropping it, or by forgetting to put the safety ON and hitting the trigger...

Statistical fact, You can not get shot from a unloaded weapon... Fact a bow is unloaded untile at full draw.

And for the one's who say a unloaded Xbow is safe, sure it is as safe as a bow with a arrow in it"not at full draw" or a unloaded gun. But most who hunt have the weapon loaded...

A bow is never loaded untile it is pulled back. A Xbow just like a gun is always loaded once the bullet is in or the bolt and string are in place...

Fact a weapon that you walk around with loaded is not as safe as a unloaded weapon making any weapon that has to be loaded to hunt with a more dangerous weapon to use FACT.

I do not need statistics to back this information up, if you are not smart enought to realize these facts then

so be it...

Plain and simple a loaded weapon is more dangerous than one that is not...

PS hard to find statistics on people shot with a unloaded bow anyone finding them can post here...

[SteveB]

How about the % per hunter(crossbow) of crossbow hunting accidents vs the % per hunter (compound/trad) of compound/trad hunting accidents.

If they are are inherently dangerous as you say you should be smart enough to find and post them.

Or you could just stay with an uniformed opinion.

[jr.deerslayer]

Whether or not you agree with crossbows I can assure you that sales in NY have skyrocketed. I have never seen so many crossbows being purchased at the Eastern Sportsman Show. We couldn't believe our eyes when 1 in every 20 people or so where carrying them home. I cant remember if we saw one person purchase a compound.

[NFA-ADK]

How about the % per hunter(crossbow) of crossbow hunting accidents vs the % per hunter (compound/trad) of compound/trad hunting accidents.

If they are are inherently dangerous as you say you should be smart enough to find and post them.

Or you could just stay with an uniformed opinion.

Well after seeing how NYS does it's "statistics" and make us the safest state to hunt proves that Statistics can be made to show what you want by excluding certian accidents there by making stats match what you want.

EX: NYS is NEVER going to say hunting is UNSAFE no matter how many people get shot. And they will prove it every year with bogus stats. Stats do not change the fact that a loaded fire arm of any kind is more dangerous that one that is not. Again many seem to want to just by pass this fact and have me show some BS stat from some state that is trying to PROVE it is safe...

Well guese what every other state is trying to PROVE hunting is safe and I am sure they exclude certian "accidents" because they can figure out some loop hole to say "Well they were not hunting AT the time they were sitting on the log and the gun(or Xbow) dropped and accidently shot the guy so this was NOT a hunting accident... Makes hunting look safe and inviting to new hunters.

[nyantler]

Hunting is not unsafe.. nor is the crossbow.. some hunters are unsafe... regardless of what weapon they are carrying... a crossbow is no more unsafe than , let's say, a chicken bone... and I'm guessing more people have died choking on a chicken bone than hunting with a crossbow... next thing we'll be saying is that hunting with a chicken bone is unsafe..lol.. just trying to illustrate how rediculous the unsafe argument is when talking about the crossbow...most anti-crossbow opinions are usually fueled by some bowhunter or bowhunting group telling you that you are not suppose to like crossbows... and even they... don't really know why.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I have the stats everyone has been waiting for. 100% of the people shot with a unloaded weapon survived last year...

Fact: No hunter was ever shot by a bow being discharged accidently by dropping it, or by forgetting to put the safety ON and hitting the trigger...

Statistical fact, You can not get shot from a unloaded weapon... Fact a bow is unloaded untile at full draw.

And for the one's who say a unloaded Xbow is safe, sure it is as safe as a bow with a arrow in it"not at full draw" or a unloaded gun. But most who hunt have the weapon loaded...

A bow is never loaded untile it is pulled back. A Xbow just like a gun is always loaded once the bullet is in or the bolt and string are in place...

Fact a weapon that you walk around with loaded is not as safe as a unloaded weapon making any weapon that has to be loaded to hunt with a more dangerous weapon to use FACT.

I do not need statistics to back this information up, if you are not smart enought to realize these facts then

so be it...

Plain and simple a loaded weapon is more dangerous than one that is not...

PS hard to find statistics on people shot with a unloaded bow anyone finding them can post here...

Nothing but BS. A crossbow is not always loaded, it is only loaded when an arrow is on the rail and the bow is cocked. A vertical bow is loaded as soon as you nock that arrow, whether it's drawn or not. Ask an Econ officer if you can ride a wheeler with you bow and a nocked arrow.

I seem to recall during my bow hunter course, the instructor talking about the dangers of following behind your buddy while you have an arrow nocked.

Sorry bud, your line of thought just don't add up no matter how many times you repeat it. Just more opinions you are trying to pass of as fact.

[wztirem]

Finally someone that gets it... good post... It's really just that simple!!

I am amazed that you are the only person to comment on my post!

What amazes me the most though is that very little comment on this site has been has been directed towards the effect deer have on the habitat!

The DEC wants deer killed( as many as possible in certain DMU's).

. Look at the history of deer licensing and and the trend is obvious, too few hunters to kill an over expanding deer population.. Deer are akin to locusts in manyy areas of the state and have impacted the habitat accordingly

. Deer populations need to be controlled. The introduction of crossbows will seemingly help the DEC in such an endeavor considering the ever increasing attrition of hunters.

Deer hunting controls deer populations and in the end protects and preserves habitat. As hunters we need to embrace any new means to assist the DEC into achieving their mandate (look it up).

In the end, whatever means is necessary in preserving our hunting heritage is worthwhile.

[luvtahunt]

Help all hunters to get out in the woods, and enjoy hunting! As some of you younger and able-bodied hunters don't seem to understand is, that you too, (IF GOD IS WILLING) will be old and not so able, sooner than you can possibly imagine. I don't seem to recall the older generation trying to in any way, to make it more difficult for us young guys to get out and hunt. In fact, they went out of their way to make it possible to get us out with them. My dad didn't hunt, but thank GOD other adults cared enough for us young guys and the sport to insure we didn't miss out. Well now, in what seems like, a blink of the eye ,we are the old guys. We face challenges far greater than how long we can hold that bow back . If hunting with a crossbow allows anyone, old ,young, weak or strong to get out and enjoy hunting, support it while we still have this freedom and privilige .

[sweet old bill]

I sure think luvtahunt has it right. At 70 I thank God each day that i can still hunt or fish.

I still can use a compound bow or my recurve but lot of us older folk can no longer do it. Makes a big difference if you are old to hunt in the warmer weather compared to the end of the season with snow and cold weather. I have bad legs and do fear falling on snow and icy, My right leg was broken in 9 places and the kneecap in 3...this keep me now in natural ground blinds.

No more in sits in trees etc..lets support all hunter and not have archery vs cross bows... time to get together and work to better our sport of hunting..

[Chevy]

Yes the DEC want as many deer killed as possible. Not because of the habitat, but because of pressure from other interests. So they hand out tons of DMP and nuisance tags and all of a sudden people complain there are no deer and start posting their land hoping the one deer that is left will stay. Then more and more people start posting their land because the DEC keeps trying to change the seasons. i.e. muzzleloaders can have scopes, xbows are coming, rifles in the souther tier, special gun seasons during archery, monday opener is gone ect ect.

Now hunters and non-hunters alike all have their land posted and DEC can't manage the herd like they want so they keep coming up with special seasons.

I don't believe specials seasons recruit more hunters because those people would participate in the regular seasons anyways. Lowering the age to start hunting adds recruitment. xbows also don't add anything. it justs shifts gun hunters into archery season.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Yes the DEC want as many deer killed as possible. Not because of the habitat, but because of pressure from other interests. So they hand out tons of DMP and nuisance tags and all of a sudden people complain there are no deer and start posting their land hoping the one deer that is left will stay. Then more and more people start posting their land because the DEC keeps trying to change the seasons. i.e. muzzleloaders can have scopes, xbows are coming, rifles in the souther tier, special gun seasons during archery, monday opener is gone ect ect.

Now hunters and non-hunters alike all have their land posted and DEC can't manage the herd like they want so they keep coming up with special seasons.

I don't believe specials seasons recruit more hunters because those people would participate in the regular seasons anyways. Lowering the age to start hunting adds recruitment. xbows also don't add anything. it justs shifts gun hunters into archery season.

What was the number of deer killed last year on nuisance tags statewide? Ill answer that for you, 5007. The year before that? 4445, and 4468 the year before that. Sounds like annihilation of the herd to me...

You guys just keep fighting the new recruitment tools, because our numbers have been rising for years under the old way of thinking, right?

[Chevy]

What was the number of deer killed last year on nuisance tags statewide? Ill answer that for you, 5007. The year before that? 4445, and 4468 the year before that. Sounds like annihilation of the herd to me...

You guys just keep fighting the new recruitment tools, because our numbers have been rising for years under the old way of thinking, right?

How many new hunters did we get by switching opening day to a saturday which was opposed by many?

I'll answer that for ya. Zilch!

Wake up. The age limit was only just reduced. Give it a chance and the numbers will grow. We don't need all these other special seasons.

[WNYBuckHunter]

You honestly believe that ONE change will affect recruitment in a way that it needs to? I suggest you take your own advice, because its going to take a whole bunch of changes to hopefully get things so that our numbers arent small enough for recreational hunting to disappear within the next 50 to 100 years.

[Chevy]

Yes. ONE good change is better than three others that we are not sure if they will work. Moving opening day to saturday probably actually hurt hunter numbers because so many disapproved of it and it added no significant influx of new hunters which they hoped for.

All these gadget seasons and weapons may lower hunter numbers as people drop out because of being fed up. Lowering the age limit is gauranteed to work without changing seasons or adding gun like weapons into archery season. Let's be smart about this people.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Why do you think the change to a Saturday Opener hurt numbers? I like the opener bing on a Saturday. I could hunt it and not have to take a day off from work. Seemed like a good idea. Kind of like a good idea getting rid of the no Sunday hunting rule. That one basically double the season length for most wester NY hunters.

Seems to me the ones that were pissed abut a Saturday Opener were the bowhunters that feel they "lost" a weekend of hunting. Same group that have their panites in a bunch about the inclusion of crossbows in Archery season. Not a pissing match but just an observation.

[Chevy]

I've been a gun hunter for 28yrs. I think they should give the first week of the regular gun season to crossbows and make it a special xbow season. Now who's panties are in a bunch?

Many many people liked the monday opener better but I don't want to go on about that because that is not what this thread is about.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

What ever they decide I will abide by and hunt as many seasons as I can. That week isn't going to increase the deer take and that is really what the crossbow inclusion is all about, just like some of the recent rule changes. I think the guys that really use the primative stuff should get thrown a bone like they used to. The traditional archer should get a head start ont he rest of archery equipment (compound and cross bw) and the flintlock/percussion w/ iron sights should get a jump the inlines. Personally the NZ has the best structure. bow followed by ML then gun

[NFA-ADK]

OK Joe and WNYbuck hunter I guese everyone who is going to hunt with a cross bow will not have it loaded while hunting, is that what you are saying because I realize a gun or Xbow without a bolt or bullet in it is safe, da... As safe as a bow... ahhhhh lol

I would like to line up 3 weapons all loaded like you said WNYBuck

2)Any gun

3)compound bow

4)Xbow

Guese what only 2 weapons will kill you because if the trigger is pulled with 2 by accident while hunting you can die, no so with a bow plain and simple... Getting stabbed with a broadhead is not the same as getting shot with a Xbow or gun!

Even loaded like you said a bow can not fire the arrow untile pulled back; and that is the only reason Xbows are more dangerous. You all seem to think I am against Xbow's, I am just trying to make a point. A loaded weapon is more dangerous.

A Xbow will be the same as having a gun IMO at least for me, im sorry that is just how I feel. I will get one if they give a special season for it... I have shot them and they are easy to shoot and can shoot far... No practice for that weapon needed at least for me, simple trajetory know how...

Hunting is not unsafe, yea tell that to the widow who lost her husband to a shotgun during black powder season that was not included in the DEC safest of all the states report...

You want to think it is safe but guese what any time you enter the woods while hunting season is on, it is dangerous plain and simple. You people all seem to forget about the orange army, IF HUNTING WAS SOOOOOO SAFE why bother with orange???????

Firearms are dangerous that is why... O wait it's not the gun it's the idiot behind it, da... silly me...

Compairing a chicken bone to a Xbow is funny I will remember that one for a long time thanks. No problem with having KFC for a kids B-day party unsupervised but a Xbow ahh no. Not saying you would not do it but with excessive supervision... Why ... because any weapon can kill you that is why. I am not saying hunting in general is not safe but im sorry I played many sports and never was getting SHOT a possibility... That is why hunting is dangerous.

Mabe im just giving my deep woods or shall I say Public land opinion. I am sorry if many of you hunt your "safe" area's and never have to worry about getting a bullet flying past you but it happens and anyone who thinks that hunting does not have a chance of danger is just kidding themselves... Life is risk, hunting takes that to a new level anyone who has climed a clif, ledge or dangerous wet rocky downhill trail way back and alone knows this forget about getting shot how about just not breaking a leg!!! Add onto the fact that idiots hunt and yes hunting can be a lot more dangerous than well lets say eating a chicken leg...

But if you hunt your land I guese some may consider that safe in your own little worlds...

Try reading up on the accident reports and then compair them to the stats like you all love to bring up. Funny how the #'s don't add up wonder why? If you get killed on your atv while going to your stand you are NOT hunting... one example. Hunting report does not include late season. example 2 .- You really do not want me to start posting facts on this and guese what I dont want to...

Ask a mom why she is concerned about her son hunting...

Mabe if you all knew someone who's husband was killed while hunting you might have a dif perspective... Safe yes hunting is a safe "sport" yet it is as relative to chances you take and the idiots that take chances or shall I say shots around you...

You want to say it is a recruitment tool fine. Make it have it's own season that will get more money for the state and get more people buying the weapon for that single use...Including that into archery season is not going to recruit hunters with archery equipment as much as a separate season would...

Otherwise a Xbow is just a gun that shoot bolts. Only similarity to a bow is limbs and a string... I am not changing my oppinion on the weapon, does not mean I will not use the weapon...

Again the DEC will do anything for more money and you all go along with the yea it's a recruitment tool thing. Sure this will get all the kids into hunting, give me a brake. If a firearm is not enough a Xbow is sure to fail...

[WNYBuckHunter]

You are still 100% wrong NFA, a compound bow is just as likely to kill you if handled unsafely as a gun or crossbow. It's not the arrow (in this cAse weapon), it's the Indian. Unless you can otherwise prove that a crossbow is more dangerous than any other weapon with facts and stats to back it up, it's just a bunch of nonsense.

[sits in trees]

I have the stats everyone has been waiting for. 100% of the people shot with a unloaded weapon survived last year...

Fact: No hunter was ever shot by a bow being discharged accidently by dropping it, or by forgetting to put the safety ON and hitting the trigger...

Statistical fact, You can not get shot from a unloaded weapon... Fact a bow is unloaded untile at full draw.

And for the one's who say a unloaded Xbow is safe, sure it is as safe as a bow with a arrow in it"not at full draw" or a unloaded gun. But most who hunt have the weapon loaded...

A bow is never loaded untile it is pulled back. A Xbow just like a gun is always loaded once the bullet is in or the bolt and string are in place...

Fact a weapon that you walk around with loaded is not as safe as a unloaded weapon making any weapon that has to be loaded to hunt with a more dangerous weapon to use FACT.

I do not need statistics to back this information up, if you are not smart enought to realize these facts then

so be it...

Plain and simple a loaded weapon is more dangerous than one that is not...

PS hard to find statistics on people shot with a unloaded bow anyone finding them can post here...

yea i hear there have been thousands of deaths do to loaded crossbows in PA since they went full inclusion. the way you twist facts to bolster your argument is similar to what anti gun and anti hunting groups do. Edited February 25, 2012 by sits in trees

[ncountry]

It is funny how 2 sides of a debate are so solid in their convictions.Step back and listen or comprehend what the others saying. As I have said before, imo crossbows need their own season after archery. Any one with any comman sense would have to agree that crossbows are more dangerous than a compound.You simply cannot do things with a bow that you can with a xbow. Is it a good arguement against crossbows, I don't think so. Accidents are statisticaly insignificant.

Those against a separate season for xbow...What reason would there be to not do this? What would be the harm?( have to wait an additional week or so to hunt?)

Like I have said before I think xbows are nice weapons and will probably hunt with one eventually, after I have hunted with my bow.And I will repeat ,after seeing the affects that have happened already, due to our shortsightedness(compounds,modern inlines) we should think about future generations of hunters. Why cannot we have our cake and eat it too? A xbow season will draw in new hunters and allow others with bad shouldeers etc... get in the woods while it is still quiet. Yet still leave a few weeks for our modern age "traditionalists"(lol) This debate reminds me of our political mess D vs R ..Idiots on both sides (in the political arena) with no intention of meeting in the middle. All or nothing. In the long haul everybody loses.

[Chevy]

I want a special season for my handgun. My .44 mag is not a rifle, shotgun, or xbow so i think I need a special season for it.

Let's slip it in the week before regular gun season. When is enough enough.

[ncountry]

I want a special season for my handgun. My .44 mag is not a rifle, shotgun, or xbow so i think I need a special season for it.

Let's slip it in the week before regular gun season. When is enough enough.

Yeap , because everybody is going to slowly switch over to the pistol because it is a superior weapon, if it is left in gun season.

[nyantler]

Any one with any comman sense would have to agree that crossbows are more dangerous than a compound.You simply cannot do things with a bow that you can with a xbow.

Common sense tells me that there are no statistics that back up the statement that crossbows are more dangerous than compounds... and you also can not do things with a xbow that you can with a bow.. lets all be very clear about where the real argument against crossbows is... it is simply that some bowhunters ( roughly 2000 of the 200,000 in NY) feel threatened that somehow the crossbow hunter is going to ruin bowhunting season by being in the woods at the same time as they are and might kill a deer or two... it has nothing to do with safety, or any of the other nonsense that the anti crossbow people have come up with to fight their battle... everyone knows it... so why do we continue to blow smoke up each others rearends?