There is evidence of fraud in the 2020 election

[Grouse]

An Abundance of Evidence                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          There really was evidence, lots of it, that voter fraud and illegal electioneering took place on a massive scale in the November election.

I’m not talking about exotic theories that voting machines controlled by communists in Venezuela and China switched millions of Trump votes to Biden (a convenient straw-man the corporate media constantly slays). I’m talking about old-fashioned, mundane stuff: people voting twice, dead people voting, cash-for-votes schemes, election workers ignoring state laws about the counting of absentee ballots, and courts changing the rules and deadlines for absentee ballots at the last minute. Much of it was perpetrated by Democratic political machines in places like Philadelphia and Detroit — cities infamous for corruption and election-rigging.

We at The Federalist reported on it. We talked to poll challengers in Michigan who witnessed election workers counting ineligible absentee ballots and not allowing GOP observers to do their jobs. We talked to political insiders and volunteers in Philadelphia who described an election system thoroughly compromised by a corrupt Democratic machine.

We chronicled an illegal scheme to bribe Native American voters on tribal lands in Nevada and Arizona with cash cards, electronics, and other “prizes” in exchange for votes. We reported on changes to mail-in voting in multiple battleground states, including Georgia, rammed through by state legislatures or issued by fiat from bureaucrats and judges, that made it easier to cheat with fraudulent or ineligible absentee ballots.

Some of this was made possible by the often haphazard — and sometimes unlawful — expansion of absentee voting and extensions of absentee voting deadlines, all under the pretext that COVID-19 justified radical changes to how we vote (it didn’t). The result, in some states, was what amounted to a chaotic experiment in mass mail-in voting.

Dozens of states made changes to absentee voting, some more drastic than others. Nine states along with Washington, D.C., took the extraordinary step of mailing actual ballots to every voter on the rolls. Others did away entirely with eligibility requirements for mail-in ballots, introducing “no-excuse” absentee voting. Still others introduced novel procedures for “curing” incomplete absentee ballots that would normally be thrown out.

The corporate press ignored all of it, just as they ignored any story that might have hurt Biden during the campaign. Their goal was and is to get Democrats elected, period. They don’t care about being fair, or telling the truth, or keeping their readers informed about reality. If they did, they would have reported on this stuff instead of lumping it all together as so many conspiracy theories.

Edited January 12, 2021 by Grouse

[ronc80]

Just wish something would be done about it.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[BowmanMike]

You guys are being lied to. Eat it up!

[rachunter]

Enough is Enough !!!! If there's evidence of fraud lets see it.Did anyone ever stop to think that between the republican Trump haters and the diehard never vote for anyone but a democrate[which makes no sence to me] that maybe he just lost.

I voted for Trump I think he's an asshole but truly believe that he was working for the country's best intrest.If ALL the haters would have given him a chance I definitely feel he could of did even better then he did in the last four years.Four years of daily attacks give me a break.

Hopefully Biden will do something good for the country unlike he has for the last 40+ years.

[Grouse]

Let's see it?  What don't you see in the OP, or didn't you read it?  The evidence is plainly exposed in that article.

Hoping Biden will do anything different than his records shows he has always done is wishful thinking.

Right now, he sees an opportunity to force all of his leftist dreams upon all of us, now that his party has seen to it he is in office.

It was a coup d'etat, without question.  Too bad our corrupt government refuses to admit it. 

BTW, when is the #MeToo movement going to investigate Tara Reade's allegations of Biden's sexual assault?

Edited January 12, 2021 by Grouse

[Grouse]

50 minutes ago, BowmanMike said:

You guys are being lied to. Eat it up!

You guys were lied to for 4 years.  Everything from Russian collusion, to a reason to impeach, to social justice, racial justice, police brutality and Biden not being a sexual predator.  You all ate it up without any credibility to any of it.  Americans are not as gullible as leftists.

Edited January 12, 2021 by Grouse

[Northcountryman]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

An Abundance of Evidence                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          There really was evidence, lots of it, that voter fraud and illegal electioneering took place on a massive scale in the November election.

I’m not talking about exotic theories that voting machines controlled by communists in Venezuela and China switched millions of Trump votes to Biden (a convenient straw-man the corporate media constantly slays). I’m talking about old-fashioned, mundane stuff: people voting twice, dead people voting, cash-for-votes schemes, election workers ignoring state laws about the counting of absentee ballots, and courts changing the rules and deadlines for absentee ballots at the last minute. Much of it was perpetrated by Democratic political machines in places like Philadelphia and Detroit — cities infamous for corruption and election-rigging.

We at The Federalist reported on it. We talked to poll challengers in Michigan who witnessed election workers counting ineligible absentee ballots and not allowing GOP observers to do their jobs. We talked to political insiders and volunteers in Philadelphia who described an election system thoroughly compromised by a corrupt Democratic machine.

We chronicled an illegal scheme to bribe Native American voters on tribal lands in Nevada and Arizona with cash cards, electronics, and other “prizes” in exchange for votes. We reported on changes to mail-in voting in multiple battleground states, including Georgia, rammed through by state legislatures or issued by fiat from bureaucrats and judges, that made it easier to cheat with fraudulent or ineligible absentee ballots.

Some of this was made possible by the often haphazard — and sometimes unlawful — expansion of absentee voting and extensions of absentee voting deadlines, all under the pretext that COVID-19 justified radical changes to how we vote (it didn’t). The result, in some states, was what amounted to a chaotic experiment in mass mail-in voting.

Dozens of states made changes to absentee voting, some more drastic than others. Nine states along with Washington, D.C., took the extraordinary step of mailing actual ballots to every voter on the rolls. Others did away entirely with eligibility requirements for mail-in ballots, introducing “no-excuse” absentee voting. Still others introduced novel procedures for “curing” incomplete absentee ballots that would normally be thrown out.

The corporate press ignored all of it, just as they ignored any story that might have hurt Biden during the campaign. Their goal was and is to get Democrats elected, period. They don’t care about being fair, or telling the truth, or keeping their readers informed about reality. If they did, they would have reported on this stuff instead of lumping it all together as so many conspiracy theories.

Yes , I believe that there was and ,in the manner described by this piece , It would be very difficult for the for the FEDS election officials to pick up on it . Well done 

[Northcountryman]

57 minutes ago, rachunter said:

Enough is Enough !!!! If there's evidence of fraud lets see it.Did anyone ever stop to think that between the republican Trump haters and the diehard never vote for anyone but a democrate[which makes no sence to me] that maybe he just lost.

I voted for Trump I think he's an asshole but truly believe that he was working for the country's best intrest.If ALL the haters would have given him a chance I definitely feel he could of did even better then he did in the last four years.Four years of daily attacks give me a break.

Hopefully Biden will do something good for the country unlike he has for the last 40+ years.

Yup , I Think the was very Competent and capable ( unlike his predecessor lol) and did a fine job governing this country . But he also is kind of an asshole and is very selfish and egocentric ; that I don’t like !! 
 

And although I do believe there was significant election fraud , I will also concede that it is entirely possible he would have lost anyway straight up . 

[Grouse]

Communists do not leave anything like obtaining power to chance.

[9jNYstarkOH]

[rachunter]

Let's see it?  What don't you see in the OP, or didn't you read it?  The evidence is plainly exposed in that article.
Hoping Biden will do anything different than his records shows he has always done is wishful thinking.
Right now, he sees an opportunity to force all of his leftist dreams upon all of us, now that his party has seen to it he is in office.
It was a coup d'etat, without question.  Too bad our corrupt government refuses to admit it. 
BTW, when is the #MeToo movement going to investigate Tara Reade's allegations of Biden's sexual assault?

I did read it but you didn’t leave a link to fact check it. If I believed everything I read on the internet I’d never leave my house. Why didn’t trey gowdy except joining the team of lawyers. He’s a very smart man. Also Trumps own AG said there wasn’t enough evidence to overturn the election. I’m an open minded person who’s not locked into one party or the other are you?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Northcountryman]

12 minutes ago, rachunter said:

I did read it but you didn’t leave a link to fact check it. If I believed everything I read on the internet I’d never leave my house. Why didn’t trey gowdy except joining the team of lawyers. He’s a very smart man. Also Trumps own AG said there wasn’t enough evidence to overturn the election. I’m an open minded person who’s not locked into one party or the other are you?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That’s because it was done in such a manner that it would be difficult To detect at the federal level IMHO. If illegal ballots were cast - and I believe that they were - then they must be analyzed ballot- by- ballot , something that hasn’t been done . That’s just one example . Also , the acceptance of countless late ballots ; how are they going to catch that now if they were postmarked on the 3 rd when they really weren’t in the 3 rd but the 4 th. 
 

The AG and cyber security guy both coming out and saying that there was NO EVIDENCE of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud, just not able to be proven Within the time frame of 11/3 /20 and 12/14/20 when the electors met  . Of course , Conversely , this also doesn’t mean there WAS significant fraud either . I think that a thorough investigation post election is warranted here where all of the witnesses can be subpoenaed and be heard so that this situation can be rectified for the next election. 
 

Having said that , this past election is , indeed , over and Biden is the next President , period. I don’t like it , but it’s a fact .
Hey , that’s democracy baby!! lol 

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, rachunter said:

I did read it but you didn’t leave a link to fact check it. If I believed everything I read on the internet I’d never leave my house. Why didn’t trey gowdy except joining the team of lawyers. He’s a very smart man. Also Trumps own AG said there wasn’t enough evidence to overturn the election. I’m an open minded person who’s not locked into one party or the other are you?

Click on any one of the red links in the article to fact check whatever you like.

Barr never said there was no fraud.  He said the AG's office had not seen it.  He didn't mean there was none, just that his office had not been presented with it.

Gowdy was smart enough to see the retaliation coming from the left for anyone that sided with Trump when they stole the power to punish their opponents.  Right now they want Trump impeached and jailed.  They want any GOP elected official who dared to question the election results charged with insurrection and thrown out of office.  They want to make it possible for anyone who worked for Trump to be banned from getting a job in the future.  They are pulling out the most vindictive retaliatory moves they can think of to oppress any and all opposition to anyone who dares question the integrity of that election.

They are saying, "It's over.  You cannot challenge what we say you can't.  Shut up."  That's no way to unify the country.  That's the way you start a civil war. That is abuse of power.

I'm an independent who objectively looks at things from an informed citizen's perspective, and what I see happening is a leftist takeover of the country with evil intent.  Too bad many others don't, because they are brainwashed.

Edited January 12, 2021 by Grouse

[Versatile_Hunter]

1 hour ago, Northcountryman said:

That’s because it was done in such a manner that it would be difficult To detect at the federal level IMHO. If illegal ballots were cast - and I believe that they were - then they must be analyzed ballot- by- ballot , something that hasn’t been done . That’s just one example . Also , the acceptance of countless late ballots ; how are they going to catch that now if they were postmarked on the 3 rd when they really weren’t in the 3 rd but the 4 th. 
 

The AG and cyber security guy both coming out and saying that there was NO EVIDENCE of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud, just not able to be proven Within the time frame of 11/3 /20 and 12/14/20 when the electors met  . Of course , Conversely , this also doesn’t mean there WAS significant fraud either . I think that a thorough investigation post election is warranted here where all of the witnesses can be subpoenaed and be heard so that this situation can be rectified for the next election. 
 

Having said that , this past election is , indeed , over and Biden is the next President , period. I don’t like it , but it’s a fact .
Hey , that’s democracy baby!! lol 

1- it’s not a matter of detecting at the Federal level. States run their own elections and they found no evidence of widespread fraud. Not that it should matter, but many of the challenges and dismissals occurred in Republican led states. 

2- ‘Just because there was no evidence of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud.’ You thinking this makes any sense at all? What’s the standard then?

[Northcountryman]

4 minutes ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

1- it’s not a matter of detecting at the Federal level. States run their own elections and they found no evidence of widespread fraud. Not that it should matter, but many of the challenges and dismissals occurred in Republican led states. 

2- ‘Just because there was no evidence of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud.’ You thinking this makes any sense at all? What’s the standard then?

They didn’t have time to make that determination IMHO 

 

it makes total sense . Suppose somebody steals from you and you can’t prove it ; you know they did but can’t prove it ina court of law . Does that mean Then  that they didn’t steal From you ? 

The standard here being “the truth “

[DoubleDose]

4 minutes ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

1- it’s not a matter of detecting at the Federal level. States run their own elections and they found no evidence of widespread fraud. Not that it should matter, but many of the challenges and dismissals occurred in Republican led states. 

2- ‘Just because there was no evidence of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud.’ You thinking this makes any sense at all? What’s the standard then?

#2 above does make sense.  In science there is a saying "an absence of evidence is not proof".  You need evidence to prove something.   In our legal system, you need to prove someone guilty based on the evidence.  A criminal that well covers their tracks will leave little evidence of guilt.  That absence of evidence does not prove their innocence.  Hence, our legal system finds someone guilty or not guilty (based on the evidence), it never finds them innocent.

[Grouse]

Tit for Tat is bound to happen.  but what he's saying is true.  She told our enemies nobody would be in charge.

[Versatile_Hunter]

16 minutes ago, DoubleDose said:

#2 above does make sense.  In science there is a saying "an absence of evidence is not proof".  You need evidence to prove something.   In our legal system, you need to prove someone guilty based on the evidence.  A criminal that well covers their tracks will leave little evidence of guilt.  That absence of evidence does not prove their innocence.  Hence, our legal system finds someone guilty or not guilty (based on the evidence), it never finds them innocent.

Correct. The burden of proof is on those who present the complaint. Absent evidence, there is no basis for a trial and thus warrants dismissal. That’s the standard. 

[9jNYstarkOH]

Why did they fight to stop the investigations and audits if there was no fraud. The one audit that was done by a third party did show fraud and they fought in court to block it from being released. Some will say that a hand count proved it wrong but the machine prints the hard copy and tabulated the count so I believe the third party audit of the machines and think that is why other states and counties fought further audits. At this point what is done is done and will be done again if we do not fix the system. Why is dominion suing Powell but not the audit company for defamation?

copy of 23 page audit 

https://www.depernolaw.com/uploads/2/7/0/2/27029178/antrim_michigan_forensics_report_[121320]_v2_[redacted].pdf

Edited January 12, 2021 by 9jNYstarkOH

[Eric J]

What should have been done was an Audit... not a recount... an Audit.... WHY? Because an audit has people checking things like signatures.... how do we know if one person signed a thousand different signatures on those mail in ballots? Or that 100 people were hired to each sign a thousand ballots?

[left field]

33 minutes ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

2- ‘Just because there was no evidence of fraud doesn’t mean there wasn’t fraud.’ You thinking this makes any sense at all? What’s the standard then?

It borders on the "while I have no evidence that you sleep with donkeys that doesn't mean that you don't sleep with donkeys." 

[Versatile_Hunter]

7 minutes ago, left field said:

It borders on the "while I have no evidence that you sleep with donkeys that doesn't mean that you don't sleep with donkeys." 

Typically followed by “you’ll see, the truth will come out.” That’s the current level of discourse. Let’s keep Her great!

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, left field said:

It borders on the "while I have no evidence that you sleep with donkeys that doesn't mean that you don't sleep with donkeys." 

Hardly , if that were the case , I would say that your bullshit detector needs to be fine tuned lol. 

In all candor , It all depends upon the assertion or claim being made . 
If I made a claim to you that I ran 140 miles in 1 day , would you believe me? 
 

 to be fair to me , you could fact check my claim , research it to see if it was theoretical possible to do so . Dividing 140 by the # of hours In a day , one would find that the average rate of speed someone would need to run in order to achieve that would be 5.83 mph . The average human male in  Pretty good shape shape runs about 5.9 mph . And it is possible to stay up for 24 hours straight if one wants too and crashes right after . So , although it is theoretical possible for me to do so , would you believe me ? 
 

I think the same thing applies with your analogy . Election fraud happening last time around is a hell of a lot more believable a claim Than an accusation that someone sleeps with donkeys. Election fraud has been alleged , not only in this past election , but in 2016 ( isn’t that what the Russia collusion hoax was all about? ) , 2004 , and 2000 and perhaps more idk. 
And it was alleged BY BOTH SIDES
So , I’m not sure why it’s so hard for you to entertain the notion that fraud MAY have existed in the past election 

In terms of someone sleeping with donkeys ? Never heard of anyone being accused of that . I don’t know of anyone who’s ever Accused someone else of doing that , or, doing it themselves or , of it being a reported issue that was becoming a problem and people were engaging in said practice . Does that mean that nobody Ever has or ever will . Guess not 

But Would I believe such an accusation or claim? Not at all , because my bullshit detector is fully operational !! Lol 

 

[left field]

How many miles could you run in a day if you were riding a donkey?

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

1 hour ago, left field said:

It borders on the "while I have no evidence that you sleep with donkeys that doesn't mean that you don't sleep with donkeys." 

Agreed, but if you "package" smells like a donkey, it may be worth an investigation.